Juniors Want to Make a Mint

Vince Young still needs alot of polish on his passing skills. He would need to go to the right team that would have the right coach to teach him what he needs to learn and be patient with him.

If he wants the money, he should come out this year,his stock would not be higher next year if he stays, I think that Brady Quinn of Notre Dame would be the early favorite for the Heisman, not that it means much. Vince Young needs alot of work, his mechanics are horrible, he pushes the ball,his receivers bailed him out alot last night, rarely hitting his recievers in stride, alot of diving to make the catches. I would like to see him as a receiver where I think he could be better than randy Moss, he is a very deceptive runner,hard to bring down.

Derrick,

I agree with you, but I have to say, VY looked alot better last night than I’ve ever seen him. He did hit a couple of covered WR and his receivers didn’t have to dive as much as usual. He also only made one of his trademark stupid decisions to just throw the ball up; the one where he threw the ball up in the air, across his body, to the other side of the field.

On the Heisman, VY will be the front-runner and will have to do a bunch wrong not to win it. If you notice, the guy who gets “cheated” out of the Heisman always wins it the next year. VY was that guy this season. His Rose Bowl performance will also go along way with next years voters. I really don’t see how he doesn’t win the Heisman if he stays in school, which, coincidentally, I think he really needs if he wants to be a successful QB in the NFL.

If he makes the kinds of strides this offseason that he made between his sophomore and junior years, I think he would be that rare talent that could be worth the arm and leg it would take to trade up to nab him.

Vince Young looked so great, and the buzz about him is so great due to the magnitude of the stage afforded him, and in the horrible discipline and fundamentals of what must be an overrated unit, the USC defense. Arm tackles? Lowering their heads and missing tackles? Leaving lanes and allowing cutback after cutback? Um, that garbage won’t fly in the NFL, and pro players won’t ever let him look like he looked last night. However, once he gets out into the field, he’ll be impressive.
He has mechanical problems, his feet were rarely set when there was time to set them, and his accuracy wasn’t impressive, because his guys were open deep a lot.
No way Houston bails on David Carr in favor of this kid, a great talent though he certainly is. They drop back and stack up draft picks.
I think Carr is easily the equal of a Carson Palmer, perhaps one day Tom Brady. he’s aikman without the poise, but he’s still a kid.
Also, Vince Young is totally useless behind a bad offensive line. He WILL get hurt. Think Vince Young can get wide on Richard Seymour or Julius Peppers? or even Kearse, Uminiyora, Ware or Arrington?
He’ll go to San Diego to sit behind Philip Rivers.

I hope Young goes to the NFL for a LOT of reasons, but mainly becauase it will set off a ripple effect through the rest of the draft board. With the Cowboys picking at 18, they may have a chance to pick a better player than they had anticipated last week fall to them because of a top heavy board filled with skill position and underclassmen players.

Some will make it, some will be busts or injury-plagued, but the Cowboys will benefit by not being sucked into picking the glamour player and being able to pick a better position player than they would have otherwise gotten a crack at. Also, a few of those teams ahead of the Cowboys on the draft board are known to reach and make huge franchise-busting blunders. Hopefully the right guy will fall to 18 and we will all be happy for Vince Young putting on the show he did last night.

BTW – My fearless prediction is that DeAngelo Williams from Memphis will turn out to be the best NFL RB out of this draft class. Matt Leinart will be holding a clipboard and wearing a cap on the sidelines in his 3rd year, Heisman jinx. I bet a LOT of NFL DL’s are licking their chops at the thought of putting the hurt on Leinart behind a weak OL on a high drafting team. How many tough defenses did he face in his college career?

polish on his passing…..he seemed to hit his TE, WRs and RBs just fine. He has a strange motion, but then he ran like Randy Moss. A long gait that decieves you into thinking he ain’t bookin……when he is.

This kid just showed potentially 30 or more future NFLers………counting freshman and sophomores……..who the best player on the field is. I saw three guys do it in high school…….Allen Iverson, Michael Vick and Ronal Curry. One of em is playing QB in the NFL……the other two are professional atheletes. But they did it against good high school programs…….he did it against he undisputed number one of the last three years.

He should go pro and Houston is dumb if they don’t capitalize on that one. You make all your money on the local gate as an owner.

Jon,

Yes, he needs to get :polish on his passes." Last night was the best I’ve seen him throw all year, but did you see how many plays his recievers still had to make on the ball? Not to mention the fact that he never really threw the ball down the field.

VY has gotten a ton better at identifying the open WR, which there are a ton of with all that talent on their team, but he hasn’t learned how to throw precise passes. Joey was dead on with most of his analysis. VY throws from his shoulder, never sets his feet, and doesn’t play nearly as well against good tackling defenses.

The thing I found the most frightening about VY last night was an interview that Mac Brown gave where he said that VY started playing better when they stopped trying to fix all the stuff that he does wrong. That concerns me. If he can’t learn to fix his problems, he won’t get any better. If he doesn’t get any better, he won’t make a good NFL QB. That also has some bad signs for his being able to learn the WR position.

In all reality, I should be happy about that info on VY. I’m a Texas Tech alum and really would love to see another UT NFL flop.

i saw him toss a TD pass in the season opener at the Horseshoe. Didn’t he beat Michigan last year on this same field in the 4th as well.

I saw him throw a pretty good one to the end zone to number 4 that the kid caught but came down out of bounds. Ben Rothlesberger is the greatest qb ever? He never wins when he throws more than 20 passes….when all he has to do is sit back there and dump it off 12 times they win with Bettis and Parker and Defense! I don’t see a Marino release on anybody in college these days. Vince is a player.

He was 30 for 40…..uh that is 75%…..sit around and complain about his long ball……or his motion all you want. The guy can play and make plays. The reason Matt Leinhart acted coy when asked after the game…..was cuz he knows he just got passed in the DRAFT!!!! Can you say SIGNING BONUS. I have no doubt both will be good. But oh by the way…..LEFTIES have an awkward throwing motion and the ball rotates the wrong way for recievers. Lots of coaches hate lefties. I know of what I speak. So Mr. Quarterback Leinhart has an odd motion also.

Brady Quinn for most of the year looked like a better passer than either one of these. But I still take Young. Reggie Bush tried to pitch to his teammeate like he was still playing in high school, Vince Young made the rest of the Trojan Defense look like they were High School. This from the numero uno school? And Mr. Pete Carrol himself the Defensive Coordinator? So the guy is playing playground and still beating Pete Carrol and the mighty Trojans? Maybe the guy is just that good. A DCs nightmare. Imagine that guy with a team like the Pittsburgh Steelers…..you are telling me he could not do what Big Ben has done…….who oh by the way is just now being given more than 20 plays and is he or isn’t he allowed to audible?

Young just beat an NFL HC and for all instense purposes and NFL stacked team. My bet is he can do it on Sunday’s too!!! Granted he played with a great line and a great defens……but like Joey said…….Vince and Company…..no Cedric Benson or Roy Williams on his side of the ball this season. I saw a good ole slow TE…….and a bunch of backs that might be good one day.

Texas’ D is the closest thing to a pro-style Defence in the NCAA. And they completely shut down Reggie Bush, but could not contain White. Is it just me or is Bush way over-rated, where as White way under-rated. Give me the option and I would take White. I just see him as the next comming of Bettis. I think that should he be still on the board we should look at picking him up. I know we have JJ and MB3 but how often can you get that typ of quality at the 18 spot? Please comment, if he is still on the board should we take him and look at moving one of the 2 other backs?

Jon,

Wow! Here I go again agree with you. Young threw a marvelous ball to his WR (#4) late in the game, but the kid came down out of bounds. Just look at Eli Manning, he has Plaxico and still struggles with that fade throw. Young threw it only where his guy can make a play on it, that is good coaching and great execution if you ask me. All night Young threw away from the defense and many passes were made before his players made cuts. These types of throws are difficult to defend. Even again on the last drive he hit his WR in stride with a defender hot on his WR’s heels. The wide out dragged across the field and got out of bounds, thanks to a precise throw. .. Vince shined on the biggest stage NCAA football has, and I can’t see his stock going any higher than it is now. Still, that said I take Reggie Bush if I am the Texans, or I trade down a few spots and get Ferguson.

Jon,

How old are you? Just wondering, cause your posta aren’t very well thought out.

VY didn’t beat any team by himself, though ast night he had a great individual effort. The pass against Ohio State, not the season opener, was a bad pass that was about to be intercepted if it weren’t for a great play by his WR taking it away from the CB from behind him.

If a WR can’t catch the ball inbounds, it’s a bad throw, not a great one. And who ever said Ben is the best QB ever?

As far as lefties, I played with one in HS. They do not have a bad throwing motion just because they are lefties. The ball does rotate differently, but it doesn’t make it much harder to catch. The only time it really makes a difference is on the deep pass, and you get used to it pretty easily. If anything, it’s a benefit for the O since they get to practise against it and the D doesn’t.

VYs completion % has to do with 2 factors. First is the unbelievable talent they have on their team. The WR make some spectaucular catches on errant throws every game. They can also shake most defenders and find the seams in the zones. Do you not find it odd that the TE and RBs get more catches than the WR? It’s the same problem that has plagues Vick his whole career. He can’t throw the ball downfield to a semi-covered WR.

I don’t even understand your ramblings about Bush and Carroll.

Oh ya, BTW, the USC defense is nowhere near NFL calibre. I doubt there’s even one player on that D that ends up being a top NFL player, and I don’t see more than maybe 2 or 3 that get much PT in the NFL. Texas Tech had a higher rated D than USC.

Matt,

UT didn’t shut down Reggie, here are the stats.

Bush- rushing- 13-82
      receiving- 6-95

White- rushing 20-124
       receiving 0-0

Bush averaged 6.3 YPR and 15.8 YPC versus White’s 6.2 YPR and 0 catches. White will be a good goal-line back, but he won’t beat Bush in the NFL. I almost would like to see White as a fullback.

Vince Young at wide receiver? Please!!! Has he ever playet at that position? Can he catch. Does he have good hands? I don’t know what Vince Young is in the NFL. I do know that I have never seen a more exciting offensive player in all my years of watching college football. I watched last year’s Rose Bowl and agreed with the commentator then who opined that it looks like he is from another planet.

I think that Vince Young should come back to Texas next year. He would be the overwhelming favorite to win the Heismann. Maybe the Longhorns could throw some of that BCS money at Sean Payton to teach this kid how to throw the football - not! Look what happened with Drew Henson.

If I were a GM or head coach in the NFL, I don’t know what I would do with Vince Young right now.

Oh, by the way, my bet is that that great USC alum Jacob Rogers will wind up at Oakland and be a perennial Pro Bowler.

Finally, Big Bill, like Randy Galloway said today, S**T or get off the pot. It’s time for us to stop the bleeding and get ready for next season.

EricR,

Did we see the same game? VY did make a couple of nice throws, but most either took hiw receivers to the ground or took them off their routes. The pass the you refer to on the last drive was over the middle, and was the best pass I’ve seen him throw all year. I never saw a single throw to a WR, or RB or TE for that matter, that he threw before the break. He had a ton of time in the pocket and waited till his receivers cleared. Those are not NFL throws. If you can, watch the tape again and let me know if you still see it, but I don’t recall more than a couple of times that he even threw the ball withing the first couple of seconds (ie before reveivers make their breaks).

altercall,

During the last drive he hit his WR on a quick slant (an “NFL throw”). The drag across the middle, he hit his receiver in stride (an “NFL throw”). In the back of the endzone to #4 was a perfect throw, because only one player could have caught it .. his WR (an “NFL throw”). Earlier in the game on 3rd down he hit his TE. The TE slipped and fell during his cut, but because Vince threw it to the proper spot, the TE made a wonderful grab (an “NFL throw”). .. Sorry you don’t hit 75% of your passes by accident! Vince has hit 65% all year, and you don’t do that by mistake either. .. Funny Jay Cutler the guy who people here say we should draft with our 1st round choice is about 60. Vince as I said hit 65 all year, plays in a much better conference, and won the National Championship, plus he can run. But he is not “NFL ready”? Go figure?

altercall,

Vince was #3 in the country in passer efficiency all year long. He led his team to an impressive win last year, and now a National Championship this year. He passes for 250+ yards a game, something Michael Vick never did! You don’t have to look to long to see that they are different calibre players.

eric r.everyone makes a big deal this time of the year about quaterback potential in the draft.80%of vince young’s passes were side arm throws.good performance but let’s not jump the gun.michael vick is just an athlete. when mike vick can throw for 300 yards on a consistent basis i will put him up there with the bradys of the nfl.right now he’s just an average quaterback with no pocket presence.

altercall. i see another quincy carter in vince young.even with the time he had didn’t impress me with his throwing.i think them winning the game made it look more impressive.overrated!!

leinart’s arm is a huge ?

Random thoughts on the draft i think the
cowboys will probably trade down and try
to pick up more choices.I had thought they might try to move up by offering
Glover or ellis but with all the turnover in coaches I think that is unlikley…don’t see them real active
in the FA market…just some thoughts.

I don’t see Vince Young being a Quincy Carter. Hes better right now in every category, except maybe arm strength, than Quincy ever was. I’m not a fan of either teams, and I hate the hype that they give him. Before last night, the Texans were crazy not to draft Bush and the entire city of Houston will rebel if they dont pick Bush. Now its Vince, and if they dont draft Vince they’re crazy. Come on, I hate that hype, I wish these so called analysts would start doing their jobs and stop flip flopping.

If Vince Young comes out and goes #1 to the Texans, we could actually see the next 3 picks come from one school. Bush goes #2 to the Saints OR a team that trades up, Norm Chow takes Leinhart, and the Jets (this HAS been talked about on the radio) take Lendale White.

If I’m BP, I trade down unless certain players are on the board.

I think the top 7 draft picks go like this, with the trades and Young declaring, and Quinn returing:

1. Houston: Vince Young
2. Jets: Reggie Bush
3. Titans: Matt Leinhart
4. Saints: A.J Hawk
5. GB: D’Brickashaw Fergunson
6. SF: Haloti Ngata
7. OAK: Jimmy Williams

quincy carter threw much more than he ran in college and in the pros. He was shifty but never a rusher like Young or Vick. Carter had nice touch on long balls and then could not throw a screen or slant. He could scramble but not like Vick or Young. I wish him well, but Vince Young and Quincy Carter’s style of play is not even remotely similar. Besides it was Quincy’s off the field problems that ended his career……..despite his on the field problems he became our starting qb.

I think the gate draw at Houston has more to do with it than his talent. Vick puts people in the fans……..regardless of what you think of him as a qb. I understand why, watching Julius Jones run for 194 yards and break a few long ones in Carolina was very enteraining……even from the nosebleeds……..fans love that.

Young will win games and put people in the stands. How many of us went to Dallas to see Carter? I think I recall some empty seats.

Running Qbs don’t have a long life in the NFL.The players are too big and fast
Look at the injuries to guys like vick,
mcnair,culpepper etc.I don’t know if Young is a lock for the Texans. Carr isn’t awful he just needs to get a chance to stay off his back.

EricR,

Yes, that slant was an NFL throw, and I said it was the best throw I’ve seen him make all season.

The 5 yard drag route is not an “NFL throw”. It is a route that is run in the NFL, but I can make that pass.

The pass to David Thomas was a bad throw. The reason Thomas slipped was that he was sitting down in the zone. The ball was throw to the wrong spot and he had to make a heck of a catch. If he had been continuing the route, the ball would have been WAAAY behind him.

When the ball is thrown out of the endzone, it is a bad throw. He has to keep it in bounds. I don’t remember the specific play so I cannot comment any further on it.

When you have as much talent as VY has on that team, you get to sit in the pocket as long as you want, you can take the ball down and run when you want, and you throw half your passed to TEs and RBs, it is hard to complete 65% of your passes. Heck, Cody Hodges completed 67% of his passes, is he ready for the NFL?

As for Quincy Starter, I don’t think VY would be that bad, or that dumb. I mean, the guy didn’t notice that an NFL football was a different size than a college football until after his 8th game. I’ve heard rumors that VY is a little intellectually challenged, but I’ll reserve judgement until I see enough of him for myself.

Good point Becker. VY wan’t hit hard at all this season, but he was fighting injury at 2 points in the season, if I remember right. I know it was pretty serious at one point at least. He does have a pretty lean frame.

Vince Young is 6-5, 233. Mike Vick is 6-0, 213. Vick is run first, Young isn’t. Theres no sense in comparing the two. Young is a better passer right now than Vick is. Anyone who watched the both play knows that.

altercall,
Your anti-Texas bias really shows. The guy just had a great year, led an undefeated team, and beat a great USC team. He has a ton of potential, hes probably overhyped right, but you have to admit that hes good. Next year would you rather have David Carr under center or Vince Young?

There’s no doubt that Vince Young is a great college QB. I have no clue how good he will be in the NFL because the game is so much faster and the players are so much bigger at that level.

What I find interesting is that no one has mentioned how OVERRATED USC’s defense was all year. If not for all those studs on offense (including the O-Line) that team would be lucky to even make a bowl game of any kind.

USC was way overdue for a loss. They had been dodging bullets and playing a creampuff schedule for most of the last 3 years. If not for that ridiculous pass interference call against Virginia Tech, a few lucky do or die plays and phantom time put on the clock against Notre Dame, not having to play a conference championship like the SEC, Big 12, and ACC do, and OU coming out and playing like girls last year, USC would have never had 34 straight wins.

Their offense is incredible though, no doubt about that.

Guy’s have any of you really watched Vince Young play this year. He has been doing it all year long. Ohio State arguably the best Defense in the College this past year, Vince Young had to go deep to win because there was no no under neath pass and no running lane.
The big 12 got no respect because Texas whooped everybody so bad it made all the other teams look down right horrible but when the bowl games came around look how many big 12 teams won.
Vince Young is the real deal, better than Vick with the same kind of playing style.

altercall,

In 2000, Michael Vick’s senior year, Virginia Tech averaged 156 yards passing per game. Dispite the low # of passes, Vick’s efficiency was 127. There is no comparison to Vince Young this year. Young is 80 yards per game better than Vick, and his efficiency (164) is higher.

Hmmm the drag route is an NFL route. But the throw, which led the receiver perfectly wasn’t??? That is some logic.

Hmmm “the reason (David) Thomas slipped was because he was sitting down in a zone” … “if he had been continuing the route the ball would have been WAAAAY behind him.” Now that makes absolutely no sense. If he were sitting in a zone then there is no route to continue, he wasn’t running!! …. He was though cutting to the inside on a button hook when before he even turned, Young threw the ball low and to his side away from the defender, in other words a perfect throw where only Thomas can make the catch. The defender had no shot at the ball, just like you coach it up. Good coaching and great execution, “an NFL throw”.

Did you ever hear of Joe Montana and “The Catch”? Montana threw the ball to the back side of the end zone, where only his guy can make a play on it. That is what well coached QBs do. Young did it, but his WR didn’t come down with it in bounds .. Montana’s did.

A few thoughts:

Both Bush and White will make excellent NFL players. Bush has tremendous speed, quickness, and versatility. Marshall Faulk clone. He won’t get 25 runs per game, but he will get 25 touches through runs, catches, and returns.

Lendale White most reminds me of Larry Johnson. He will be a load for NFL defenses. Definitely a “workhorse” 25 carry per game guy.

Comparing Cutler and Young’s completion percentages is a bit ridiculous. Young has multiple NFL caliber players around him at both receiver and the line. Cutler has maybe 1. Young played a strong schedule, but the SEC is the tougher conference. But regardless, both players should make fine NFL QBs. Cutler is the more traditional QB and probably more ready. Young will likely require a non-traditional game plan to maximize his value, ala Vick. His mobility is his forte. He has strong intangibles. He obviously was an effective passer at Texas. But the jury has to still be out on his throwing ability in a pro style offense. Same as Vick.

I think a lot of Vince Young’s success in the NFL is going to depend on the coach and OC he ends up with. He is a tremendous raw talent with tons of upside potential and athletic ability. How many guys with raw talent, athletic ability, upside potential, with oustanding college careers have gotten stuck with the wrong coaches and the wrong team and gone nowhere in the NFL? Quite a few over the years. In the right system he will thrive. If he ends up with someone who tries to remake him and turn him into something he isn’t he’s in trouble.

you probably wish Jamal Holloway was our QB over aikman just like your Hero! LOL.

Young will be a good pro.

What do the Texans do with David Carr then? It doesn’t matter where Vince Young is from, in the long run, a winning team with exciting players puts people in the seats. Reggie Bush is pretty fun to watch too. Dumping Carr and getting Vince Young is almost akin to dumping JJ and MBIII and starting TT because he’s from Irving.

David Carr or Vince Young is a much harder debate than Domanick Davis or Reggie Bush.

If we can somehow nab White with the 18th pick, I say we nab him, if only to give JJ, MBIII, and TT a little more motivation in training camp…and to trade him.

But the Jets would be wise to get him.

One more thing, I think White has never fumbled either this year or in his entire college career, I think. Impressive.

EricR,

I’m sorry, but you need to put some thought into what you say. Look, Thomas was sitting down on the route, in the middel of a zone, and there was no defender near him. VY didn’t have to worry about throwing away from a defender because there was nobody near Thomas, thus why he was sitting on the route. IF, and I said IF, not that he was going to, Thomas HAD kept running, as you said he was doing, the ball would have been a couple of yards behind Thomas.

A 5 yard drag route is not a route that coaches and scoutes judge QBs on. Why? Because almost anyone who has ever picked up a football can throw that route. I’m happy for VY that he can throw it, but it means nothing to his being able to play in the NFL!!!!!!

Again, I don’t remeber seeing the play that you’re talking about, especially with that explaination. I can almost guarantee you that it wasn’t like The Catch. Montana had Ed Too Tall Jones in his face and threw a strike right to Dwight Clark. VY tends to loft all those balls and his WR have to go up and make a play. Plus, VY never throws with someone in his face anymore. He threw too many INTs trting to do that.

LouC,

I’m not bashing UT or VY. I think he has AMAZING talent. I just don’t think he has the skill set to be an NFL QB right now. If he goes into the offseason, works on his form, which is really the only reason his passes are bad, and goes back fr his senior year, I would change my tune. I don’t see that happening, though. As I said earlier, Mac Brown said himself that they aren’t going to try to do anything to improve VYs passing.

If I were hating on UT I would be saying that VY should leave now for the NFL. UT wouldn’t be able to do much nest year with him gone.

Right now, I would rather have Carr. I really do not think VY could survive the OLine we have right now, and I will always think that the 1st responsibility of a QB is to pass the ball. I don’t care what you think, VY ran the ball 155 times and threw it 325. That’s not a QB looking to throw first. On certain plays he does, but not for the majority. That don’t play well in the NFL, you take too many hits.

And yes, I do think Vick is a better passer than VY. If Vick could just learn what pace is on his throws (ie towing the ball with the appropriate force for the throw that he is trying to make) he could be a much more successful QB. VYs problem is his delivery, which is much harder to fix. Plus, as we’ve seen with every running QB to come into the league, it takes at about 3 years for them to stop bolting from the pocket and start the process of playing QB. Heck, even Vick started that process this year.

Sterling,

I did address USCs defense, but it might have been in another thread. USCs D was rated below my beloved Red Raiders. Now, we had a much better D this year, but by no means a great one.

As for the Big XII, it was WAAAY down this season. OU was terrible until the last 3 or 4 games. A&M was flat out pitiful until the UT game, and I laughed all season at my Aggie friends who swore they would win the Big XII. Tech was the second best team in the conf, and our QB was scared to make the big play all season. Man, I can only wonder what might have been if Graham Harrell hadn’t broken his leg in Spring Training.

hey blee white fumbled on one of the last plays before texas got the ball, back, usc recovered

altercall,

YOU need to put some thought in to what you say because you make little sense. You said he was “sitting in a zone” then “if he continued the route” … that makes no sense at all!! Now you say that there was no defender around Thomas. Whatever!! … Its easy to sit back and give YOUR interpretation of “an NFL throw” .. obviously no matter what the kid did/does you are going to say “its not an NFL throw”. In the NFL QBs throw slants, fades, button hooks, drags, and plenty of other passes, so obviously they are “NFL throws”. They are judged on how well they throw all of their passes, and Vince Young threw these routes well. Does he throw all of them well? No, probably not. But again a well coached QB will throw balls, like the fade, only where his receivers can make plays on them, and Vince does that pretty good. Considering his completion percentage was 65%, it would seem his receivers made a lot of plays on his throws. VY put them in position to. A QBs job at any level is to manage the game to put your team in situations to win games (Vince was undefeated), and put your teammates in a situation to make plays that defenders can’t defend (his efficiency speaks for itself), He can’t do much more than that!! With all he has accomplished, which is already more than Vick, what do you want from the kid? A 190 passer efficiency rating!! Come on give it a break! .. Again he was #3 in the nation in passing efficiency!! He had very impressive numbers against pro-style defenses!! His team won the National Championship!! .. His resume far exceeds the Jay Cutlers of the NCAA game. And you compare him to Vick, and their numbers aren’t even close. Vick couldn’t win with a BETTER defense than Young’s longhorns, and never put up huge passing numbers like Young. Vick is clearly a product of what he was in college, a running QB. If Vince Young turns out to be a product of what he is in college, then some team at the top of this draft will be very happy if he declares this year! .. I think if you are going to compare Young to a QB, it should be Steve McNair, and he has been quite good.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=145175

Really? I didn’t watch the entire game but ESPN says White has never fumbled. I’ve seen mock drafts putting him as high as #6 or so and one didn’t even have him in the first round!

Young is an incredible talent, who made impressive strides this year. His accuracy was terrible in ‘04, which is why I told somebody on this list back in October that I wasn’t sure he could be an NFL QB. I do now, definitely.

I also think that his move to Houston will be one of convenience. He needs work to be a quality NFL QB, a lot of it. I find it interesting that people are trying to compare him favorably or unfavorably to Vick. Size differences aside, they’ll have the same issues are pros. Can you make them effective as throwing QBs. (And please, let’s not overuse college efficiency ratings, which are not an effective tool, given how much defenses vary from school to school.) Vick has no much talent and can move the ball with it, that he’s yet to take the next step developmentally.

And perhaps here’s the most important factor Young should consider: he had a much better o-line at Texas than he would have for the Texans, who have let David Carr get sacked close to 150 times the last two years.

EricR,

Have you read anything I’ve written? I said the slant pass was an good throw, one of your “NFL throws.” He has thrown other good passes at points this season, but it is not dependable. His receivers have had to make plays, instead of just catching and running. How many times did his WR have to go to the ground to catch balls, or stop their routes to catch them? His RBs and Thomas didn’t have to because he always threw them the ball under 10 yards, an easy throw.

I can’t believe that you can’t understand English, though. Let me try this one more time. Thomas sat on the route because it was a zone read and there was no defender in the immediate area. He slipped when he planted to stop. VY still threw the ball a yard and a half away from him so he had to make a diving catch. There was no defender near him to break up any sort of pass. You claimed that Thomas slipped WHILE running his route and that the ball would have been perfectly placed if he had kapt running. IF Thomas had chosen to keep running the route, which he did not do, but you claim that he did, the ball would have been a couple of yards behind him, as he is not a slow lineman.

I’ve explained everything multiple times now, so I’m through with this. If you can’t understand what I’m saying it’s not my fault, I have made it as elementary as I can. If you think VY is Jim Brown and Dan MArino rapped up in one person htat’s your perogative.

EricR,

You never aswered my question, BTW. How old are you?

altercall,

You are trying so hard to make your arguement stick, but the proof is in Vince Young’s numbers and where he would be selected if he entered the draft. If he can’t make an NFL throw, then why are scouts drueling over him?

The Thomas play was a nice throw. He ran a hook and slipped on his cut, if he hadn’t slipped the ball was right where you would coach a QB to throw it, low and to the outside shoulder of the defender. The defender, which there was one, was to Young’s left of Thomas, and Young threw the ball down and to the right of Thomas. Had he not slipped Thomas makes an easy grab. .. A hook is not a play you hit a receiver in motion with, but the drag and the slant that Young threw very well on the last drive are, and he hit both of those receivers in stride.

How old am I? What does that have anything to do with our arguement? .. Like I said Young could have passed for 400 yards and 3 TDs a game, and you would still be saying the same thing. Your opinion is obviously the minority, as Young will be drafted and selected very high.

I side with the few people who say that Houston should trade down, take D’Brickashaw Ferguson, and garner a few extra picks.

Regardless of how good Bush or Leinart or Young is, they will do nothing until Houston fixes their offensive line. Besides, it’s not as though the Texans have a huge hole at quarterback or running back.

I can well understand the marketing motive behind drafting the local hero, Young. That would certainly put fannies into the seats, and add to the bottom-line profits for the Texans. But, none of that adds wins to the ledger. They don’t need the next Gayle Sayers or the next Randall Cunningham or the even the next Troy Aikman. They need the next Anthony Munoz. They have a chance to get that with Ferguson. They could get him and more, just by trading down two or three slots.

I don’t know how well Young will do as a professional, but I have to chuckle at those who attribute his success to an outstanding Texas receiving corps. It was considered a huge weakness going into the season. Only Dave Thomas (the tight end) and Brian Carter are seniors. [Thomas will probably be taken on the second day. Carter will be lucky to be invited to a camp as a rookie free agent.] There are no significant juniors on the team. Billy Pittman, Limas Sweed and Ramonce Taylor (used extensively early in the season at receiver) are all sophomores. Almost everyone else who played any meaningful time at receiver or tight end is a sophomore or freshman.