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Ellis as a Flex Tackle?

I was reading K.C. Joyner's section on the New England defense in his excellent "Scientific Football 2005," which I highly recommend, when I came across a passage that put the whole Parcells/Greg Ellis feud in a new perspective.

Joyner details the evolution of the 3-4 scheme from the Dolphins of the '70s through the Pats of the early '00s. According to Joyner the third major evolution, after the Parcells/Belichick Giants redefined the rush LB with Lawrence Taylor, came in the '90s when Steelers' DC Dick LeBeau redefined the roles of the 3-4 linemen. The Steelers had several undersized DL then and LeBeau adapted by using all of them, including his nose tackles, as cover men in the short zones. This made his pass rushes much harder to predict.

When Ellis' role in a 3-4 is considered the media and most of us on this site ponder how Ellis would function in a "pure" 3-4, where the front seven plays in static positions -- the tackles head up on the offensive tackles and the nose tackle over the center. Ellis' light weight of 271 lbs. is considered a liability in this formation. Joyner points out that the more effective 3-4s work because they avoid being this predictable. He is seconded by the writers at Pro Football Weekly's 2005 Annual, who note that most 3-4s these days are either "under" or "over" schemes, where the linemen "cheat" or line up over guards or in gaps. Almost nobody plays the plain vanilla 3-4 that Parcells' Giants used so effectively with Taylor and Carl Banks 20 years ago.

Ellis has already proven he can play inside in a 4-3. Dallas has been using him as a tackle on rushing downs for years. Given his intelligence and adaptibility, not to mention the adaptibility of the 3-4 as a scheme, perhaps Ellis should not see himself as the square peg in the round hole.

Star-divide

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Good point- staying unpredictable is virtually a must on offense or defense these days- the real talent edge between most teams is small enough so that if you do become easy to figure out, you are in BIG touble. Ellis is a very good player- there should be more then enough oppurtunities to make use of his talent.

by Burmafrd on Jul 23, 2005 6:32 AM CDT reply actions  

I sure hope this is what Parcells has in mind for Ellis. That would be great for him, and since he’s only going to be playing 60% of the time, he can afford to give teams different looks while he’s out there. I agree that Ellis is a very good player. He’s also a proven and consistent player, which we haven’t had a lot of lately. We haven’t seen the pups play a down yet. For now, we need to keep Ellis as happy as we can.

by Rob2 on Jul 23, 2005 6:55 AM CDT reply actions  

My concern on Eliis dropping into short zones would be his speed. I still see the best use of GE as strongside DE in our 4-3 sets.

by James on Jul 23, 2005 8:31 AM CDT reply actions  

This makes me feel alot happier knowing that Gregs size isnt that big of a deal. I had figured that BP had something up his sleeve i just couldnt figure it out. Its funnie tho that it took this long for this to come out because to my understanding the 3-4 needed huge DE at least KC knew what he is talking about.

by Geno on Jul 23, 2005 8:47 AM CDT reply actions  

I have not been as concerned as others about this. I think Ellis can play a DE in the 3 man front for 60% of the plays. I also think he can be effective in that role. However, I am not surprised to see this. Again these comments about Ellis speed are overdone……….how many 290lb guys are faster than Greg Ellis? If that is the size player Belicheck and Lebeau have favored?

Dallas will do fine, I think learning and implementing the 3-4 and still playing a LOT OF 4 man fronts as well. Personally I kind of like the idea of Ellis, Ferguson, Glover, and Spears in a 4 man set with WARE as the OLB in the 3 LB set………..now you got some muscle up front and a speedy LB that can blitz and move around………oh la la. I know if I was Zimmer I would be putting that formation on the field a few times to see how it did.

Bring on Camp…..Bring on Preseason……Bring on Regular Season………HEY bring on McNabb and TO……..let’s go Cowboys!!!! Enough with the Chit Chat let’s kickoff and HIT SOMETHING……….put me in Coach. I am ready!!!!

by Jon on Jul 23, 2005 10:11 AM CDT reply actions  

Jon,

It’s not only Ware who could move up and down the line, but Glover and Ellis as well. Ferguson is the only guy who might be rooted to an area, but even he could play head up or flexed over the center or over the guards. The better the flexibility of everyone the harder to scheme against this defense.

by Rafael Vela on Jul 23, 2005 10:26 AM CDT reply actions  

I saw something not to long ago that gave the same kudos to Dick Lebeau for being the creator of the modern day 3-4 or what they called the Zone Blitz.

by Cash on Jul 23, 2005 11:23 AM CDT reply actions  

Well, out of this I do get something, if Zimmer gets through all this as a successfull Defensive Coordinator he’s the one that’s going to take Parcells throne. Let’s hope he makes it….

by Chandus on Jul 23, 2005 12:53 PM CDT reply actions  

rafael,

Yeah, I have long been a proponent of Glover as DE and NT in the 3 man or 4 man front.

While others are calling for trades of these two anchors, I think they are both about to enjoy one of their better seasons.

Ware and Spears were the two guys that really give them more flexibility with their defense. Adding Canty and Ratliff and Burnett should help also.

I think Burnett can pack on a little bit of meat if he wants…..he has some height. He can bulk up a bit. At any rate I think our D will be much improved, and am very happy with the additions of Glenn, Henry, and Reese to the secondary. T New comes back we are going to be hard to throw on, and hopefully with Ferguson up there hard to run on too!!!!

by Jon on Jul 23, 2005 1:07 PM CDT reply actions  

Rafael,

LeBeau also used his undersized linemen as LBs. Levon Kirkland made the pro bowl twice as middle linebacker. At 6-1 and 275 lbs, he was slower than Ellis, and I would say Ellis is a better “football player”. … I have been suggesting that Dallas may try him in different rolls in the 3-4 to see where he fits in best, possibly OLB. I would love to see a 3-4 line up that includes Ellis, Glover, Ferguson, Spears, and Ware .. the only way to accomplish this would be playing Ellis at one of the LB positions. Having Ellis back a few yards would cause that “unpredictability”. Offensive linemen will always have to account for where Ellis and Ware line up. .. By the way, Ellis dropped back in pass coverage in North Carolina’s scheme.

by Eric Richard on Jul 23, 2005 6:05 PM CDT reply actions  

I think that Ellis will be fine when he see’s we are going to run alot 4-3 too. He knows our D-Line in the 4-3 is going to be sick: Ellis, Fergunson, Ware, Spears. Not too many teams can contain that for 2 Q. (I think that we will run each 50/50). If Ellis plays all of the 4-3 and just 25% in the 3-4, he will be playing 62% of the time. Just what Parcells wants. When it comes to the end of the game, watch for us to run the 4-3 to have Glover and Ellis on the field. I hope he bonds with Spears, Canty, Ware, and the rest of them to show them how quickness can get you to the QB, not just size and strength.

by Lou on Jul 23, 2005 6:57 PM CDT reply actions  

If anyone is interested here is the Cowboys player ratings for Madden 2006. The ratings are usually bad, but there are alot of suprises:

http://sports.ign.com/madden06/cowboys.html

Jason Witten- 92- He could be a few points higher.
Aaron Glenn- 90?? Henry is a 86.
Al Johnson- 76?

And Shanle is our lowest rated guy, a 53, yet he was working with the 1st team in May’s mini camp. Kind of makes you think.

by Lou on Jul 23, 2005 8:35 PM CDT reply actions  

Yeah, i’ve been looking over the roster for Madden for a week now. Its always a little disappointing for 6-10 teams. I was a little annoyed that willie blade and hunter are still on the roster but as soon as it is released august 9th. You can login online and get an updated roster, I am hoping then that some more of the rookies will be on there.

I thought Barber’s ratings could’ve been a little higher. Ware should either have more speed or acc, but I’m pretty happy with them overall, should still be enough for me to when our annual madden bowl within my circle of friends

go cowboys!!!!

by Danimal on Jul 24, 2005 1:21 AM CDT reply actions  

Yeah I think Johnson should have been higher, and there’s no Canty on the roster so that dissapointed me a little. I didn’t think Petiti or Ratliff would make it, but if they did they would probably be in the low 60’s. If you go by the depth chart on Madden, our starters have an average rating of 85. We have Parcells and Sean Payton, so our cordinators are fine. Yet our offense ranks a 72 rating. Hopefully when everything is updated we can get a little more respect, but I have to say it is better then previous years.

by Lou on Jul 24, 2005 11:39 AM CDT reply actions  

im pissed that we are ranked so low over all, its like nobody paid attention to what we did this offseason, how the hell is wash. ranked higher than us?

by jess on Jul 24, 2005 11:49 AM CDT reply actions  

uh, i’m new but i was so upset that i had to put this out, i was comparing Ware with Merriman and Ware was rank 81 overall and Merriman was ranked 82

by david on Jul 24, 2005 9:23 PM CDT reply actions  

david.. thats true too, and where the hell are all our rookies in madden this really is upseting , i was looking forward to have canty and ratliff

by jess on Jul 24, 2005 10:49 PM CDT reply actions  

David,

Don’t worry about it. Neither guy has played a down yet, and unless something changes, Ware will be playing while Merriman is still holding out. That should change the rankings. The chargers just started negotiations with him. I figure they’ll give him what he want’s eventually, but who knows how much time he’ll be out before that happens.

by Rob2 on Jul 25, 2005 6:21 AM CDT reply actions  

Here’s the latest on Merriman

Merriman watch

Merriman will be the consuming story until he arrives – and even thereafter, until he actually shows what he can do.
He was drafted with the idea he would play outside linebacker opposite Steve Foley and chase down the quarterback and other ballcarriers with abandon.

Now, thanks largely to his not appearing at any of the team’s offseason workouts due to concerns over being injured before signing a contract, Merriman might not be such a major contributor early on.

“If and/or when we reach agreement with Merriman, I’m not sure what kind of opportunity he’s going to have,” coach Marty Schottenheimer said. “He’s going to have to make a statement because of the fact he hasn’t been here . . . Shawne has excellent skills to be a pass rusher. As I look at it, whatever we can get out of Shawne Merriman will be nothing but a bonus.”

Schottenheimer has also alluded to the possibility that Merriman, who played a hybrid linebacker-end position at the University of Maryland, will begin his time in the NFL playing defensive end should he not arrive early enough to grasp the nuances of the strong-side linebacker position.

Thing is, Merriman said this week he is down to 266 pounds and joked he is “running like a receiver” in preparation for playing linebacker.

by Rob2 on Jul 25, 2005 6:24 AM CDT reply actions  

Canty, Spears, Ware and Burnett were all off the CHARTS on NCAA Football. Canty I think had the highest ratings. Of course that was before his knee injury and bottle to the eye. At any rate ERTS makes both Madden and NCAA. Wonder why he did not even get on the team……..nor did ratliff. Maybe the update will help.

Way back in the day, on Nintendo Emmit ws unstoppable. Emmit right and Emmit left beat any other team. Well that was true on the field too, let the Cowboys get back to the BOWL and Madden will up our ratings. I bet NE has high ratings.

by Jon on Jul 25, 2005 10:23 AM CDT reply actions  

Yeah,

you guys have all good points that I echo, Johnsons rating was very underatted he should be at least an 80 overall. Also I’m disappointed with Wares speed truly am, they rate D.J. faster than him, which if I’m not mistaken Cedd Benson ran a 4.55 and Ware a 4.51 I like his ACC which is a 90 + something but when other DE’s are 87 and Benson has 89 speed I think Ware should be up there as well he should at least be the fastest Defensive rookie which would put him up at D.J.s 88 speed. I ‘ll just have to wait for him to blow things up this year and next year they’ll be more respectfull in their ratings.

I’m also dissappointed that Hunter and Blade where there instead of Canty Ratliff or Pettiti or one or both of the thortons.

like I said earlier however that will be updated with the online rosters I’m certain. so I can’t wait to get my copy august 9th, login and pull down the updated rosters and see who’s there and what has changed.

I agree with J.J.‘s rankings should have more agility though, I honestly haven’t seen anyone in the league with as much shiftiness as he has.

also thought Marion Barbers ratings were a little low, they rated him like a fourth round pick and not a 2nd rounder who fell to the fourth,

oh well…

Go Boys

by Danimal on Jul 25, 2005 11:41 AM CDT reply actions  

oh yeah,

about Merriman,

initially when we took Ware I was a little confused as to why we didn’t grab Merriman, now I couldn’t be happier, what a punk, I’m glad we did things the way we did. When we face the Chargers I think Ware will have found his way onto the field and will be making an impact meanwhile, who knows if merriman will be signed and making any difference at that point.

I’m ready for us to take them down, what a huge game very early in the season.

that would really get us rolling beating a respectable AFC team to start the year.

go boys!!!

by Danimal on Jul 25, 2005 11:43 AM CDT reply actions  

Why is everybody so down on Merriman?? The Chargers always sign their first round picks late.

by AW on Jul 25, 2005 12:41 PM CDT reply actions  

This weekend a special Cowboys Report was on a local tv chanel and J.J. was disscussing the Merriman situation. He said that they did not plan on Ware being there at 11 but the word was out that Merriman was going to sign with the Postons. (although he did not metion their names, he said “they” are difficult to work with) They also said that Merriman has not been “on campus” since the draft press confrence.

by randall on Jul 25, 2005 1:10 PM CDT reply actions  

Anybody that watched an ACC football game saw Heath Miller a Tight End drive Merriman and put him on his but. From what I know of Heath Miller he is more of a Witten than a Dan Campbell……..known for his Pass Catching……..and probably a great NFL Player……..but to drive the number one DE taken into the Draft into the ground like that…………well I think that clip of Miller made Merriman’s stock drop. If the SD Chargers knew the guy was signing with Poston would they have taken him. I mean how long did they hold out Winslow?

Also……..I think the Boys were all along after Ware and used Merriman as a ploy to draw off the competition in the draft. I mean if word was out that Parcells was going after Ware and thought as he described him……..reminded him of Lawrence Taylor……….do we think Ware would not have been picked up before 11? The amazing thing about the draft is that Spears was still there at 20. That is a 2 for 2 in the first round that Dallas Needed…….and got.

Bring on Camp………..back you backs Rafael. And give us some updates………tell us what Ware, Spears, Burnett, Ratliff and Bierault are upto at camp. How many waters will Ware have to carry for Bill? Does the rookie running backs look as good as JJ. How about Canty is out there yet? How about those Bill Parcells press conferences? See if old Bill will recognize Rafael for a question or two…….LOL……..be careful what you wish for.

Do our WR look that slow? Or are the young guns about to step up? Does Bledsoe look sharp……..how about Henson and Romo? I am sure they are all going to get a lot of snaps. No reason to wear Bledsoe out in Camp or Preseason.

Man……..I am ready for some FOOTBALL.

by Jon on Jul 25, 2005 2:18 PM CDT reply actions  

I never saw anything come out of the Cowboy’s camp that didn’t point to Ware as the first pick. The only people I saw penciling in Ware were the mediots as you guys like to call them. 1 Day before the draft I got an email from an inside source that said Ware and Spears in some order. I had not heard of them thinking he may not be there although I had heard that the Texans and Falcons thought about trading up to get him.

by Cash on Jul 25, 2005 4:11 PM CDT reply actions  

I just heard that alex smith of san fran signed a 6 year 50 mil with a 24 mil signing bonus.holycow thats the most ever. but now that he finally signed so should all the other first rounders start to . expecially demarcus and marcus. can you all smell that… smells like football season coming hard and fast. GO DALLAS…AMERICAS TEAM BABY # 1

by jess on Jul 25, 2005 6:09 PM CDT reply actions  

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