Folk or McBriar? A Kicking Controversy for the Cowboys

by Aaron Novinger on Dec 7, 2009 5:34 PM CST in News Comment 72 comments

After Nick Folk missed his 42-yarder yesterday, he looked down at his holder, Mat McBriar. I think we all saw how perplexed their two faces were. At first glance, McBriar's hold didn't look to be all that bad. Apparently, it was. He said so, himself, to Coach Phillips.

Today in Coach Phillips' press conference, the first questions asked to him after his general opening statement regarded the placekicking problem.

"Was it a terribly bad hold?"

"That's what Mat said. He said he didn't get it down right," responded Phillips. He also said the laces were turned the wrong way and that Folk "hit" them.

When asked who worries him more, Phillips was not clear on whether to blame the kicker or the holder. What he said concerns him more is the confidence of the two players together in that situation. If it is indeed a confidence issue, it could be addressed by changing holders. But, as Phillips said, McBriar was the best of them when the team worked out holders during training camp.

Make the jump for more.

The other players worked out were WRs Sam Hurd, Patrick Crayton, and K David Buehler. Phillips also mentioned QB Jon Kitna, but said that he had no experience holding before, and honestly he did not sound as if Kitna could even be a holding option.

A reporter also asked whether Phillips considered giving Buehler a try at placekicker. He shot that idea down rather quickly, saying that he is not yet ready to kick in game situations.

"Why?"

"Consistency...being able to make them."

That settles that.

If anyone can fix what ails the special teams, it's coach Joe DeCamillis. This week, he will have his hands full.

Special teams coach Joe DeCamillis said the Cowboys needed to look at "the whole operation" and acknowledged a change at holder was a possibility.

"We've got limited options obviously, but we’ve worked with several guys," DeCamillis said. "We’ll just have to see as the week goes on."

DeCamillis said if the Cowboys change holders, he plans to keep that information a secret until the first time Folk attempts a kick Sunday.

"We are not going to tell you who the change will be going in," DeCamillis said. "Maybe it’s Patrick Crayton, we might want Patrick Crayton to run a fake the first play. That’s a competitive situation." DeCamillis stressed that he isn't losing faith in Folk.

In other special teams-related news, here's what Giants' PR Domenik Hixon said about how their return team beat the Cowboys' coverage unit.

"I'd been watching film of [the Cowboys' punt coverage unit] and their gunners had been doing a great job. We decided we needed to start one way and then try to head it back the other direction. If you try to go lateral for too long, you'll be in trouble, but I was able to get vertical pretty quickly against them. Seeing all those blue shirts was pretty exciting."

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I think David Buehler should hold, kick, and block.

Liberty Ballers.com.

by jsams on Dec 7, 2009 5:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

At the same time.

Liberty Ballers.com.

by jsams on Dec 7, 2009 5:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

excellent!

by what_the_crap on Dec 7, 2009 5:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Buehler has become the Chuck Noris of the Dallas Cowboys

by quincyyyyy on Dec 7, 2009 7:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Who needs a holder anyway

Bring back the dropkick!

"Where's Woody? - We need another Darren Woodson

by BoyfromOz on Dec 7, 2009 8:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I once saw Buehler kick a 60 yard field goal with his third leg

by Dansonofdirm on Dec 7, 2009 9:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I heard he tripped on it afterwards.

I saw a dog today. Have you seen a dog? You probably have. How was school? Was it fun? Did you get a lot of homework? Huh? Do you have any friends? Do you have a best friend? Does he have a big coat, too?

by Aaron Novinger on Dec 7, 2009 9:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

looked like

the whole damn ST unit tripped on it during Hixons punt return

by fretman on Dec 7, 2009 10:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Buehler, Texas Ranger.

LOL I love it.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 7:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Now this is some funny stuff!..lol

At least you guys have options..Our guy Tynes is all we have and trust me..If he runs out on field we run outside and hide..He’s great outside the 40..So when they reach the 40-ish yard line, I’m hollering " Go for threeeeee"..inside of that he stinks..and Kickoffs?…Atrocious..He’s lucky if he can reach the 25 yard-line..I hate kickers..I watched that hold Sunday several times and it looked perfect to me..Folk just blew it.

by Bobbiblue on Dec 8, 2009 9:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Let

the Folking Folk go, his replacement is already on the roster.

by icouldusesomebaseball on Dec 7, 2009 5:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Crayton

would be a good choice, I think.

by what_the_crap on Dec 7, 2009 5:39 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I like the "quarterback" option he provides.

by GalTex on Dec 7, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I call shenanigans

I was looking at the stupid play closely just because those two pulled this story out recently. That hold seemed perfectly fine.

Folk just doesn’t trust McBriar anymore, and it’s affecting his kicking.

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by accidental innuendo on Dec 7, 2009 5:39 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

not true

McBriar had the ball tilted the wrong way

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 7, 2009 9:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I saw the replay. Troy went so far as to comment on it. Video does not lie.

Folk missed the kick and that is that. Let me ask you this. Are you going to blame your pro-bowl punt and possible screw his head up or your streaky kicker who has missed 5 inside the 40? You can’t blame Matt for all those misses.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 6:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I saw the replay too and it was titled the wrong way.

Have you ever kicked??

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 8, 2009 7:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Yes I have. It isn't that difficult. Keep your head down your plant foot even with the ball,

and follow through. I never had a strong leg, but I had great form. I kicked in H.S. on Freshman and J.V. teams and was deadly inside the 30. Never really got to do it on the Varsity team though, since my junior and senior year I was the long snapper.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 8:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

well, if you kicked soccer style then you should know

which way the ball is titled means a lot.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 8, 2009 8:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

We can go round and round all day with this.

Suffice it to say, in my opinion, from what I saw on the video, Folk has no reason to complain about the hold. As a professional kicker he should be able to boot it from every direction except on it’s side, and the only reason for that is there isn’t enough room to get under it and get it up.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 9:26 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

not true

If it was an extra point or short FG, I would tend to agree, but anything over 40 yards, no way, how the ball is placed is extremely important.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 8, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I saw the last kick

And he hit a duck hook. It’s not like he just pulled it a little left or pushed it a little right, that was one of the WORST FG attempts I’ve seen in quite a while. Maybe the ball was tilted a little and maybe it wasn’t. Even if it was and it effected him some, to miss THAT badly is inexcuseable. That kick wouldn’t have been good as an extra point.

by John Boy on Dec 8, 2009 6:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Wade in regards to Buehler not attempting kicks

wasnt he the one last year that they didnt use Felix last year against Washington b/c they didnt have any “come from behind” plays for him. Maybe wade just doesnt know how to use his players.

by icouldusesomebaseball on Dec 7, 2009 5:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Hopefully a change of the holder fixes the kicking problems….hopefully.

by MdFan24 on Dec 7, 2009 5:41 PM CST via mobile reply actions 0 recs

how about putting Romo back to hold, besides the snap in Seattle

he was not that bad if memory serves me up

by dcfanz on Dec 7, 2009 5:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I was just about to suggest that. I’d love to see Folk lining up for a game-winning kick in the Super Bowl with TR himself holding it.

Liberty Ballers.com.

by jsams on Dec 7, 2009 5:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

That ESPN article brings that up...

Tony Romo is the only current Cowboy other than McBriar who has NFL experience as a holder. He performed the task well, give or take a bobble on what would have been a go-ahead field goal in a playoff game, but the Cowboys don’t want their franchise quarterback playing special teams.

by Aaron Novinger on Dec 7, 2009 5:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I say let Romo hold again...or bring back Brad Johnson just to be the holder....lol

Since McBriar has been holding Folk has steadily declined….not good

"Austin made the play, Austin saved the day" Brad Sham

by Boyzfan94 on Dec 7, 2009 7:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

How much less consistent would Buehler have to be

to be less consistent than Folk?

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Dec 7, 2009 6:09 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I wonder that, too.

Folk’s already missed a third of his kicks this year. Why torture him with a 57-yard try?

by Aaron Novinger on Dec 7, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Seemed like a bit of a prayer.

I guess with one second in the half, the thinking was what the bleep. But if he mishits it or anything goes wrong, maybe he’s psyched on the next one.

I don’t know . . . I just wanted the defense to not cave. Arrrgh.

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Dec 7, 2009 6:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i don't get it

We know for sure folk doesn’t have the leg. WHy try? Why not buehler?

by foyesboys on Dec 7, 2009 6:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Buehler's foot is injured

by dcfanz on Dec 7, 2009 6:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Well that's a good point.

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Dec 7, 2009 6:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

but I get your point if he makes 1 out of every 2, he'll be exactly like Folk

by dcfanz on Dec 7, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Buehler's foot is injured

He can kick off but can’t try a 57 yarder. Come on

by cow_fanatic on Dec 7, 2009 9:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Holder or Kicker, who freakin' knows?

What I can say for sure is those two looking at each other after the missed kick can’t be allowed to continue. We don’t need that kind of knee-jerk finger pointing on this team. I thought we were done with that. Personally I think Folk is using McBriar for an excuse, and McBriar isn’t helping it by continuing to make little mistakes. Where does it go next? McBriar starts muffing punts because he’s psyched out about holding?

I didn’t pay much attention before the missed kick, but on the extra point after Austin’s TD Folk banged it straight through and it would have been straight from 50.

Folk or McBriar? They are BOTH contributing to missed FG’s and they need to clear out their heads and get back to the basics.

Last night I lay in bed looking up at the stars in the sky and I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"

by White Wolf on Dec 7, 2009 6:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

but, Madden was right

I remember broadcaster John Madden used to point out that it was pretty much always that, after a miss, the kicker will look at the holder.

by eliason on Dec 7, 2009 9:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i wanted Buehler to kick the 57 yarder. Hes got way more leg than Folk and it was cold. Should have give it a shot.

"On a journey to anywhere you can draw your own map."

by saidseven on Dec 7, 2009 6:17 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I have faith coach D will figure this out.

Yesterday was the first time the STs have let us down all year. I expect it will be the last.

by Benthere on Dec 7, 2009 6:33 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I agree

But changes must be made if one of our players just can’t for whatever reason do his job. I feel bad for Nick Folk, something is terribly wrong and nobody can figure out what it is. My thoughts are that he needs hypnosis or something. I’m really not kidding, I’ve heard of athletes doing that kind of thing, especially if the problem is between the ears.

Just becuz you put yer boots in the oven don't make it bread

by dcfansinceiwasababy on Dec 7, 2009 6:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

well

that answers my question about buehler, apparently the coaches have zero confidence in him. Thats a little concerning to me, but maybe thats because of his toe as well.

I’m all for a change. and I don’t care if its Romo need be. The guy blew one single snap, and it now sounds like we’ve blown about 3-4 this year.

Coach D has some work to do this week.

by foyesboys on Dec 7, 2009 7:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

sounds more like they are trying to cover for folk, trying to spin the problem instead of fix it.

Because wade doesn’t like cutting players during the season.

by just4fun on Dec 7, 2009 7:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly. That has become a recurring theme in Dallas.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 6:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

to be fair

folk has 2 great years on his resume and with buehler hurt, we don’t exactly have another option.

by foyesboys on Dec 8, 2009 8:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe We Should Have Drafted the Other Guy

I think he is playing for Green Bay; he has a strong leg but was considered a bit of a head case. As I recall, we picked first and took Folk, leaving the other guy on the Board.

by Iowacowboy on Dec 7, 2009 7:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Where were you when he was kicking and making consecutive 52 yarders?

Not here. And not with the same opinion.

I’m not sure if he can regain that level, but if he does, he will continue to be the right pick.

Viva México! Go Cowboys!

by Chandus on Dec 7, 2009 11:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Mason Crosby

he is a great kicker. Played at CU. has made clutch FG and can make long FG
no stats on me now…. In practice said to of made a 70 yarder

"What excites me the most is when a coach calls a timeout and chews out his forward because I just dunked on his head."
--Karl Malone

by spurscitizen on Dec 8, 2009 8:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

folk is the freaking problem, blaming the holder is weak. He's done this year. time to sign

a new kicker. As with so many times in the past, no one is accountable on this team. Cut folk, sign a new kicker. This shouldn’t be a big deal. Wade has trouble with player management decisions.

by just4fun on Dec 7, 2009 7:31 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I don't think Folk did blame the holder

I think McBriar blamed himself – Folk didn’t say anything.

"Where's Woody? - We need another Darren Woodson

by BoyfromOz on Dec 7, 2009 8:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

how the hell can..

an NFL kicker(DB) NOT be able to kick field goals??? WTF?

by fiverings37 on Dec 7, 2009 7:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Never kicked a field goal before but...

Looks a lot like a golf swing to me. Rhythm and confidence equals success. Folk has lost one or the other or both. Folk was solid gold last year with Brad holding so I think Mat is the problem. Again, it doesn’t take much to screw up a golf swing, ask Tiger (or Elin).

by Keys80 on Dec 7, 2009 8:10 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Last year

He’s also coming off an injury which could be affecting his stroke. McBriar isn’t the only change from ’08.

I’d be interested in seeing what people with real football chops think of this. I thought McBriar taking the blame for it was an ‘I am Spartacus’ move. There are only about five people around here who know less about football than I do (and they’re all Iggles fans).

by RickT on Dec 7, 2009 8:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

and just as in golf you need a good lie to hit a good shot

(unless you’re a PGA pro), a kicker needs good hold to hit a good kick. Same difference.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 7, 2009 9:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i dont understand this

Wade seems to not be able to make player personnel decisions. Folk is struggling, how do you solve the problem? Simple you give your rookie kicker a shot cause the worst he could do is duplicate folks performance.

Barber, I just don’t understand it. It seems to me that choice must fumble at least 4-5 times in practice to warrant this type of playing time. He obviously is a better runner right now. Give barber 3rd downs, goaline and 4th qtr clock run down carries. Switch choice with felix ever other series, how obvious is it, MY GOD!!!

Why is pat watkins on this damn team! Mostly due to injury, but I’m on a rant right now!

Why can’t we tackle in december, seriously, what the hell do they put in the water?

by TONYINCC on Dec 7, 2009 9:28 PM CST via mobile reply actions 0 recs

actually Beuhler could do a lot worse than Folk

you talk as if Folk misses almost every kick and thats not true.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 7, 2009 10:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i disagree

And am not going to argue with you abou this, your man-crushes are well documented, and when you see things a certain way, that is the end all be all. SO…… I will just disagree on this one.

by TONYINCC on Dec 7, 2009 10:30 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs

there's nothing to argue about, Folk is a better kicker than Beuhler

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 7, 2009 10:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If he wasn't, they would've given him a shot already.

Wade was pretty much out of countenance when asked about bringing out Buehler to placekick.

by Aaron Novinger on Dec 7, 2009 10:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

well, I guess the holder for G.B.(Matt Flynn) kinda shows

you how important it is to hold the ball correctly doesn’t he? For those that want to blame Folk, might wanna look at the replay of Mason Crosby’s kick. He’s normally pretty good too. .

by texstar on Dec 7, 2009 11:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Special teams

Watch some prior games and you will see Watkins is normally the first guy down , and has made some good stops……….

by oldtimer on Dec 8, 2009 8:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

4 things have to happen on a FG.

The snapper has to to hit the holder in the hands, the holder has to place the ball (laces away), get his hands out of the way, keep the ball upright, the kicker has to hit the ball about 1-1.5 inches from the surface. This all has to happen in the space of 1-1.5 second(s). Common problems: The long snapper is off target, the holder bumbles the hold or the kicker misses the “sweet spot” just enough to veer left or right..From what I heard about Sundays’ miss, McBriar “reached” for the snap and put the ball down an inch or less from where Folk had “spotted” where he was going to kick. It is almost impossible to adjust this in real time. The kicker is staring at the spot he expects the ball to be placed. When it is either further of closer than you expect, you’re screwed.

by Benthere on Dec 7, 2009 11:41 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Hey Wade

Don’t change it now!
Really, what’s more likely, that these guys can work on it and inprove-
Or, that past midseason, in the most pressure-packed games, a new person is going to head out there and do juuuust fiiine.
P Crayton? No thank you. I’ll take McBriar.

I smell another late-season coaching stupidity-pill being offered here, I hope he ignores this.

by Realist Larry on Dec 8, 2009 12:33 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I'm not going to pretend..

That I know what it takes to kick FGs or to be a good holder. But…

I want to hear one thing from Wade. “This is a problem, if the guys we have can’t fix it we’ll need to make a change.”

This is a perfectly reasonable and rational approach to solving a problem with the team and though I think it is too late to bring in a new kicker at this point in the season it would at least send a message of accountability to the team. Too often people seem hesitant to speak ill of their kickers as they are fragile. But, Folks’ kicks take momentum away from this team and put more pressure on the other phases of the game.

by SDTrueblue on Dec 8, 2009 2:45 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I think he did say that in his PC

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Dec 8, 2009 7:30 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

something has got to change

i see poeple saying no change this late in year. um hello.. have you noticed how many folk has mised in his last 7 attemps??? not good for a nfl kicker!!! i can do better than that and i my lil girl can kick better than me!! lol.. im a huge folk fan. last year he came out i knew it was good. but something is wrong and we need to change. hell look at saints. their kicker missed a couple and in no time they had new kicker out there and poof they making field goals again. i dunno if kicker and holder have problems where holder may be pissed at kicker and is saying ill show you or if the kicker jus having bad season. whatever it is we need mayber new holder and new kicker. something. field goals help win games and we need to make them!!! that being said we also need to learn to tackle and light a match under somebodys ass and make them run faster!!! i dont see a 264 pound man outrunning the whole squad!!! come on!! chit!!! now i got that out!!! cowboys you better than this. get rid of ofensive coach and lets win some games!!!

by dhutch469 on Dec 8, 2009 8:30 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

overreaction?

"What excites me the most is when a coach calls a timeout and chews out his forward because I just dunked on his head."
--Karl Malone

by spurscitizen on Dec 8, 2009 8:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe a little, but not a whole lot. There are things to fix, but the season is far from over.

"Help, it's hot and dark in here and someone is laughing." Taco Bell

by GunsUp on Dec 8, 2009 9:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Skins just fired their kicker

After 10 good games, he had 2 bad ones….

http://www.redskins.com/gen/articles/Redskins_Sign_Gano__Release_Suisham_92023.jsp

Forget about winning and losing; forget about pride and pain. Let your opponent graze your skin and you smash into his flesh; let him smash into your flesh and you fracture his bones; let him fracture your bones and you take his life. Do not be concerned with escaping safely - lay your life before him. - Bruce Lee

by LucyFur3d on Dec 8, 2009 1:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs