Jones: New CBA Could Happen "Immediately."

It seems to me that the reason theyve been using so many two TE sets in the last couple of years has been b/c Dan Campbell has been giving them a better option than whatever spare fullback has been on the roster. Drafting Davis when you already have Witten is like drafting Mike Williams when you already have Roy Williams and Carlos Rogers. It might work, but I would be surprised to see Parcells go with such an unorthodox offense.

It isn’t an unorthodox offense when you see that many teams wanting to have that kind of offense, if that particular offense helps you win games, then go for it. Ask the Patriots when they played the 2-5 against Philly, they never saw that coming.

If Parcells in the end signs Jerald Sowell, then I can definetely see Parcells passing on Davis but taking another TE later on the first day.

It could be interesting to find out if the guys more opposed to drafting another good TE are guys that play Fantasy Football… I think that the percentage is high…

johnnypeewon,

You are right. But is either the FB or Campbell a weapon in his own right? I don’t think so. Witten can block. Davis is also supposed to be a decent blocker, having played FB, TE and H-back at Maryland. And he runs a 4.55, which isn’t far off Michael Irvin’s times.

If Dallas drafted a talented, big WR high, would anybody complain? I don’t think so. But if the best big WR this year happens to line up at TE, why should we distinguish?

Rafael:

Highly enlightening developments, indeed. To my thinking, if Davis is still on the board at #18 that is a no-brainer. Every draft analyst would be calling this the biggest 1st round steal in ages. I’ve watched this guy, and if ever I have seen a player ready to not only play in the NFL, but dominate…it is Vernon Davis.

The fact that all these teams picking after the Cowboys are so fascinated by him and spending so much valuable Combine time talking to him tells me one of two things. One, either they are considering trading up with the 49ers to get him…or two, that they believe he will fall to them for some very odd reason. I believe they are thinking of the former, for a long list of reasons, most notably that the 49ers are known to be interested in trading down for more picks.

That said, the interest of both the Chiefs and the Chargers is the most telling point I believe. This goes to strengthen my previously stated ideas that TWO talented receiving Tight Ends are going to become the trend in the NFL going forward. It worked in the 1970’s when the position first achieved its glamour status, and I believe the cycle is coming back around. Take the Patriots, for instance. They had three very good TE’s, all of whom could catch passes, and who were used interchangeably and equally as receiving options throughout the course of the season. It all gets down to matchups in the NFL, and the WR position has grown too big and has been too glamourized to not attract the attention of defenses and front offices around the league the past few years. As a result, we see a lot of teams that have spent BIG money and some very high draft picks to get that so-called ‘shut-down’ corner to matchup on #1 receivers. The Cowboys themselves have done this with drafting T-New so high.

Now, how many teams have a ‘shut-down’ coverage LB to put on a TE who has the build & size of a TE, but the speed, route running, and pass catching skills of a WR? Virtually zero. Not only that, but if a team runs a 2-TE, I-Formation with a FB in the game too, that not only creates a great run blocking formation that can be used 3 out of 4 downs, but encourages the defense to either put a DB in a terrible blocking match-up against a bigger TE, or even worse have to take their #2 CB and put him on the bench in favor of a bigger DB or a LB who can’t cover as well.

It’s all about matchups…and athletes like Vernon Davis, TOny Gonzalez, Antonio Gates, force defenses into making some very tough choices to defend against them.

I think you meant Charles Rogers.

I’ve said before I would love to see Marcedes Lewis fall to 49, but Davis has alot more potential and would be ready to play right away and bust out. Cowboys fans would be afraid of taking away from Witten. If you asked Witten about putting a guy like Vernon Davis opposite him on the line, I think he would be totally thrilled. Witten wont cry over balls thrown his way, and with Davis stretching the field like a WR Witten will get less attention. Now, the reason I see getting Davis at 18 is because we have Jerry Jones and supposely 15 million to spend this offseason so other holes can be filled.

It is kind of the same situation with Justice, if Fabini or someone else is signed at RT, and then Justice is sitting there at 18, how can you not take him? I say the same goes with Davis, although there are some other options in the draft (Lewis, Fasano early, Wallace, Mix late).

Those teams 12-17 have other holes that need to be fixed now…the Cowboys are actually better than the 9-7 record, and we could draft Davis with the right free agent signings.

Chandus,

Let’s also note that the revised interfernce rules, which don’t allow the LBs to jam TEs up the field has caused an explosion in TE production the last two years.

In other words, TE is the new WR. I think you’re right to predict that one or more teams are going to field 2WR, 2TE sets where both TEs can get up the field and it will be the next evolution in offensive football. It might not be Dallas, but clearly San Diego, K.C. and Washington are thinking about it.

Now put the shoe on the other foot. If Washington got their hands on Davis and paired him with Cooley, with Moss and another decent WR outside, and Portis in the backfield, would you dismiss that offense? I wouldn’t want to face it twice a year.

Rafael:

Yes, your point is very close to mine. This also makes you wonder about how much more effective 3-4 defenses would be in that scenario, given that they can disguise coverages and blitzes better than 4-3 defenses and have different kinds of athletes at the OLB position. This is always how the NFL works. It is a copycat league, with offenses and defenses reacting to each other and staffing their rosters with players to match against known opponents.

How can the Redskins get in the first round? If the Edge and Culpepper cant get 1st round picks for them how can they get one for Patrick Ramsey? I dont see any other trade bait unless they are stupid enough to offer their 2nd and next years 1st (and believe me, they are). If only Dan Synder would just worry about getting his payroll in order before he has to cut his entire team, and less on getting more big name players in FA and in the draft.

lou c.,

I read several articles saying the Dan Snyder met with Vinnie Cerrato and Joe Gibbs after the season to see if there was a way into round one.

I’m with you, I don’t see how it could happen, unless Snyder channeled George Allen and gave up his 2 and ’07’s #1.

But hey, if you’re convinced you can win it all in ‘06, you’ll go all in. Snyder is a gambler.
 
And one more point about an offense with two monster TEs — imagine Dallas with a Davis/Witten pairing and Keyshawn outside. How could you stop this in the red zone?

lou c:

Possibly through lying and skullduggery…if all else fails…they’ll cheat. ;)

Seriously though, the Skins have had a pretty cozy relationship with the Broncos the last few years, making strange deal after stranger deal with them. In the first one (Bailey for Portis), I originally thought the Skins got the better of it, but I’d now have to say the Broncos fared very well too. About equal with a slight edge to the Broncos in my estimation. The one last year really baffled me. I know Campbell was highly regarded, but the Skins did that trade a few days before the draft!! Usually teams at least wait until they know for sure the player is available at the pick they trade for.

My point is, Snyder is a wheeler-dealer, and Shanahan is a riverboat gambler. You never know what either of them will do, except that it will be something a bit crazy. Kind of like JJ was before Parcells got him on the dangle. If Snyder could trade one of his high priced guys to the Broncos to get back into the 1st round…he could try to package another deal with other players and Ramsey to move up. I doubt it…I give it about a 2% chance of happening…but you never know with that crowd.

Remember, Lou C.,

that in ‘04, Denver got Washington’s 2nd rounder in addition to Bailey. Had it been one-for-one, I would have thought it was good for both teams. But Denver got Bailey and Tatum Bell for Portis.

Last year Denver got this year’s #1 for last year’s #1, a #3 (CB Carl Paymah) and a #4 this year.

That’s not much. They should have gotten a #2 out of the deal. Denver gambled that Washington would suck this year and they didn’t.

But you know, it just hit me — YOU’RE EXACTLY RIGHT. If the Redskins want a shot at Davis, they’ll have to get up around 22 (Denver’s first pick and Washington’s old pick) if San Diego and K.C. have it figured right.

If the ‘Skins want a shot at Pope, they’ll probably have to go up to 28 or 29. And who picks 29th? DENVER.

Eureka, could these front offices be talking again?

Here’s the deal though. Denver got burned on the 22nd pick, which they figured would be higher. If Washington wants it back, it will take a king’s ransom. The Broncos want pass rushers and wide receiver help. Washington doesn’t have a stud DE to flip and there’s no way they trade Santana Moss.

I’ll say it again. I know a team that could give Denver a guaranteed productive pass rushing d-lineman, far more certain than any guy rated in the last third of round one….

Wow. Davis could be the answer to who’s our fullback, and he could upgrade the offense considerably. A major change to the O Line – except for an upgrade at RT – wouldn’t be such a burning concern.

Raf,

Its funny that Denver would be looking for pass rushing ends and a WR, same exact thing the Deadskins are looking for.

The problems with Vernon Davis lasting until the Boys pick is

1. St Louis has the best chance of picking him at 11.

2. Since SF won the deal, if the Jets go with D’Brickashaw the 49ers would probably get a phone call from MIA which would let the Dolphins grab Cutler and the 49ers grab Davis.

Leonard Pope is gone to the Bears IMO. If not, then the Panthers with the next pick. Lewis has seemed to fall to the 2nd round, so Denver would need to get 20-22 range if they want Pope. I say they have no shot whatsoever at Davis.

Whoops,

I meant Sterling, not Lou C.

lou c.

that’s okay. I’m not counting on it. It would be hard to pass him up, however, if he were there. If the 49ers do drop down, they’re looking for DB help first and foremost. They have nothing in the secondary, though if they went strictly off the board then Davis would make sense.

joey2zs:

Good point, especially when you consider that AJ’s skills as a pulling guard are constantly being pointed to as one of his few strengths. Put Witten, a TE like Davis (if not the man himself), and guys like Sowell and JJ swinging out on flares and circle routes…and screen like crazy between the hash marks…and thus salting the clock. If nothing else that might help Bledsoe a bit by keeping the blitzing down and the LB’s honest. Not to mention what a great lineup for run blocking. That would open up more one on one coverage on TG for gamebreaking deep bombs late in the game too. Maybe then we wouldn’t have to rely on FG’s so much?

On a side note, but related to what I am saying…I’ve been meaning for weeks now to mention the need for a ‘scatback’ type little utility back. A guy like Dave Meggett was, or like Ron Springs was back in the ole days. Maybe Tyson Thompson is that guy, I hope. He’s got the raw talent, but I haven’t seen him catch many passes or run routes, only return kicks. If not, I’d love to see a guy like Taurean Henderson in the 5th round or so, 4th if we can get back in there. Those little speedsters can really change a game and make a defense worry. I think Brian Westbrook has been the most valuable weapon to the Eagles the past few years in that capacity. It would be nice to have a little pistol like that to pull out like that unexpectedly in addition to the big guys. Nice little gamebreakers. Just a thought I’ve been mulling over lately.

lou c.

that’s okay. I’m not counting on it. It would be hard to pass him up, however, if he were there. If the 49ers do drop down, they’re looking for DB help first and foremost. They have nothing in the secondary, though if they went strictly off the board then Davis would make sense.

Sterling, U of Miami has that ‘scatback’, and he’s a PR/KR as well. His name, however, escapes me.
This past year, two came out. One went to Philly from La Tech, and one went to San Diego from Kansas State. Both are the real deal. well, as far as dave meggett clones go.

A TE that can block and stretch the field with Witten on the field would make the Cowboys’ O more dynamic than Ladanian Tomlinson’s Charger’s offense. Are they gonna run? Are they gonna pass? Makes no difference, the Cowboys have you outthought and outmanned in both instances.

You know, with the more and more I read about needs and talent available the more that I just can’t see St. Louis drafting a TE with their 1st Rounder, if we consider that they have this depth at corner: DeJuan Groce, Ronald Bartell and Corey Ivy, and pick 11th arrives with Jimmy Williams and Antonio Cromartie (which will definetely sky rocket after his combine practice) on the board, I just can’t see this team passing on them… They also need a TE, but there’s depth at TE, there’s not much depth at CB, they could end up with a combination off Williams and Marcedes Lewis/Anthony Fasano and they would have quite an upgrade in both areas.

Raf:

LOL. Yeah, the Redskins and Broncos…what a lovely pair they make. Both hate us, both believe they are better than they really are, and both have complete morons running their personnel decisions. I respect Shanahan as a coach on the field, but he and Snyder have to be among the worst in NFL dealmaking. Maybe that’s why they seem to do a lot of business together? That way no matter how bad the deal is they can always point to how it was worse for the other party…lol.

Also, keep in mind the Broncos are in cap hell as well. How they believe they will sign T.O., I’ll never know. If the Broncos sign T.O., I would definitely look for them to deal one of their 1st rounders somewhere. It’s bad enough to be over the cap, but to think they can sign a relatively expensive FA wide receiver and two 1st rounders with signing bonuses and the rest of their rookie pool/FA’s…forget it.

I’d love to see them part with their 2nd rounder for Glover, but I’m doubtful. The last big trade I recall between the Broncos and Cowboys was Tony Dorsett, and that didn’t work out too well for them. Their fans never let them hear the end of it either. Kinda like when they got Leon Lett, too. To put it mildly, the Cowboys hold a special place in the Broncos’ hearts…one not terribly dissimilar from the one in the blackened hearts of Redskins partisans. Thus, they make a perfect couple. May they both have their dreams dashed simultaneously next season. Not because they both crashed and burned…but because the Cowboys will once again return to that hallowed Super Bowl ground. ;)

joey2zs,

Darren Sproles is the Charger. He’s dangerous.

On a different note, the Broncos are having an impasse with half their starting d-line. NT Gerard Warren has made no progress in negotiations and stands a fair chance of becoming a UFA next week.

Then, DE Trevor Pryce, with his $10M cap number and four sacks last year says he’ll restructure to help the Broncos, but won’t take a pay cut.

They tried to palm him off on Dallas last year for a #1 and ended up keeping him and restructuring his deal.

Now, I’d say he’s a good candidate to be cut.

If a new CBA is worked out, Denver will be desperate for d-line help, especially pass rushers…

Okay, I’ve said it so ofter I won’t repeat it, but the stage is being set…Ah, I will say it. Glover for the 29th pick. They won’t find a better SURE pass rusher in the draft at that spot, and they’ll still have Washington’s pick at 22. Plus he’s better than either Warren or Pryce and will be much cheaper than Pryce.

Chandus,
Regarding Davis, I’m amazed the Lions are looking at him. Three WRs in the past three years and now they might go TE?

Having Mike Martz on staff might enable Matt Millen’s worst tendencies. Can he risk taking another receiver with a #1? That team needs DBs but bad. DEs too.

joey2zs:

The University of Miami ‘scatback’ is Devin Hester, and I have been advocating for him for months now. He can also play nickel DB, as he spent most of his college and high school career at CB. He is an off the charts athlete and a true difference maker on the football field who would have stayed at UM if not for the whole asst. coaching shakeup causing a lot of uncertainty and doubts about the future of the program’s success. I bet he goes to the Ravens in the mid-rounds though. I can’t see Parcells going for too many guys from ‘The U’, generally speaking. The Ravens and Redskins, however, seem to love them.

The guy from K-State you refer to is Darren Sproles…another outstanding little scatback (as I term them) that I thought would go even higher last draft. He did well in KR, and I wonder if playing alongside a guy like LT and picking up on the way he trains and plays if that won’t propel him along to be a FA to watch in about 3 years time. He is quick and elusive, and plays with a lot of heart.

I’d like more of a Ron Springs type guy who could create speed mismatches with LB’s coming out of the backfield in coverage. I think Taurean Henderson would be great for that. Devin Hester would be a true difference maker in every way though…scatback, slot receiver, KR, PR, and nickel split end CB. He can do it all. He even blocked a FG in one of the biggest games of his career!!

Rafael & Chandus:

Keep in mind that the Lions also signed that TE from the Colts recently. I believe it was last year. Even if you consider Vernon Davis a WR and not a TE, they just drafted another WR not too much smaller than Davis in Mike Williams last year. I don’t see any possible way Millen could draft Davis, as good as he is. He’d have to get a police escort home from the airport if he did.

Besides, Mike Martz doesn’t use TE’s in his offense hardly at all anyway. I’m sure Pollard is more than enough for them at that spot.

Rafael and Sterling
We had this discussion several weeks ago and the consenus was he would not fall but if he did grab him in a minute. I belive sterling said this was the play maker on offence we have been looking for and would be disapointed if the cowboys didn’t take him.
I would trade down unless Vernon Davis, Huff, or Jimmy Williams fell to 18.
He reminds me a little bit of a wide receiver version of Hershal Walker.
I believe he would make the most immediate Impact on the Cowboys of anybody in the Draft and thats what you want out of a first rounder.

I believe the best values represented in the second round are at Guard. Thanks again to Eric R as he pointed out Spencer who I had dismissed in favor of Cooledge LT/LG however researching Spencer I found out he is 6-5, weighs 349 lbs and that he moved from NT to OG when petitie left. That means instead of sitting on the bench as a back up to Allan and Rivera he can rotate as a NT he’s bigger than Nagata, Watson and Gilles.
Then in the third we take care of the little things like PUNT RETURNS and scoring on ST and take Hester who is scary on ST and can also play nickleDB. Maybe we could move Aron glenn to FS as Mr. Byrne suggested in his article about law & fabini. (by the way does anyone else think it would take law two years to transition into FS?)
So versitility rules my draft
18th- Vernon Davis TE/FB/WR
49th- Charles Spencer OG/NT
80th- Devin Hester ST/DB/WR

Carpenter would be nice in trade for Glover.

FA- Longwell, Fabini, Sowell and…Bentley, TO, . Bye I gotta go PRAY.