Cowboys to corner market on Roy Williamses?

by WB3forMB3 on Jul 25, 2008 6:34 PM CDT Comment 45 comments

Got this link from the DMN Blog comment section claiming there's a rumor on Dallas sports radio that the Cowboys are shopping Greg Ellis and Anthony Henry to Detroit for disgruntled WR Roy Williams. Didn't here this myself but thought it was an interesting idea. At least it's somewhat more realistic than trading Carp for Roy.

Let's pretend this was an actual possibility. Would you pull the trigger?

I myself don't think I could at this point for one simple reason and that's there's no guarranty AJ is gonna be around all season, though Im crossing my fingers he will be.

Another user-created commentary provided by a BTB reader.

1 recs | Comment 45 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

That seems awefully steep to me

Two starters (granted they both have guys chomping at their spots behind them) seems like a hefty price to pay for a guy that could be had for nothing more than money next summer. Not to mention the fact that, although I think he’s a pretty good receiver, I don’t think of him as an upper echelon receiver in the league. I sure most of you Longhorn homers disagree, but that’s besides the point.

by Mandmeisterx on Jul 25, 2008 6:40 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

That's what it will take.

Not sure I am ready to depend on AJ, he hasn’t been re-instated. Spencer is going to be good, but that would be risky business..

Trade makes sense long term, but short term it is a big time gamble..

"If you see me up in the mountains with a lion, I ain't lyin
don't help me, help the mountain lion"

by Wmillion on Jul 25, 2008 6:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

That was just the host throwing out a trade idea

it was quickly shot down by the other host.

by Deke on Jul 25, 2008 7:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Thus the "Let's pretend..." qualifier

The greatest two yard run ever!

by WB3forMB3 on Jul 25, 2008 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lets pretend Detroit is dumb

and even if thats the case, some fans of the lions think that’s a definite possibility, then if Dallas offered a first and second round draft choice, then I would start to take it seriously. Ellis is nearing mid thirties and Henry, in is early thirties sn’t close to enough to pry Williams out of detroit.,

by Deke on Jul 25, 2008 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

would do that deal in a second

Because there is a good chance both won’t be on this team next year.

Look up... get up...Don't ever, ever give up!!

by Boyzfan94 on Jul 25, 2008 7:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't think the Lions would make that trade

They’d rather have a draft pick, and I’d rather give it to them. Ellis and Henry would be a bigger loss for this team this year than RW would be able to offset.

by grapejoos on Jul 25, 2008 7:50 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm with you joos

This would be a trade for a team that is one or two players away from contending for the Super Bowl. I don’t think Detroit is one of those teams.

Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.

by dunkman on Jul 26, 2008 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’d rather offer a draft pick and Henry to the Cards for Boldin. I’m pretty sure they’ll be “rebuilding” next season. Do they need a CB?

For the Lions, both Ellis and Henry is too steep a price. I say nay.

Championship...believe it!

http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com/league/them_boys

by accidental innuendo on Jul 25, 2008 8:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

i dont like it one bit...

we did have a solid offence last year and i think if we dont go screwing things up well have the top defence in the league….

I don't need a compass to know which way the wind shines....

by hashishkabob on Jul 25, 2008 11:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

No way

We aren’t hurting that bad for receivers to give up two defensive starters.

Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.

by OskieOskie on Jul 25, 2008 11:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

no chance that trade would ever happen.....

nor would I want to give up two valuable pieces of our D for a second tier soon to be free agent receiver.

A true diehard Cowboys fan since 1975.

"If you don’t take him off the field as a coach, he will just about die out there," Jerry Jones said. "That impacted my decision. It’s a Michael Irvin-type work ethic. That’s what we are talking about with Felix Jones."
- Owner/G.M of the Dallas Cowboys , Jerry Jones

by BoyzRback on Jul 26, 2008 8:07 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Right. I think defensive and overall team success hinges

on the pass rush. And Henry gives the team a guy who can cover a TE in nickel situations.

Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.

by dunkman on Jul 26, 2008 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

We have plenty of depth especially at CB

to make that move. Both players are over 30.

Losing Ellis would hurt our depth a bit, but he is going to see decreased playing time with Spencer getting more reps. Henry will see decreased playing time as the season goes on. Both will be gone next season more than likely, so it would be a good trade off for a elite WR.

How can you not do that deal?

Look up... get up...Don't ever, ever give up!!

by Boyzfan94 on Jul 26, 2008 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think you have to have depth at pressure positions

What happens if Ware, Ellis or Spencer goes down? You probably don’t make it through the playoffs. The Giants had middle of the road secondary with a cadillac pass rush and it pulled them through. And if you can get all three on the field?

I can follow your argument for trading Henry, but in truth I’d like to see him stay and play FS at some point.

Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.

by dunkman on Jul 26, 2008 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree on trading Henry too

We THINK we have good cornerback depth. But let’s face it we dont really know yet what we have in Jenkins or Scandrick and Ball and Oglsby aren’t exactly battle tested either. That leaves us with a rusty AJ who’s one speeding ticket away from another suspension. So where’s the depth?

The greatest two yard run ever!

by WB3forMB3 on Jul 26, 2008 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

Until AJ shows that he is a starter and can be relied upon for a full season, we can’t rely on hypothetical CB depth. Henry and Ellis are both very important pieces of this defense, even if AJ and Spencer end up getting more starters’ minutes.

by grapejoos on Jul 26, 2008 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

turn this around

Again, look at this from an approximation of the opposite perspective. Would you give up a premium player – say Jason Witten or Terrance Newman – for two guys who are on the downside of their career (one with two years left at most) and are nice players but not impact players?

Detroit isn’t going to contend this season. They don’t need over-the -hill players. They will want draft choices for Roy Williams, multiple draft choices that are very high.

I would be shocked if Dallas gave up the house to get Roy Williams, Anquan Boldin or Chad Johnson. It will take the kind of king’s ransom Minnesota gave up to get Jared Allen. We don’t need to mortgage the future to get to the Super Bowl this season. The current roster is plenty good enough.

by Cowboy Louie on Jul 26, 2008 8:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd never make this trade

I think our young receivers are going to step up big, we don’t need another veteran WR eating up cap space.

We’d never let Glenn go if we wanted a veteran, Austin, Stanback and Hurd will step up.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Jul 26, 2008 9:08 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree Terry, although...

I think, realistically, its going to really hinge on Austin stepping up. Hurd doesn’t have the speed we’re looking for. I dont see him getting much better than Crayton is, which still ain’t bad. And I would be shocked is Stanback makes that big a jump by the end of TC. I think he’s still a year away. Austin has the size and speed, which you can’t teach, but he’s got to run better routes and hold on to the ball, which you can teach. If he can do that, then we’ve got a legitimate threat to compliment T.O.

The greatest two yard run ever!

by WB3forMB3 on Jul 26, 2008 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd wait till the end of TC

see what injuries we have (hopefully none) and to see how the young’uns pan out. But I think it would be a good trade for us. If T.O. goes down we are screwed, and I think we can afford to lose both Henry and Ellis if it means getting a stud WR across from T.O.

And I have been all for trading Anthony Henry anyhow. He is old and oft injured. He plays well at the beginning of the season but towards the end he starts to wear down. I don’t know how much help he can be to us come playoff time considering all the depth at CB we acquired at the beginning of the season.

by quincyyyyy on Jul 26, 2008 9:52 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

we're not screwed if the young guys step up

and thats what Jones and the Cowboys are counting on.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Jul 26, 2008 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's going to take probably a first and third round combo...

To get any of the guys we’ve heard thrown around… Roy Williams, Anquan Boldin, Chad Johnson, all of them…

by N41D on Jul 26, 2008 10:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I think it would take more than that

Considering Cinncinnati turned down two 1sts for Chad (which Id rather not have on the team anyway). And those 1sts were higher than what the Cowboys 1st and 3rd will presumably (and hopefully) be next year. Plus, they were offered right before the draft and picks are always more valuable then than they are now with the draft almost 10 months away.

The greatest two yard run ever!

by WB3forMB3 on Jul 26, 2008 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Bengals were so dumb to reject that offer

And I agree, I think it’s pretty clear that Chad Johnson isn’t available at a realistic price. It wouldn’t make sense for Arizona to trade Boldin for picks now, rather than after the season, as long as he says he’ll play (and he has). So while I think Jerry should offer a 1st and 3rd for Boldin, it won’t happen. That leaves RW. The Lions should trade him (unless they plan on franchising him), and they need to do it now to get any value in return. I say offer the first and third and see what happens. After seeing last year’s Pats, it’s clear that sometimes you should go for a move if it will make the offense unstoppable, and adding RW will fit that bill.

All that said, I agree with those saying that the team believes in the current WRs under contract. And why not? TO, Crayton, Austin, etc. is a perfectly decent WR corps, even before you factor in Witten. Most teams do not have WRs that good. Sure, TO is a big part of it, but Crayton has game and I think we’re going to see Austin (or hell, even Amendola) step up as the #3.

by grapejoos on Jul 26, 2008 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The value was there

I think they weren’t willing to take the 8 mil cap hit. Plus they probably don’t want let their players think they can win and get out of Cincy..

The called his bluff and won..

"If you see me up in the mountains with a lion, I ain't lyin
don't help me, help the mountain lion"

by Wmillion on Jul 26, 2008 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let me see if I got this right?

RW 64 Rec. 838 yds. 5 TD
PC 50 Rec. 697 yds. 7 TD

I guess I fail to see how Roy Williams is the missing link to a title, like so many of you seem to think. Johnson and Boldin, I get. But Williams isn’t that much better than what we have. The only difference is we’d have to pay him a whole lot more.

by Mandmeisterx on Jul 28, 2008 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair point

However, I think RW would fare much better in this offense than he has in Detroit.

Also, your stats are misleading. Williams played in 12 games last year to Crayton’s 15. And the season before last, of course, RW had 1310 yards and 7 TDs. He has been successful as a #1 option before, when healthy. You can knock him for not always being healthy. But his stats are unequivocally better than Crayton’s, aside from TDs, which are something he has less control over.

by grapejoos on Jul 28, 2008 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Oh, and

Williams has had more receiving yards in the past 2 years than Boldin, who happens to have Fitzgerald on the other side of him. I might rather have Boldin (though I should observe that neither Williams nor Boldin are really “speed receivers”), but I’m just sayin.

by grapejoos on Jul 28, 2008 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't get me wrong,

I think RW is a good receiver, but that’s where the line is drawn for me. I don’t consider him a great receiver. Maybe that’s because he hasn’t stayed healthy enough to put a whole season together, I don’t know. But I do know that he has been the #1 WR for the duration of his stay in DET. And say what you want about their offense, but when Martz was there, it was pass first and pass second. And while Jon Kitna isn’t Tom Brady, he’s certainly a respectable QB for putting up numbers in the offense they ran. All that being said, I think for the price it would take to get something done, I’d just as soon stick with what we have.

by Mandmeisterx on Jul 28, 2008 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough

It was pass first and pass second. When RW had his big year, the #2 WR there was Mike Furrey – kind of the low-budget version of the Pats. I’m just trying to point out that RW’s numbers are already good – but if you put him opposite TO, they will be better (or at least, the quality of his plays will be higher). BUT, let me just say that I think we are fine with what we have. Keeping picks and not picking up RW’s big salary has major advantages.

I suspect that if the Boys don’t win it all this year, RW or Boldin will be in Dallas one way or the other next season. But here’s hoping that’s not necessary.

by grapejoos on Jul 28, 2008 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I understand the #2 receiver take

and that with a bogus #2, you face more double coverage. But it also has to be viewed that they’re not sharing touches with someone else. Save a couple of teams who manage to pull it off, it’s not realistic to think that you can have 2 guys with 100 catches and 1,000 yards. Most teams just don’t put it in the air enough to see those kind of numbers. We already have two guys in that range, and to think that we could add a great #2 and have him put up those kind of numbers is just not possible, unless the running game takes a huge back seat this year. (Which I envision the opposite happening this year)

by Mandmeisterx on Jul 28, 2008 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd rather have roy WIllimas over Bolden

Williams is about to have a break out year,, he woud be an excellent replacement to T.O in a couple of years. Bolden is more of a possession receiver with a Barber mentality after he has the football in his hands. The lions have a good core of receivers with Williams, Calvin Johnson, Furrey and their Wes welker is Mcdonald. .

by Deke on Jul 28, 2008 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The real value

Deke, you just hit on the real value of acquiring Roy Williams: in a few years, he would be TO’s replacement. With Romo leading this offense for the next decade, it is imperative that the Cowboys maintain an excellent WR corps, including a ‘true #1” that demands the attention of the defense and still makes plays when he gets it. I think Roy Williams could be that guy, and I don’t think there is a wr on the current roster that could be.

Notwithstanding, I do think the price Detroit will demand will be just too steep. I would be willing to give up a #1, but that’s it. As far as the salary cap is concerned, this is why I didn’t want the team to sign Barber. I think you can have a great offense with average-to-good running backs making modest salaries. However, a great offense requires a great quarterback and at least one great wide receiver and that takes big-time salary cap resources.

by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2008 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree Louie

I think Austin and Stanback have that #1 potential. Physically, those guys have it all.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Jul 28, 2008 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think both of them are potentially number two speed receivers, not number ones

by Deke on Jul 28, 2008 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think they have the talent

to be #1 receivers, its just all depends how hard they want to work and how bad they want it, but they’re every bit as talented as any WR we could have drafted the last few years or even in the next few years.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Jul 28, 2008 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Terry, if you're right

Then these two guys should push Crayton down the depth chart this season. Austin in entering his third year – nearly all stud wide receivers work their way into the starting lineup and put up big numbers by year three. As for Stanbeck, he got his one year pass due to inexperience and injury. If he is ever going to be a big-time wr, then this training camp and in 2008 he should be making enormous progress and pushing for the #3 wr spot.

I agree that these two guys are physically gifted enough to be #1 wr’s. However, to this point neither of them has given me any indication to think that they will develop into one. The league’s scrap heap is littered with fantastic athletes that just never could turn that physical talent into production.

Let’s hope Austin and Stanbeck are the stars of training camp, because if their play just gets them lost in the shuffle this year, then it’s pretty safe to assume that they will both be nothing more than ordinary.

by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2008 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

you know a number one isn't going to get it done

Roy Williams is the number seven overall pick, Detroit isn’t going to take a late first round pick for Williams, who is a young polished established receiver. If Jerry thinks he that one bigtime receiver away from winning a superbowl, and if williams is available, jerry does get tunnel vision on players, and he would be willing to give the farm for Williams if he thought Williams was that one piece. jerry gave two early first round picks for Galloway, so one late first round draft pick wouldn’t be close to what detroit would want, if Detroit was wiling to part with williams.

by Deke on Jul 28, 2008 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The issue for them is whether he walks as a FA

Detroit says they’re going to keep him, and they probably have the cap space to do it (or franchise him). The trade would only make sense for Detroit if they thought there was no hope of re-signing him. Even if that’s the case, I don’t think they’d do it for PR reasons alone…but can’t hurt to offer. Detroit does have other decent players at the position who aren’t in a contract year.

by grapejoos on Jul 28, 2008 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

tunnel vision

I think (hope!) that Jerry has learned his lesson about mortgaging the future too heavily. Jerry knows that the current roster is as talented as any in the entire NFL, and easily the most talented in the NFC. Barring injury, I just don’t see him making move involving multiple high picks.

by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2008 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would rather.

Commit to drafting 2 1st Rounders the next two years then give them away, or even using a 1st and 2nd next year no WR.. Then if that doesn’t work try trading for a one, I think having TO gives us some time..

You can draft a WR in the 1st and get it right, it is just tricky business. I say if Colston can be a one with decent speed and quickness. He is not in the top 20 in speed or agility in the league, but he is bona fide #1. Stanback, Austin, and Hurd as physically gifted as him, if not more physically gifted.

"If you see me up in the mountains with a lion, I ain't lyin
don't help me, help the mountain lion"

by Wmillion on Jul 28, 2008 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would rather

"If you see me up in the mountains with a lion, I ain't lyin
don't help me, help the mountain lion"

by Wmillion on Jul 28, 2008 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, like the other guy said...

Cincinnati was retarded for passing on that offer… They were blinded by the fact that they wanted to prove a point, for whatever reason, and they let it get in the way of making the best decision for their team…

But realistically, that’s probably the real value of any of the receivers we’ve heard thrown around.

by N41D on Jul 26, 2008 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs