NYG Pass Rush - The Reality
by Incredifan on Nov 9, 2007 6:41 AM CST
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PrintIt's good, but not great. Certainly not phenomenal, like ESPN would have you believe.
Osi is fifth in the league with 8 sacks. That's over eight games. He got 6 of those in one game, against the Eagles with Winston Justice. Looking at the other seven games, he's racked up a whole 2 sacks in that time.
Justin Tuck is really the threat. He's got 7 in eight games. Still, that's less than one per game, but well on pace to get around 15 on the season. That's darn good. It's also the very same total as DeMarcus Ware has. So, really, their best pass rusher is on pace to tie our best pass rusher.
Strahan has like 4 in eight games. Every other game the guy gets a sack. Scary!!
Ellis has 5.5 in several fewer games and only two starts.
If you ask me, I take Ware and Ellis over Osi and Strahan coming off the ends any day of the week.
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You just have to keep Tuck and Mathias
off the field. As long as we still in managable down and distances such as 2nd and 6, 3rd and 5, they will keep their base defense on the field.
Mathias and Tuck come on the field in passing situations, like 2nd and 15 or 3rd and 10. If we keep our penalties in check offensively, Romo and Barber will eat alive their base defense.
If Romo gets sacked
more than 2x I'll be very, very surprised. They are making a whole lot out of a pass rush that is mediocre from what I've seen. Take away that game they had against the Eagles and they drop to the middle of the pack and would put us 4 sacks behind the 3 teams tied for the lead the lead. I guess time will tell. . .
I agree
our line would have to really suck for Romo to be sacked more than 2 times.
Stop
Being homers. There is evidence for the Cowboys O-line being good enough to slow down the Giants pass rush. But O-lines that do not suck have given up sacks to them; they are very good.
I do agree that they are getting a lot of hype in part based on numbers that are skewed from one game, but that doesn't mean you can completely discount their pass rush. They, at the very least, have an average defense. Their pass rush and D-line is above average while their secondary (and linebackers not named Pierce) are below league average.
I do agree with was posted earlier about this game coming down to limiting your 2nd/3rd and longs because if you give this D-line/D-coordinator enough chances, they will get to you.
by GhettoBear04 on Nov 9, 2007 10:11 AM CST up reply actions
I agree, but you didn't read carefully
I didn't say the O line wouldn't give up any sacks, just that they wouldn't give up more than 2, and if they did, they would have had to play very poorly, given Romo's escapability, which is second to none.
Sorry...
You're right, I misread it. I thought that you were saying that they're overall talent level would suck, but you were saying that their performance would suck.
That's not preposterous to say, but I do disagree. The Cowboys have given up 3 sacks in a game twice this year, to Minnesota and Chicago. Even though I feel like the Giants pass rush is being overrated, it's at least on the level of those two teams.
I also think that the Cowboys can give up 3 sacks and win. In fact, if their O-line's final line was something like 3 sacks, 2 hurries, 3 knockdowns, I would be ok with that. Not happy, but I have confidence that Romo can overcome that.
So you actually think Romo is going to get
sacked 3 or more times? You admit yourself their passrush is overrated. Plus we have one of the best pass blocking lines in the league plus Romo is elusive in the pocket and has a quick release.
It has nothing to do with being a homer it has more to do with cutting through all the hype and facing reality.
by Burt D @ Blogging The Boys on Nov 9, 2007 12:51 PM CST up reply actions
i'm not worried about sacks, but...
So much as I'm worried about false start and holding penalties to prevent sacks. Our line has had several games this year where they've put us in and-long situations, and this is particularly death in the red zone, where having 2nd and 12 rather than second and 7 is a huge difference because of the limited room to operate.
Our offense is mercurial, sometimes even within the same game (St. Lous, Chicago). We've only had two games all year in which the offense was consistently good all game (Giants and Philly). Even aside from Buffalo, Romo seems to make one stupid throw per game. So the question is: will that stupid throw turn into a Giants TD, or prevent us from scoring in the RZ? And will we score in the RZ, or get false starts and holding penalties that prevent touchdowns? To me, that's the question in the game.
Penalties
Thats a good point. That stadium is going to be rocking, the O-Line better be locked in.
Oh and I don't know if any of you guys listen to the Ticket in Dallas, but this is a link to a great interview with WP, talking about what it was like the beat the Eagles and preparing for the Giants game. It's nothing major, but he does address how both defenses have improved.
The reality is
it's the best pass rush you have played against this year. You can't even count the Miami game where they played in mud and no pass rusher had any chance of getting near a QB. The Giants will not only come with four, they will come with linebackers, they will come off the corner, they will occasionally come with a safety.
To stop that pass rush, you have to stay out of 3rd and long. Third and short keeps the 4 DE alignment off the field.
This is the biggest -- and possibly best -- O-Line the Giants have faced. I'm anxious to see how it turns out.
-- Ed
Big Blue View
by ETVal @ Blogging The Boys on Nov 9, 2007 10:10 AM CST reply actions
your pass rush is overrated because
Osi really should have only 2 sacks on the year. And you really don't get that much more pressure than our own defense if not less.
Please blitz. I am begging you to blitz cuz Romo will make you pay.
by Burt D @ Blogging The Boys on Nov 9, 2007 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
Umenyiora & Co
Burt, you have to admit Umenyiora is a very, very good pass rusher. The offensive tackle almost always gets help with a back or TE on him. That is why his sack numbers are not there.
Now, I totally agree with your blitz assessment. Please - blitz all the time! Romo & Co will shred that D.
What worries me is that the Giants are (1) a pretty good team, (2) with their backs against the wall when it comes to the division title, and (3) at home. They are going to come into this game all jacked up. Emotion is a huge part of football, and the line of scrimmage is where that is really played out. The one thing Dallas can't do is get behind early.
Dallas is a significantly better team than the Giants. Just look at our offense: our QB is better, our RB's are better, our receivers/TE's are better and our o-line is better. It's a little closer defensively, but the Cowboys defense is still better. Folk and McBriar are the equal of any kicking tandem in the league. On a neutral field we win this game 75% of the time or more. But the deck is stacked against us this week and I expect a close game.
by Cowboy Louie on Nov 9, 2007 4:20 PM CST up reply actions
Really?
The offensive tackle almost always gets help with a back or TE on him. That is why his sack numbers are not there.
Someone should tell Demarcus Ware that, because I don't think he got the message.
And, what about Strahan? They don't block him? Plus Strahan normally lines up on the left end, which is usually across from the RT and TE.
by Burt D @ Blogging The Boys on Nov 9, 2007 4:35 PM CST up reply actions
Disagree
So you do not think Umenyiora is a pro-bowl level player? I implied from your comment that you think Osi is just an average player. I have a ton of respect for Umenyioria. He is a very good player, and a good smart guy who represent his team well. In short, he is the kind of guy I'd love to have on the Cowboys.
And for the record, TE's can line up on both sides, teams can play two te's and backs can chip DE who line up on either the right or the left side. So Umenyioria gets plenty of attention. Umenyiora is the guy on that line that offenses must account for and very often he gets the attention of two guys. He is nearly as good a pass rusher as Ware....and happens to have more sacks this year, unless one takes your math and discount 8 to 2.
As for Strahan, my opinion is that he was an outstanding player in his prime, but the years have taken their toll and he is now just a solid pro.
by Cowboy Louie on Nov 9, 2007 6:41 PM CST up reply actions
My point is Osi is not god and Flo certainly can
handle him on one-on-one matchups no problem. I am not too worried about their pass rush.
by Burt D @ Blogging The Boys on Nov 9, 2007 7:08 PM CST up reply actions
I don't know
The Pats could bring it as well, I say they're definitely in the Giants league in that respect.
It probably...
is the best pass rush we've faced this year. But not by as big a margin as the numbers may indicate. NE's D is pretty good at creating pressure and also has 25 sacks on the year. Chicago has 25 sacks and Philly has 24 sacks this year (including league leader, Trent Cole).
Also, Washington has a pretty good O-line.
For Clarification
Some have apparently not understood my point in this diary.
I'm not saying the Giants suck. I'm not saying they have a below-average pass rush.
I'm saying they're not the phenomenon that sports outlets based on the East Coast are making them out to be. In fact, as has been pointed out, minus their game against the Eagles, they have often looked average.
All the talk on SIRIUS NFL radio today was about how vastly improved the NYG Defense is. That may be so, but it kinda always manages to get left out that the Dallas defense has made the very same sorts of strides, clawing their own way into the top ten. And no one seems to realize that Plaxico had his day against us when we didn't have T-New or Greg Ellis.
Perfect!
I couldn't have said it better. I think they have an above average pass rush, but by no means historic.
Nailed it
Yes, they are a good pass rushing team, but they aren't the Bears or Chargers of last season.
Flo shut down Trent Cole last week and that guy leads the league in sacks. It wouldn't be a stretch to say he can take out Umenyoira.
The Gints looked so dominate against the Iggles in that earlier game, that I think the public has the image of them coming after the QB on every play. That, and the NY media is building up the Gints so they can tear them down when they lose.
by APerfectStar on Nov 10, 2007 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
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