Terrell Owens: Hall of Famer?
by Carl Shelton (GloryDayz88) on Jan 28, 2009 7:51 PM CST
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PrintAs I do most days, yesterday I tuned in to talk radio for most of the day in my work van. The debate of the day was about recently retired Los Angeles Dodger second baseman Jeff Kent, and whether or not his career had been a Hall of Fame worthy one. It struck me almost instantly how similar the argument over Kent is to the one we will be having eight to ten years from now regarding Terrell Owens.
The similarities between the two are striking. Like Owens, Kent carries with him the reputation of being a clubhouse malcontent. Kent's poor fundamentals are evident in his below average fielding. Owens' poor fundamentals are evident in his less than desirable route running, and his difficulties hanging on to the football. Both men have been tantalizingly close, but neither man has been able to claim a championship in his respective sport. Still, it is more than likely that the legacy that both men leave behind will be defined by their eye-popping, undeniable offensive production. As far as Major League Baseball's Hall of Fame is concerned, there seems to be a set of "magic numbers" (500 home runs, 3,000 hits, 300 wins) that make a player a virtual lock for induction. Though football's Hall is a bit less number crazed, it will be difficult for voters to turn a blind eye to Terrell Owens' statistics when his day comes.
Love him or love to hate him; Terrell Owens has been an absolute monster since first suiting up for the San Francisco 49ers in 1996. To this point in his 13 year career, T.O. has racked up nine 1,000 yard seasons. He has six times been a Pro Bowler, and five times a First Team All-Pro, in an era that has seen more prolific wide receivers than any other in NFL history.
If Terrell Owens retired today, he would be sixth in NFL history in receptions. His 14,122 receiving yards rank him fifth all-time. With 822 yards next season, he can climb into third or even second place, depending on a still active Marvin Harrison, who is currently 458 yards ahead of Owens. T.O.'s 139 touchdown receptions are second only to the great Jerry Rice. His 141 total touchdowns have him tied with LaDainian Tomlinson for fourth place all-time behind Rice and Emmitt Smith. Both should breeze by Marcus Allen's 145 total TD's next season. For those scoring at home that's 6th all-time in receptions, 5th in receiving yards, 2nd in receiving touchdowns, and 4th in total touchdowns.
It is a bit early to judge Owens' body of work since it is not yet complete, so I took the liberty of doing some projections. I am taking into consideration the fact that Terrell is 35 years old, so his years are limited, and his production should begin to dip. For the sake of the argument, I projected out Owens numbers over three more seasons, at 70% of his average career production. Even assuming that Terrell Owens can only squeeze out 3 more seasons, at a 70% clip, his legacy would read like this:
Terrell Owens, 6-time Pro Bowler, 5-time First Team All-Pro. 1,104 career receptions, 16,403 receiving yards, 163 touchdowns. NFL record holder for receptions in a single game (20, December 17, 2000.)
Those numbers are hard to deny, even with all of T.O.'s locker room transgressions. Owens' numbers are even rock solid when contrasted against those considered the best to ever play the position. Consistency is a key attribute for a Hall of Fame player. It is my belief that one of the best ways to measure a player's career production is to examine what a player gives his team on a year to year basis. This is how Terrell Owens' average season stacks up against current and future Hall of Famers of the modern era.
|
|
AVG Rec. |
AVG Yards |
AVG TD |
|
Randy Moss |
76.6 |
1200 |
12.3 |
|
Marvin Harrison |
84.8 |
1121 |
9.8 |
|
Jerry Rice |
73.8 |
1090 |
9.4 |
|
Terrell Owens |
73.2 |
1086 |
10.7 |
|
Michael Irvin |
62.5 |
992 |
5.4 |
|
Steve Largent |
58.5 |
934 |
7.1 |
|
Cris Carter |
68.8 |
869 |
8.1 |
|
Art Monk |
58.8 |
795 |
4.3 |
|
Charlie Joiner |
41.6 |
674 |
3.6 |
|
Lynn Swann |
37.3 |
606 |
5.6 |
Even among the game's all-time greats, Owens does more than hold his own. The scary thing is that Owens may have left his best season on the field. In 2005 with Philadelphia, Owens had 47 receptions for 763 yards and seven touchdowns through seven games. He was on pace to dwarf all of his statistical career highs, but his unwillingness to fall in line led to a mid-season deactivation by coach Andy Reid. Once again, the bright shining star that is Terrell Owens was dimmed by his own selfish actions.
The question is, what will play a bigger role in the minds of Hall of Fame voters eight to ten years from now? Will voters make try to make a statement about the importance of the team concept, and deny a player entry whose on field play was certainly worthy of Hall of Fame membership? Or will voters succumb to the allure of Owens' undeniable numbers, and open the doors of pro football's most sacred club to a player who was considered a cancer for the better part of his career? When Terrell Owens stands before the Football Gods on his judgment day, will he be remembered for the game winning catch in that 1998 NFC Divisional game, or his heroic performance in Super Bowl 39? Or will he be forever remembered as the man who is believed to have single handedly torn apart the San Francisco 49ers, the Philadelphia Eagles, and quite possibly the Dallas Cowboys?
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T.O. will forever be remembered by fans of the NFL.
Much of what he will be remembered for is his intense passion and competitiveness—2 qualities shared by every HOFer.
He already has the numbers.
He has the notoriety and may even get a championship this year (please, oh please!).
First ballot. Don’t think they’ll pull a Pete Rose on him or anything.
Question is:
With which team will he inducted?
ROMOCOP!
I thought Marcus Allen went in as a Chief instead of a Raider.
ROMOCOP!
by Aaron Novinger on Jan 28, 2009 9:38 PM CST up reply actions
He's a great player.....
no doubt about that. But he has also left a black eye on the sport. He(along with the media) has played a major role in the creation of the “diva” receiver. If the voting were up to the players then he would be a shoe in. But the media type that does most of the voting spend a lot of there time ripping him. The H.O.F is supposed to be about on field production. But i wouldn’t be surprised to see some of the voters try and make an example out of him. I’m not saying i agree with it, im just saying i can see it happening.
Cris Carter had huge numbers and he had to wait. He had off the field problems in Philly but once he got to the vikings he was choir boy. So i cant see T.O. getting in on the 1st time. Just because as he likes to say “they love to hate me”!!!
I agree that some votters might try to make an example of him
Peter King hass mentioned numerous times that he doesnt think TO should be a HOFer because of his attitude.
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 12:46 AM CST up reply actions
Screw King
I have a few problems with TO myself, but if a HOF voter doesn’t vote for someone who is undoubtedly qualified because of his attitude then he doesn’t deserve to be a voter. The HOF is for the greatest players in NFL history. Not the nicest players in NFL history.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
I completely agree
I just wonder how many other voters will have similar thoughts.
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 4:26 AM CST up reply actions
Probably a lot of them
It’s not just HOF voters. It’s all of these pompous guys that somehow get a chance to vote for some award. Like Heisman voters. I remember Mel Kiper and Chris Fowler got into an argument once on ESPN radio about it. Chris Fowler was listing all the different criteria some individual Heisman voters use to decide who to vote for. Instead of just the criteria that was already there. Like some voters decide who they’ll vote for based on a college players overall college career and crap like that. Mel told Fowler that they didn’t deserve to have votes if that’s what they were doing and I agree.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
I'm past caring about TO
except on the field, next season. He gains a 1000 yards receiving and I’ll carve his bust out of soap myself.
great point
i as well am sick and tired of all things T.O., except on the field
by TARHEEL PAUL on Jan 28, 2009 8:56 PM CST up reply actions
He had 1000+ this year
Didn’t he? I may be wrong, but I thought his numbers were 1100something, 10 TDs.
by the red scare on Jan 29, 2009 1:30 AM CST up reply actions
1053 yards
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 4:28 AM CST up reply actions
With clowns like Burger King holding a vote it may be a while
I do not deny that his numbers cry out, but look at how long it took the playmaker is there anyone here who believes that his image off the field and the fact that he was a cowboy (the 70 cowboys are still waiting for their due) it could be a little bit longer for TO, but if he really wants in he knows how to work PR to work the press who have the votes and get in. Playmaker did the same the year he got in, he was working the voters (not bribing) but kissing a little and he got in with troy. So I think he will get in, his production has earned him that much.
Ignore the Mainstream Media, EMBRACE THE HATE!!!!
+1
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 12:49 AM CST up reply actions
common sense
he’s a first ballot hofer.
but the hatahs, like the people who don’t let blyleven in baseball, won’t vote for him though…
Stability is key, and JD is a Beast.
Jindal - 2012
"AMMIITAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABHH!!!"
compelling post
his stellar stats definitely make him HOF worthy.
unfortunately, the only thing that might keep him out is the predominantly anti-TO media, who of course, do the voting.
the msm sucks.
Celebrity or Imposter?
YOU Decide...
http://www.xanga.com/metaltometal/689036052/celebrity-or-imposter/
Even with his image...
Its impossible to ignore his numbers.
He should be a first ballot hall of famer, but he WILL at least be a hall of famer.
Do Randy Moss' numbers jump out at anyone else?
When I was researching this, that was the one thing that really stood out. Too bad he wasted 2 years in Oakland, he might have a real shot at Rice.
IF YOU'RE LOOKIN FOR ME...I'M AT THE SCRIP CLUB WITH PACMAN......AND WE'RE BEING REBELLION!!
by Carl Shelton (GloryDayz88) on Jan 28, 2009 8:59 PM CST reply actions
Oh definitly
I honestly think Moss is the most gifted receiver to ever play the game, and that includes Jerry Rice.
He’s a freakish blend of size and speed. Almost awkward.
He doesn’t look like he should be so fast with that lanky body.
+1
I don’t know if you’ve ever watched his clips on Youtube, but my god some of the things he’s done, I have never and probably won’t for a while, ever see again.
by joey7289 on Jan 29, 2009 2:58 PM CST up reply actions
What is Moss' work ethic like?
From what Ive read its not very good, but I find it hard to beleive he can be as good as he is without working hard.
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 12:53 AM CST up reply actions
He once admitted to taking plays off.
I guess he meant he drags @ss on plays where either he wasn’t the primary receiver or didn’t think there was a good chance he was going to get the ball.
Randy Moss
I have always thought of Moss as the best receiver in the NFL since he entered the league, but I had no idea that his per season statistics are the greatest of all time.
Even more interesting is some of the QB’s he has had, who had career years with him as a receiver, then disappeared or were horrible. An old Randall Cunningham, Jeff George and Daunte Culpepper all put up amazing numbers with Moss at receiver and disappeared when they or he left.
Moss is truly a 1st ballot HOFer and in my mind the 2nd best receiver of all time. However, he is in my mind the most gifted receiver of all time, but because he some times does not play to his fullest extent and seems to not posses an outstanding work ethic, he will never surpass Rice’s legacy.
That Culpepper's career year was because of Moss is a common misconception.
Who knows what in the bloody blue hell went wrong with Culpepper’s career? Moss missed three games altogether in ‘04 and he was gimpy in half of the ones he did appear in. He did still lead the Vikings in TD’s but he just wasn’t his usual self that year and Nate freakin’ Burleson was actually their leading receiver.
I agree with all the rest though. Moss possesses sick physical skills and has already had a great enough career to be a 1st Ballot HOFer whether he takes the odd play off or not.
TO will get in sometime...
but if classy players who were actually key contributors to championship teams like Art Monk have to wait a decade to get in, and if other productive receivers like Andre Reed and Henry Ellard are still out, and if Michael Irvin had to wait two years and Cowboy greats like Bob Hayes and Drew Pearson aren’t in either, then justice dictates that Owens stay on the outside looking in for a few years.
Except T.O. is a better player then all the guys you mentioned.
Who cares if your classy or not, its about the the numbers.
by houseofprime on Jan 28, 2009 10:51 PM CST up reply actions
at least it should be
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 12:56 AM CST up reply actions
No way
I’d take Irvin over TO any day of the week. Physical gifts and stats don’t speak to the fire that Irvin brought to this team and the rings speak for themselves.
I think he was talking about who has the best numbers
because the next line is
“Who cares if your classy or not, its about the the numbers.”
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 30, 2009 12:38 AM CST up reply actions
Ellard played for like 26 years.
His omission from the Hall Of Fame probably has to do with being a guy whose career amounted to quantity over quality. Reed himself only had 4 1,000-yard seasons. T.O. probably already has as many truly great seasons as Ellard and Reed had combined.
If we’re just looking at numbers and how long T.O. was considered one of the top 5 at his position, he is definitely a first ballot Hall Of Famer.
I'd like to hear that argument.
What could they say?
by Realist Larry on Jan 28, 2009 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
I voted never..
I’m not sure the only criteria is numbers. If that’s all that counts, he’s a first ballot lock. Do the voters take into consideration other factors, like popularity, the overall contribution to the team – ie: production – disruption = value, other intangibles?
Factor in the voters in the areas that he made enemies, Philly, SF Bay, Baltimore, maybe DFW. Factor in other voters who haven’t been directly affected by his negative behavior but just don’t want to reward that behavior. Factor in the other HOF candidates who may also be eligible and who also have good numbers but not the negative baggage, and the number of candidates will grow each year. Factor in TO himself and his marketing of himself. I think he’s brilliant at it, and smart for striking while the iron is hot…but he is not one who generates lukewarm feelings, most either love him or hate him. Look at the fans on this site, I’d guess it’s 50-50. That’s a close vote.
It is an election, and people don’t always vote for the most qualified candidate, they vote for who they like, who they identify with. The question was, “What do I think his HOF fate will be?” Human nature being what it is, he might be denied entry.
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
Why should media members in Philly, SF, and Baltimore
dislike T.O.? He gave them lots of material. I think the theory that many people on his team dislike him on his is pretty overrated. To me his numbers will just be too good to keep him out. I mean there is only one WR in the history of the NFL thats scored more TD’s then him.
by houseofprime on Jan 29, 2009 1:07 AM CST up reply actions
interesting take....
… and i can see where youre coming from. but i just cant see how anyone could justifiably leave him off of their ballot.
2nd all time in receiving touchdowns is enough for me. that stat alone is enough to get you into canton in my book.
take it a step further and go to total TDs… and he’ll probably finish 3rd. right behind emmitt and right above marcus allen. one of the most impactful offensive players of all time, and he’s not gettin in on the first shot?
i mean, its possible the voters hold a grudge. or maybe i just live in a world where i expect the people that cover my favorite sports to have a wee bit of journalistic integrity.
then again, ESPN and the DMN blog are prime examples of that not being the case.
Jim...I think your way off...current votes have TO getting into the HOF 694 Yes 117 NO
Recent Fan Poll posted here to keep TO on our roster, rather than cut him was also a very favorable 65% . You can’t deny his stats are far and away better than most WR’s already in the HOF. I say he retires a Cowboy and SB champion, and is surely a 1st ballot HOFer.
I must also say the 117 or so people who voted NO, are obviously just haters looking to stir the pot with their own agenda against TO, knowing damn well TO is a LOCK to be presented into the HOF. And the naysayers here are a big reason why sports writers shouldn’t be allowed to vote in the first place, as it equates to personal opinions, and not the facts. A HOF commitee of Owners, and current HOF members should be the only people voting .
Todays media is so out of wack, it’s impossible to believe journalism will make it another decade. Newspapers are going down the toilet with these hack writers they hire nowadays.
by CowboysRnumba1 on Jan 30, 2009 5:23 AM CST up reply actions
Valid points, one and all..
I answered the question, What will his fate be? Sometimes I like to take the contra viewpoint and explore the other sides perspective.
I personally like TO and think his motives are pure, but his emotions run away with his message. He wants to win, and has a passion for winning. He gets frustrated with those who don’t share that passion and he tries to lead (in his own way) by trying to get the ball in his own hands. It’s admirable. His athletic talents are obvious and were I given a chance to vote, I would like to see him go in the HOF as a Cowboy.
But, there are those who don’t see him that way. I think they see him as malicious and destructive. I believe he has to get an 80% favorable vote to get in. As you said, he can only garner a 65% favorable vote from his current supporters. He has attacked the press directly as liars and unprofessionals. These are the voters.
I was taking a dispassionate look at human nature and calculating the numbers and it looked to me like he might have engendered a real dislike from at least 21% of the voters. That’s all it takes to keep him out.
Now, adding my own postscript here, over time, as emotions soften, his numbers may stand out as an obvious selection and he could get in.
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
As long as sportswriters hold sway (read votes)
he will not get in first ballot, even though he has provided them with such easy material. He almost writes their by lines for them and saves a lot of research time. But they will get all “holier-than-thou” when voting time comes. Bank on it.
Moss does stand out, and is the reason why I think Owens will have to wait.
I think they’ll be perceived as a pair, rightly or not, with Moss getting put in first and TO having to wait for a few years until they feel fit to put in the next receiver.
The Debate
Great numbers vs. the destruction of 3 teams:
Honestly, he doesn’t deserve it to be in the Hall of Fame for exactly the same reasons that Lynn Swann DOES deserve to be in. Football is about winning. Period
Don't give me that bullcrap.
The Hall of Fame should strictly be about numbers.
by houseofprime on Jan 28, 2009 11:48 PM CST up reply actions
Hypothetically..
Isn’t this promoting self vs team?
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
You're entitled to that opinion
Others may place value on other things too, like how he’s perceived as a team mate and a leader. I don’t think it’s written anywhere that only numbers can be considered.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jan 29, 2009 9:34 AM CST up reply actions
No, the HOF should be about the numbers and only the numbers.
Besides TO hasnt destroyed 3 teams. This Dallsa team has not been destroyd, and TO has not done anything wrong since he has been here
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 1:08 AM CST up reply actions
+1 aussie...
simply more BS from the naysayers
by CowboysRnumba1 on Jan 30, 2009 5:26 AM CST up reply actions
I guess T.O. spiked Donovan's Gatorade with syrup of ipecac or doused the ball in french fry grease....
……before Philly’s final possession in SB 39.
-1
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 1:09 AM CST up reply actions
ok...then explain why TO's jersey is one of the top 5 jerseys sold in the world ???
unpopular my azz…..
by CowboysRnumba1 on Jan 30, 2009 5:28 AM CST up reply actions
+1
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 30, 2009 6:32 AM CST up reply actions
Don't forget about his T-Shirts
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Jan 31, 2009 6:35 PM CST up reply actions
T.O.
To me, T.O. cannot be denied. His statistics are too great to ignore and he was one of the top 2 or 3 receivers in the league for a good 7-8 years.
Now, I do not think he is a first ballot HOFer and should probably wait 3-5 years.
Why?
- T.O. was NEVER the greatest WR in the league during his career. Harrison, Moss, etc. have always been better than him.
- T.O. destroys teams and puts himself over the good of the team.
- T.O. will never win a championship
If T.O. somehow manages to grasp a championship while playing a major part in the team, I think he can be boosted up to a 1st or 2nd balloter, but currently, no.
"T.O. will never win a championship"
So I guess youre not that hopeful about our upcoming season then.
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 29, 2009 4:34 AM CST up reply actions
lol...i know huh....nice logic...
i’m done with this post….it’s like chewing on dirt.
by CowboysRnumba1 on Jan 30, 2009 5:30 AM CST up reply actions
Not trying to nitpick, but Harrison better than TO?
Less annoying, certainly, but no way is he better. Harrison had Manning for the better portion of his career, if I’m not mistaken. If TO had the same QB throughout the better portion of his time in the league, I’m pretty sure his numbers would be even more absurd than they already are.
That said, I’m pretty sure he’s on the decline, but even then I’d take him over most receivers in the league, strictly on talent and ability. He may or may not be a headache and a detriment to the team(it’s really hard to tell, so I’ll just assume Jerry and company will make the right decision, whichever that may be), but as far as offensive production is concerned, any team would be marginally better with TO starting, be it as a #1 or a #2 receiver.
Moss>TO I wouldn’t argue with. Harrison may have better numbers in a couple of categories, but in no way is he better than TO, imho
by the red scare on Jan 29, 2009 5:44 AM CST up reply actions
yeah,
you cant say Harrison is better. He caught more balls, but he is by far the most cowardly receiver I have ever seen. I mean, he is in Todd Pinkston’s class of cowardice. Marvin’s “catch it and get down” approach to football makes me sick. Sometimes he anticipates hits that never come, and dives on the ground without a defender within 10 yards. The only time he ever gets yards after the catch is when he can catch one over the top and outrun the defender to the endzone.
And I don’t give him an excuse because of his size, because Steve Smith isn’t much bigger, and he is nasty after the catch.
IF YOU'RE LOOKIN FOR ME...I'M AT THE SCRIP CLUB WITH PACMAN......AND WE'RE BEING REBELLION!!
by Carl Shelton (GloryDayz88) on Jan 29, 2009 6:26 AM CST up reply actions
TO will make it in the HOF
Maybe not right away, but numbers-wise he has to be a lock at some point.
NOBODY can end up being in the top 5 in 3-4 positional catagories in their career and not be “allowed in” b/c of his attitude…
The Hall of Fame is home to the best players ever; and he is one.
Marvin Harrison
1,102 receptions
14,580 yards
128 TDs
1 Super Bowl
4 100 catch seasons
8 straight 1,000 yard seasons, including a string of 5 straight 1,200+ seasons and 4 straight 1,400+
However....
Steve Smith is MUCH bigger as far as muscle goes.
But I agree, PLUS Harrison played with Peyton Manning.
by AirforceBat on Jan 29, 2009 10:38 PM CST up reply actions
I agree completely
In terms of bravery, Harrison is to WRs what Neon Deion was to CBs
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 30, 2009 12:42 AM CST up reply actions
The rest is still unwritten...
How TO exits this league will affect his HOF chances as much as anything else. The numbers are certainly there. The championships are not. His meglomaniacal tendencies are well known.
He should get in. If he learns to shut up and helps this team win a championship, he’s a first ballot lock. If he tears this locker room apart, is unceremoniously dumped, and spends the next two years on ESPN like Barry Bonds claiming there is a conspiracy not to give him a last chance with another team, then it going to be something which the voters take into account, like it or not.
The question is how he leaves this league? Gracefully and possibly a champion or as a malcontent nutjob. Who knows?
T.O. will most definitely be inducted into the HOF
However, he won’t be a first ballot inductee. His numbers will be too good over too many years not to get in eventually.
In Romo we Trust
I don't think
he gets in unless he is on a team that eventually wins a championship…
now, that may not be fair or what ever, but i think his mis-behavior (for lack of a better word) will keep him from the hall without a ring…
i appologize for this but i was half asleep and i am not a big baseball fan… but i was watching ‘The Sports Reporters’ a few weeks ago and they were talking about some baseball player making the hall but NOT unanimously, who probalby should have…. and Lupica or who ever was telling the story said that they knew one of the writers who gets to vote for the baseball hall of fame candidates… and Lupica said that this reporter did not vote at all saying that ‘oh he gets in anyway, i don’t need to vote..’ so i guess the player got in but not unanimously..
i think it is this TYPE of bias that will keep T.O. from making it unless he gets a ring…
if he gets a ring, regardless of where, the story will probably be… great reciever but had problems for most of his career but then turned into a team player and finally won the big one…..
if he does not win one he is just a player with tons of talent and a lot of stats that will be percieved as someone who wrecked the chances for three franchises… (maybe two, i don’t remember how close the Niners were when he was run out of there)
If that happens...
Then thats a crock.
IMO You cannot finish second behind Jerry Rice on TDS and not get in.
While he’s a nutcase, he isn’t a criminal.
by AirforceBat on Jan 29, 2009 10:40 PM CST up reply actions
+1
"Ask Philly was it hard tryin' a stop TO, he da main reason that the fans would come fo'."
by aussie_cowboy on Jan 30, 2009 12:44 AM CST up reply actions
How soon Owen’s gets in…
May depend on what he does from here. What if he stays in Dallas and has, let’s say, a 975 yard season with 8 TDs, plays quietly and the Cowboys go on to win the Super Bowl. Let’s further imagine that Owens catches 9 passes in the big game for 210 yards and 3 touchdowns and walks away with the MVP trophy. In this scenario he would become an instant 1st ballot guy IMHO.
Now of course there are an endless amount of negative scenarios that would hurt his changes that we all could imagine but I’m feeling positive today.
0 = The number of Super Bowls the Eagles have won.
He has to get a ring in Dallas. Period.
If T.O. brings a championship home to Dallas then all of the media bashing will end and he will go into the Hall on the first ballot. Look at Randy Moss. Before his super season with NE, he was the guy who vanished in Oakland, took plays off, “mooned” the Packer fans, and made the phrase “straight cash homie” famous.
Now he’s a “leader”.
Winning championships is the NFL cure-all. Kurt Warner had Hall numbers before this season – but now he’s a lock. What kills me about that (and someone wrote about that either here or in the DMN) is that we were just as 9-7 as them and were a few bad bounces away from being in Tampa too. The league is funny that way.
Bottom line: T.O. needs to win to turn public opinion about him around. ONce he does he’s a first ballot lock. Without a win he at least needs to play in a bowl again. I can’t see him waiting more than 2 years tops.
I could disagree more with the sentiment that his ego has something to do with this..
Can someone on here give me one example of a person with the carreer stats that T.O. has that is not in the HOF..
It is ridiculous that we are even having this conversation.. He is the 2nd or 3rd best reciever of all time.. It just shows you what kind of effect the msm has even in the city to which he plays.. In my mind, it is impossible to keep him out and no one here has given one piece of evidence that defends this ludacris debate..
A Cowboy fan from Dallas residing in enemy terretory since 1990..
+100000000000000 Jtiner....totally agree
Even though he is a lock NOW, By the time here retires here in Dallas, 2-5 more seasons or so…He’ll cement himself as one of the best playmakers of all time. And has a chance to be the all time leader in TD’s.
by CowboysRnumba1 on Jan 30, 2009 5:39 AM CST up reply actions
Where does it come into play....
that I want to throw up now whenever I hear “TO”? Give me a break, it’s non-stop. He really isn’t that interesting. He’s a physical freak, pretty good receiver and he’s been a total distraction wherever he’s been for 10 years. All the other stuff around him is just insanity and we can’t get away from it. For the love of God, PLEASE STOP TALKING ABOUT TO!!!!!
by StillHateTheGiants on Jan 29, 2009 9:29 AM CST reply actions
Then dont open up the thread then..
Regardless of the supposed off the field antics.. He is not a “pretty good” reciever and its almost blasphemy to speak otherwise..
People that think this team would be better without him are gonna have a sobering reality if it happens.. I mean I like the RW2 pick up.. But find it hard to believe that he is gonna take double teams the way TO does.. Stop playing into the msm and realize that we have one of the best recievers in history and with him here make the SB a much easier reality to grasp..
A Cowboy fan from Dallas residing in enemy terretory since 1990..
And I quote...(their official website that is)
The Mission of the Pro Football Hall of Fame is:
To honor, preserve, educate and promote. . .
To honor individuals who have made outstanding contributions to professional football.
To preserve professional football’s historic documents and artifacts.
To educate the public regarding the origin, development and growth of professional football as an important part of American culture.
To promote the positive values of the sport.
I’d say T.O. has the first three covered. And since you compared him to Jeff Kent, if you were to bat .750 in baseball, I’m pretty sure you’d get in haha. T.O.‘s stats are undeniable. To say he hasn’t made significant, and certainly outstanding contributions to professional football and the wide receiver position is rubbish. Sure he was a distraction, but would you say L.T. (the real one, that is) wasn’t? To my knowledge, he hasn’t done a single illegal thing in an era where off field legal troubles are running rampant, nor has he EVER been thought to use any sort of performancing-enhaning substance. Pure dedication to his craft and an undeniable work ethic has gotten him where he is today. This is the pro football hall of fame. Not the pro football and character hall of fame. You don’t get in just for being a nice guy. You get in for stats. As far as the Super Bowl is concerned, it’s unfair, but I think QB’s are the only ones judged for their number of rings. To deny Owens of that gold blazer because of his personality is robbery!
by AikmanNailedMySis on Jan 29, 2009 9:34 AM CST reply actions
Couldnt agree more Aikman...
A Cowboy fan from Dallas residing in enemy terretory since 1990..
Spot On with the LT comparison
Game Recognize Game
by pretty ricky on Jan 29, 2009 10:20 AM CST up reply actions
I may get bashed for this...
Let’s not forget Warren Moon.I loved the guy and he was arrested for domestic abuse and still made it into the HOF.
Game Recognize Game
by pretty ricky on Jan 29, 2009 11:00 AM CST up reply actions
If the HOF
can stiff Bob Hayes, why should they even give Owens a glance?
Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.
Bob Hayes is one of the greats
But Bob Hayes won’t end his career in the top 5 all-time in 3 or 4 different receiving categories. Honestly, the argument is whether or not he’ll be a first ballot inductee, not whether he gets in at all…
by commoncents on Jan 29, 2009 11:35 AM CST up reply actions
Love him or hate him
There’s no solid argument against TO being inducted. Might not happen on the 1st ballot, but it’ll happen. He’s got the numbers and he’s kept his nose clean off the field. Sure he’s a megalomaniac, but that’s not a reason to keep him out.
T-New, shutting down WR's for Dallas since 2003
Selective memory
That’s what the voters have. If it is an issue of character, how did LT get in the first ballot? LT had to be one of the morally disgusting players in the NFL.
The press loved LT because he gave great quotes, and reporters are the voters
TO will make it but no ton the first ballot. If I had a vote, I’d vote for the guy in his first year of eligibility
Lifetime Cowboys Fan from the Swamps of Jersey
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