I Want A Dominant Defense!
by beautifultyrant on Mar 18, 2009 6:49 PM CDT
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PrintA very wise and learned scholar from the school of rock once sang “you can’t always get what you want.” Well… all I want is a dominant defense. I’m talking about a top three defense. Hey, let’s go for the gusto, the number one rated defense! Is that too much to ask? I don’t think so. If Pittsburgh and Baltimore have one, why can’t the Cowboys? I wouldn’t ask this if the Cowboys were many players away, but the Cowboys, I feel, are only a few players away from being dominant.
Let’s start with DeMarcus Ware. He is as dominant as they get. Some people thought I was crazy to suggest that Ware didn’t deserve the highest contract for a defensive player in the NFL. But Ware wasn’t dominant at the beginning of the 2008 season. Yeah, he averaged about one sack a game the first eleven games, but many of the sacks were during garbage time and not game-changing. Then suddenly, like Rafael wrote in one of his post several months ago, the light went on for Ware, he developed a couple of rush moves, and he became virtually unstoppable. Towards the end of the year, Ware did play like the best defensive player in the NFL. The Cowboys need to keep building around him by adding a good pass rusher from the other side and that will be one way of becoming dominant.
I know this sounds like a paradox; Jay Ratliff is a beast, but he is undersized. However, Ratliff is capable of making game-changing plays on defense. Just put on the tape, keep your eye on Ratliff and see for yourself how disruptive he is. He is the second best defensive player on the team, he’s cat quick, and he’s disruptive. Did I happen to say he’s disruptive? The only knock I have on Ratliff is that he plays too much and therefore tires as the game goes on. He is, after all, undersized. The Cowboys need to get Ratliff a partner in crime, a hefty back up that’s a change of pace guy and that relieves and rotates with him. If the Cowboys can find one through free agency or the draft, they’re on their way to becoming a dominant defense. Igor Olshansky and Marcus Spears are fine; they’re not going to get a ton of sacks but they’re going to hold up well against two blockers and stop the run.
By signing Keith Brooking, the Cowboys instantly upgraded its LB corps. He’s going to be a tackling machine next to Bradie James. He won’t get pushed around like Zach Thomas. Bobby Carpenter and a future draft pick will provide depth.
The starters in the secondary are fine. Mike Jenkins will flourish in Henry’s place and Terrance Newman is one of the best five cornerbacks in the league (if he can avoid the injury bug). I’m assuming that Sensabaugh and Hamlin are going to be the starters at safety. Hamlin missed a couple of tackles, well let me rephrase that, he missed the two biggest tackles in Texas Stadium history and fans and media penned him as a non-tackling safety. Hamlin can still tackle and hit. Just ask receivers. Sensabaugh, I’m assuming, and I hope I assume correctly, is an upgrade over Roy Williams, Patrick Watkins, or Keith Davis, at least that’s what I’ve heard. The Cowboys need to add depth in the secondary, both a cornerback and a safety and the Cowboys will become a dominant defense.
That’s a total of five players. Add those players to the Cowboys and Wade Phillips’ defensive play-calling and the ‘Boys are on the verge of becoming a dominant defense. Maybe I’m being overly optimistic, but hopefully, if the Cowboys try real hard, they’ll get what they need, and I’ll get what I want, A DOMINANT DEFENSE!
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Scandrick was the third best player on the defense last year.
He needs to see as much time as possible.
Yeah...
I say let him compete with Jenkins for the starting job. Scandrick did an excellent job in the slot though.
by beautifultyrant on Mar 18, 2009 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Does...
anybody know how good Sensabaugh is?
by beautifultyrant on Mar 18, 2009 7:38 PM CDT reply actions
He's better than any safety on our team not named Hamlin.
I don’t know that he’s the answer long term at safety, but he’ll probably have a chance to prove it like Hamlin did last year. I think he had 4 INT’s last year which was 3 more than all our safeties combined. He’ll probably be playing more in the box with the Cowboys but who knows?? Wade may like what he sees out of him and make him and Hamlin interchangeable. Move them around pre-snap to give the QB different looks.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
He's better than Hamlin
He really had a breakout season. In 13 games, he produced a ton of big plays. He’s also very young. DraftDaddy, ESPN, and many other sites had him as the 2nd rated FA Safety behind the Franchised Atogwe.
He’s fast, can cover, and is a big hitter. Perfect Strong Safety.
Res firma mitescere nescit
Can he "sensetheball"?
If so, we’ll have an easy nickname for him.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I believe
he can really help this defense. No, he’s not a great player. But he is solid and adds a major component in consistency. Hamlin, it seems like, played beside a different safety every couple of snaps. I think (or hope) that a solid partner could go a long way in upping Hamlins play and thus the overall effectiveness of the secondary.
"I feel like a million bucks...a million and 81 bucks." T.O.
by D.WareDaWhiteWomenAt? on Mar 19, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure it will
Hamlin I don’t think has ever lined up next to Davis before last year. Also both were hurting near the end of the year anyways…also I think when he missed TC it really hurt him.
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 1:44 AM CDT up reply actions
The Play
last year isn’t exactly setting the bar to beat very high. I don’t think Wade would have gone for him if he was a slug, but he’s not a household name either.
I dont think
he’s good enough to fullfill your (our) wishes of a dominant D. Good enough to keep the seat warm if we get that dominant S in the draft
How..
Do you expect Dallas to be ranked among the best defense in the league, when their division rivals have better defenses?
~Texas Massacre 08~
Look man...
Dallas showed flashes having a dominant defense last year during a three game stretch against the Steelers, Giants, and Ravens. Now if they can be consistent all year, they will have a top defense.
by beautifultyrant on Mar 18, 2009 9:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Seeing as how
Wade will have control of the defense the full season, I’m a firm believer we will see a drastic improvement over last year.
I believe..
The defense didn’t play all that good in the Ravens game. Flacco had a good game except for that fumble in the first quarter.
~Texas Massacre 08~
That, is one huge jump!
From 3 games to a whole season!
You have faith.
I’ll take a D ranked between #5-10, and that isn’t a leader in penalties…..please?
by Realist Larry on Mar 19, 2009 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions
If we cut down those..
We might be top ranked on both ends =)
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
This
I’m not so certain about:
“By signing Keith Brooking, the Cowboys instantly upgraded its LB corps”
It depends on if you think Brooking is better than the guy he's replacing.
I think at this point Brooking is an upgrade over Thomas. He also has the size that Thomas doesn’t and experience playing this position in a 3-4 under Wade. So I certainly think we’ve instantly upgraded that LB position. How much we’ve upgraded it remains to be seen.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
to me it is a wash
two mid-thirties, former pro-bowlers, both extremely professional and accomplished, bringing you 100-tackle years and not a lot of mistakes. The fact that Thomas prefers a 4-3 does not mean that he did not do his job effectively. Brooking is not a big guy, though official roster weights are often not upgraded since a guy’s rookie year so the idea that he won’t get “pushed around” seems a little specious. In addition, by all accounts, both are only 2-down players, with Carpenter (or someone else hopefully) coming in to take over Burnett’s role. Unless there is some metric to measure Thomas’ ineffectiveness last year, it seems that the most likely thing to happen, is more of the same, which is not a bad thing at all but hardly an “instant upgrade”.
lol.....yeah, I have my doubts there as well.....LB is our biggest need..imo...
not saying a LB should be chosen first pick though, as I see only two worthy of 51…Barwin and Sintim…,and I don’t expect either to be there waiting for us……
I think
Brooking is enough for this year. They can also draft Larry English or Sidbury if they are there.
by beautifultyrant on Mar 18, 2009 9:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I really don't think we will stay at 51.
I also believe a safety is going to be picked with that 1st pick.
"If your good at something never do it for free." - The Joker
by houseofprime on Mar 18, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
who's behind Brooking ? who's behind James ? who's behind Ware ?
we need at least two LB’s drafted…..if not three….heck a FA camp casualty as well…Derrick Brooks to play nickle LB ??
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 18, 2009 10:09 PM CDT reply actions
Didn't Tampa take Brooks off on 3rd down this year?
"If your good at something never do it for free." - The Joker
by houseofprime on Mar 18, 2009 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions
I am not sold at our other linebacking spot which nobody mentions
Spencer needs to fill this role but he just shows flashes of greatness but then is lost in games we need to get ellis out of here though before he starts crying again in camp if we release T.O. Ellis should have been gone years ago.
Yeah...
I wrote a post about cutting Ellis the other day. Some people thought that was stupid, but I think that’s best for the team. I think Ellis is a very nice guy, but he’s easily raplacable.
by beautifultyrant on Mar 19, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions
he's definitely not easily replaceable
I got news for you, quality pass rushers don’t grow on trees.
In Romo we Trust
I agree with that
he’s a pain, but he’s one guy who has never brought any of that stuff on the field.
he’s a good solid backup at this point in his career, and will be a starter when either Spencer or Ware gets hurt, which they will sooner or later.
by Realist Larry on Mar 19, 2009 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Bite ur tongue..
Ware is invincible
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
A Dominant Defense? Compare with the Steelers -
Ok, I hate the Steelers, cause they beat us in the Super Bowl a couple times in the 70’s, but since they had the #1 Defense in 2008, lets compare anyway.
Just a couple of stats:
Points Allowed Per Game:
PIT – 13.9
DAL – 22.8 (huge difference)
Interceptions:
PIT – 20
DAL – 8 (abysmal)
Passes Defensed:
PIT – 107
DAL – 68 (no comparison)
Yards Allowed Per Game:
PIT – 237.2
DAL – 294.3 (difference of 57 yards per game)
Yards Allowed Rushing Per Game:
PIT – 80.2
DAL – 106.6 (anything over 100 is unacceptable)
Yards Allowed Passing Per Game:
PIT – 156.9
DAL – 187.7 (difference of 30.8 yards per game)
Total Plays Allowed Over 20 yards in 2008:
PIT – 27
DAL – 47 (I’m gonna vomit)
I don’t think that adding Brooking, Sensabaugh, and Olshansky is going to make us the #1 Defense.
Neither is replaing Henry with Jenkins.
Will these personnel changes help improve our Defense? I think, YES!
But about the only real thing we’ve got going for us right now is SACKS, and that is all about WARE!
A guy can dream!
Now you have to mess it up with stats. Kiddin’!!!
by beautifultyrant on Mar 19, 2009 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions
To gauge our true potential
We need to redo this exercise with two sets of Dallas stats: before and after Wade took over the playcalling.
Everything's looking up, Milhouse!
by accidental innuendo on Mar 19, 2009 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions
You're on to something.
Maybe BishopWest can figure it out.
by beautifultyrant on Mar 19, 2009 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey Bishop
accidental innuendo has a good idea. Think you could figure it out?
by beautifultyrant on Mar 19, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps I could do the research
but I don’t really remember at which juncture Wade took over the play calling?
OK - Found It
Wade announced the “take over” of play calling on Defense on Oct. 22, 2008, so his first game to call was actually Oct 26, 2008 which was the BUCs and DAL in week 8.
For starters:
Win / Loss Record:
Brian Stewart – 4 Wins (at CLE, PHI, at GB, CIN) and 3 Losses (WAS, at ARI, at STL)
Wade Phillips – 5 Wins (TB, at WAS, SF, SEA, NYG) and 4 Losses (at NYG, at PIT, BAL, at PHI)
Winning Percentage:
Brian Stewart – 75%
Wade Phillips – 80%
Opponent’s Points:
Brian Stewart – 175 (or average of 25 points per game for 7 games)
Wade Phillips – 190 (or average of 21 points per game for 9 games)
Away Record:
Brian Stewart – 2 and 2 (or 50)
Wade Phillips – 1 and 3 (or 33)
Home Record:
Brian Stewart – 2 and 1 (or 66)
Wade Phillips – 4 and 1 (or 80)
More stats forthcoming……
an improvement....
but still nowhere where it should be…maybe with TC under Wade’s full attention they can improve more…also with some more of Wade’s guys in there it will help with everyone buying into their role and with some improvement with our safeties we just might be in the top 5
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions
If Wade wants our D to be dominant then he needs to recognize how badly penalties have hurt us.
Instead of making excuses like “the Giants committed a lot of penalties too” or something like that. Our defense has the same problem our offense has: they beat themselves.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
beautifultyrant
I have recorded the stats I promised – they are under a new post called “Is The Defense Better When Wade Calls The Shots”
It is a lengthy post and thought it would be better to itself.
Feel free to find the info there :)
I thought our D........
improved greatly when Wade took over.Our D will improve with the subtraction of Roy Williams and Pacman.
I don’t think Jerry is through.He might just get Peppers but more likely to trade for a player who is an upgrade over some of our suswpects.
by TCB Orange Dino on Mar 19, 2009 12:19 AM CDT reply actions
Peppers is impossible
Gotta’ re-sign Ware. They couldn’t afford both. Plus it’d be entirely unnecessary. All they really need is for one of the young guys, maybe even a draft pick, to show up. Spencer could turn out to be a player. They still do need depth at both outside linebacker positions, though. We’re woefully thin there. I’m personally an advocate of moving Carp back outside, if only because they desperately need another body, just in case something happens.
Epic Fail since 1985
by the red scare on Mar 19, 2009 12:33 AM CDT up reply actions
5 games, and 2 of those were the Baltimore and Philly games.
Doesn’t he get some of the blame for what, as a fan for 37 years, was the worst meltdown I’ve ever seen of a team at the end of a season?
by Realist Larry on Mar 19, 2009 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know...
The ’83 Cowboys had a pretty bad meltdown as well. That team went from having an excellent 12-2 record after 14 games to then losing 3 straight blow outs (including a 1 and done loss at home in the playoffs).
0 = The number of Super Bowls the Eagles have won.
Didn't we have a top 10 D this year?
And last year? I’d say that’s a pretty good defense.
But I do see what you’re saying. The only reason I don’t think it’s possible is because of all the money we have tied up in our offense. This isn’t Pittsburgh or Baltimore. Those teams have all their star power on the defensive side of the ball, and rely on decent QB play and run game to not ruin it for their defense. Dallas has all the makings for an explosive offense. A top 10 D is actually a really good thing to have, especially if your offense can score points.
Epic Fail since 1985
There are a few differences in the Boys and balt/pit..
First off….Big man in the middle….Balt has Ngata and Pitt has Hampton…if this FA pool wasn’t so week with NT we might have seen Rat move over but without a sure thing he stays put.
Secondly….Good SS play, Polumalu is very good and Leonard played well….Willie..not so much, Sensabaugh is an upgrade but by how much…
But….
We are close….on a call if there is one flat tires you can’t drive it….We did upgrade or equal out every position we lost, we will just have to see how much difference it makes.
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 3:19 AM CDT reply actions
The NT is the key
…and Ratliff can’t hold up over a full 16.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
He has before.
I don’t think a huge NT is all that necessary—just a good, quality backup to give Rat a blow is all that’s needed.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 19, 2009 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess Wade thinks we have an adequate backup now...
http://cowboysblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2009/03/is-the-backup-nose-tackle-already-on-the.html
If we get another NT that pans out in minicamps we still might see Rat at DE…..
Could Spears be a backup?
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions
That pretty much means that if they draft a NT, it won't be until the 6th or 7th.
Wade would rather see if he can muster a Bowen-type backup at NT with Siavii, while having the capability to slide Spears in there as the emergency 3rd quarterb Nose Guard.
I’m rootin’ for Siavii. He’s a Duck!
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 19, 2009 9:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Disagree
they need a big plugger who can occupy two blockers. That is just not Ratliff.
The defense Wade runs won’t work without it.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
It will if you have more supportive ILBs and SSs.
The signing of Olshansky signifies that there is no moving Ratliff to end. A big, fatty in the middle would only be a role player. Why limit the position to a body type? We have to big DEs to help stymie the line.
I just don’t see them reaching for some NT in the 2nd or 3rd. They obviously think that whatever they go into TC with is gonna be a better fit than Tank.
Just because Wade had some massive NT in San Diego doesn’t mean he can tweak his line to accomodate the awesomeness of Ratliff. He’s high motor as is—meaning rotating him with a decent backup is all that is needed. We don’t need a Shaun Rogers or Grady Jackson. This is a high motor 34 scheme.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Stephen Cooper and Matt Wilhelm
Nobodies.
But not nobodies because they were allowed to run to the ball because of Jamal Williams. Ratliff doesn’t allow our LB’s to do the same things late in games.
I appreciate your view of Olshansky, but in my mind he is a player who hasn’t stayed healthy the last two seasons. It’s like counting on Miles Austin. I’d love to, but computer says no.
I love Ratliff, but 305 is just too light to be an elite NT in the 3-4.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Pro Bowl isn't elite?
What about Kragen (Denver) and Culp (Houston). Both played NT under Wade and each was around 280.
While I agree that a 340+ would be “ideal”, also remember that most of those guys usually burn out after 3 or 4 years. Even Wilfork and Williams have show signs of diminishing returns.
Res firma mitescere nescit
Kragen and Culp...
Love the historical reference, BTW.
My question would be this;
What was the average weight of an OG during those years? Were they as big as Andrews and Bigg? And centers? they routinely top 300 pounds now…what does Gurode weigh?
There is a reason they have weight classes in MMA, boxing and wrestling. The laws of physics cannot be altered.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
About the same percentage gains
The best teams like Oakland and Pittsburgh had very big lines. But percentage wise, both Culp and Kragen were very undersized, yet produced for a number of years at NT.
And your MMA analogy is just as flawed. There are middle and light heavies that fight above their weight classes, just like boxing (Evander Holyfield, anyone?).
The point is that a 300 lb. Nose Tackle can be effective and Ratliff proved it. Not maybe. Not potentially. Absolutely proved that he could do it, do it well, and do it consistently.
Physics has nothing to do with it. DE’s give up 50-75 lbs regularly. Talent, ability, and desire play much more a role than whether or not a guy has more girth. Otherwise, we’d have the best OL in the NFL by a long measure.
For more examples, why was L’Roi Glover able to very successfully man the nose for BP at 280 lbs? While these are the exceptions to the rule, Ratliff is exceptional. And a Pro Bowl exception.
Res firma mitescere nescit
The Cowboys have always tried to be a very balanced football.
It’s just always been their way. They may never have had the best all around defense or offense the NFL has ever seen at any point in time. But they have had some of the most balanced teams the NFL has ever seen with teams that won championships by playing at a high level in all phases of the game.
The present day Cowboys are not far from achieving the same thing. I’d very happily take a defense that was, say ranked 5th in the NFL if it was pared with an offensive ranked 3rd in the NFL and special teams play also ranked in the top 5. There are many ways to win a championship and the Cowboys’ "way" is just as valid an approach as say the Steelers.
0 = The number of Super Bowls the Eagles have won.
we would need to acquire a dynamic
ball hawking safety in order to achieve elite status. Hopefully we get that safety in this years draft.
In Romo we Trust
DOMINAAAAAAAAAAAAAATE!
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 19, 2009 12:54 PM CDT reply actions
I saw
on footballsfuture.com that Marcus Tubbs was still available as a free agent. He’s 6’3 and 320 lbs. Could he be the answer at back up NT? Is he over his injuries?
by beautifultyrant on Mar 19, 2009 4:37 PM CDT reply actions
Our defense will be as good as...
our Nose Tackle and secondary allow us to be.
Said differently, as goes the NT and the DB’s, so goes the Dallas D.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
We have one of the best NTs in the game.
He’s a ProBowler and arguably one of the best 7th round picks this side of the 7 Round Draft.
Ratliff is the beast of this D, but the DB’s have gotta make plays, too. What’s key is that both of these positions are attended to in the draft for depth and development purposes. It’s nice not to have to worry about finding starters, so that value picks become the goal.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 19, 2009 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Again, I think that is wrong...
The top NT’s in the league are;
Casey Hampton – 325 pounds (340 in reality)
Haloti Ngata – 345 pounds
Vince Wilfork – 325 pounds (he is 340 if he is an ounce)
Jamal Williams – 348 pounds (350+)
Shaun Rogers – 350 pounds (who really knows?)
Then there is Rat at 305, who we expect to tie up Shawn Andrews AND Jamal Jackson in Philly? We want him to tie up Shaun O’Hara AND Chris Snee in New York? Casey Rabach AND Randy Thomas? And we want him to do it for 16 games and the playoffs? Every single one of Dallas’ starting o-linement weighs as much or more than Ratliff.
I’m sorry, people can believe that he can do this over the long haul if they want, but if we don’t find a better fit at NT, we will see his play decline or see him wear down and get injured. Then, trust me, people on this blog will deride him over his big contract and how he was overrated, blah, blah, blah.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Shaun Rodgers has failed to report to the team....
For the second season in a row, I advocate aquiring him………
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions
I love Rogers, but isn't he is too pricey?
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
what's too pricey ?? cost less than Canty, and a wee bit more than Ellis..
If he fits under the cap, he’s more than affordable..
BUT…Cleveland would take a 9 milliuon cap hit if they traded him, and spent multiple draft picks and a player to aquire him..
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
CRN1......its a great idea...
the thing is with all the draft picks mixed in with every pick costing fully against the cap wouldn’t it be smarter to trade for a veteran…Randy Moss for a 4th rounder…If we can’t trade w/ anyone to unload some picks why not see what Cleveland is thinking….I wouldn’t mind giving up a pick which has a 50/50 shot at best to even make the team for a guy who we can almost pencil in as a starter…..
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 1:53 AM CDT up reply actions
also....
Forgot this part…at a position that we haven’t truly have filled since we switched over to a 3-4…Rat is a DE, he can rush the passer, play the run, goes non stop and think of him getting a one on one w/ a guard, he could help Ware have less double teams greatly which would make QBs throw the ball real quick which would lead to more INT and make our D better overall
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 1:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm all for trading our #51 and #113 picks for Rogers, would also include Carpenter in any deal , if needed..
would only be responsible for his base salary over the next 4-5 years…
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 21, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Including Carp in a trade
means we’d also have to give up future draft picks just to convince some team to take him.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I figure a few 7th rounders and Carp could move us up a few spots in the draft
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 22, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe Bill still wants him...
Last year they wanted him so why not ask again…Bill drafted him he must know what he wants to do with him…
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 23, 2009 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions
I disagree.
First, Rat can never be considered overrated. Sure, he’s an overachiever; but he’s made himself into that kind of player, ala Jason Ferguson.
Sure, I expect them to find depth at the position. I do not think they are in a rush to grab another starter, though. All those guys were rather high draft choices and dominant at the college level. Who can Dallas target in the draft to compare with one of them?
This year, I think they find a quality backup or two to rotate with Rat. Maybe next year they’ll splurge on a fatty, especially if they want to move Rat over Spears or something.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
But you're making my point for me...
Ratliff’s strengths are his motor, tenacity and quick feet. That isn’t what is needed at the NT spot. He fits the job description for a base end; able to stand up an offensive tackle and able to penetrate and create some push on passing downs.
Ratliff could turn into a Ty Warren and become elite. He will never be able to be Vince Wilfork and THAT is what we need to become a dominant defense.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Wilfork is a UFA after this season....can't wait ?
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
He will get resigned...
and I would rather develop one from the inside….CRN1 what is the outlook for next years NTs…if you by chance know
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 2:25 AM CDT up reply actions
next years rookie class ??? Here is draft eligible only NT prospects for next season...
Next year has a much better group of NT prospects than this year…
The best NT i’ve seen in a long time, and will be locked on all season is :
Ndamukong Suh – Nebraska – 6’4" 305lbs -Top 10 prospect
The other top round NT’s
DeMarcus Granger – Oklahoma – 6’3" 306lbs – 1st round
Terrence Cody – Alabama – 6’5" 368lbs – 1st round
Next Tier :
Vince Oghobaase – Duke – 6’6" 310lbs
Jared Odrick – Penn St. – 6’5" 308lbs
Dan Williams – Tennessee – 6’3" 312lbs
Ekom Udofia – Stanford – 6’2" 310lbs
Boo Robinson – Wake Forrest – 6’2" 325lbs
Jay Ross – East Carolina – 6’3" 306lbs
Al Wood – LSU – 6’4" 323lbs
Torrell Troup – UCF – 6’3" 322lbs
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 21, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Ahh Cody..
I wanted him this year….good thing he stayed..now we have a good chance at him
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 23, 2009 12:17 AM CDT up reply actions
Can you say "FRANCHISE TAG"?
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
True
Our DB has been our weak link for a few years now…..Hopefully we can finally see the turn around
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 19, 2009 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions
When I went and looked at the stats it was amazing to see how the safeties were the top guys with interceptions.
5 of the top 6 guys with INT’s were safeties. It’s a coverage position these days. We have GOT TO come out of this draft with a safety who can cover.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Excellent Observation kameleon
A ball hawking safety would cut down on opposing QBs thrashing our defense on the long balls.
30+ yard passes on our defense in 2008:
McNabb to Jackson – 61 yards
Rodgers to Driver – 50 yards
Campbell to Moss – 53 yards
Warner to Fitzgerald – 39 yards
Bulger to Avery – 42 yards
Garcia to Smith – 34 yards
Hill to Bruce – 34 yards
Hill to Davis – 47 yards
Hill to Zeigler – 30 yards
Hasselback to Carlson – 33 yards
Roethesburger to Holmes – 47 yards
McNabb to Buckhalter – 59 yards
Its Got To STOP!!!!!!!!!!!1
There isn't one who can do it on day 1 in the draft...
Even Delmas, who I grade out as a B to B+ player won’t be an answer this season.
Better to upgrade the pass rush and limit how much time they actually have to cover back there.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Not so fast, my fine feathered friend...
You like Barwin. He’s not the pass rushing OLB we need.
We need more discussion about who could potntially upgrade our rush.
How about Cody Brown from UConn?
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
lol....Barwin isn't a pass rushing OLB ???? could've fooled me...I actually think he's the best 3-4 OLB available in the whole draft, not named Orakpo or Ev Brown.
being a former Husky, I’ve got to see quite a bit of C Brown…and he’s really good, but he’s not as stout or strong, or fast as Conner Barwin…I would certainly take him if we trade down with out 3rd, or move up with our top 4th…..I would not select him at 51…He’ll need a few years in the stregth room, and needs to be developed, but a good blitzing option and special teamer from day one..
If you really like him, he’’ll be there in the middle of round 3 for us……He’s a bit light in his base for me..
http://www.draftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/olb/Cody-Brown.php
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Not THE OLB we need...
he’s only been at it one year.
It’s like Devin Thomas. I have to see it for more than a year to believe it.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
????? Cody Brown has NEVER played OLB either..
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Crap
Well…that’s a good point. But at least we know lighter DE’s can make the transition to OLB in the 3-4.
Okay, screw the both of ’em.
I’m back to Brace at #51.
HA!
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Barwin! Barwin! Barwin!
If you chant it enough it will come true….
Feb. 27 -- Veteran free agency signing period begins. Trading period begins.
April 25-26 -- NFL Draft
by APerfectStar on Mar 22, 2009 5:17 AM CDT up reply actions
I'd like to upgrade the pass rush, but how much realistically can we do that??
We led the league in sacks. We definitely weren’t perfect but that’s still pretty good. There’s room for a LOT more improvement at the safety position. I hope Sensebaugh is the answer as much as anyone but a B to B+ safety prospect is a big upgrade over what we had at the position last season.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
YES!
Because our sacks came from edge pressure, which is great, but it is middle pressure that makes a good defense great. Jim Johnson’s defenses are built on it. New England lives and dies on its middle pressure. The 3-4 generates middle pressure like this…
It all starts with the NT, who occupies the center and a guard, his goal being to make them take 1 to 1.5 steps backward (to either keep the QB from being able to step up or force the RB to slide laterally). The ILB’s have to maintain gap integrity and fill the appropriate hole according to wherever the package has them going (we stunk at that last year). The pass rushing OLB or elephant, or whatever you wanna call him, has to typically take on a OT and sometimes a back or TE who is in to help. The DE’s then, generally speaking, have to win one-on-one battles.
In the current iteration, Ratliff can hold the point and sometimes penetrate, but cannot consistently occupy two o-linemen. when he did occupy both blockers, Canty and Spears seldom won their one on one battles. It’s the brilliance of Ware and his lightning quick first step that caused havoc for some teams, but the teams who ran up the gut or had stud LT’s mitigated his impact.
I think Ratliff is a Ty Warren clone and may even be better than Warren if used properly. The problem, as Bigrigga rightly points out, is that there aren’t a lot of fatties out there who can play the nose well.
Regardless, the title of the post revolves around a dominant defense. IMO, regardless of who we find to man the Safety spots, ours WILL NOT be dominant until we find a true, widebody NT to play that spot and allows Ratliff to slide out to End in the base defense. I think he also can slide back in to DT on passing downs in a hybrid 4-3 package.
Even the greatest DB’s can only cover guys for so long. Easier to create pressure.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Please! Stop!
Ratliff was second on the team with QB pressures and had 7.5 sacks. That’s only 1/2 a sack less than Bradie James and Greg Ellis.
Further his production was far greater than your treasured widebodies:
NE’s Wilfork (2.0) – Never has had more than 2.
SD’s Williams (1.5) – Averages just under 1.2 a year with a single year at 4.0 sacks.
Again, I would also like one that could spell Ratliff on obvious run downs (like Brace), but your premise is simply wrong. We led the league in sacks with THE best NT in the league last year. Ratliff led the way.
Res firma mitescere nescit
Why is it...
that people use the stat lines to validate wreckless opinions rather than what they observe in than the games themselves?
Let’s play it your way…
You left out how in your stat vomit that Dallas was #16 in Yards per Carry Allowed and how SD and NE were better (and SD had horrible injuries across their front line and LB corps) or how we were #20 in scoring Defense (yet again, both those guys you mentioned were on better defenses with arguably lesser talent around them), or how we were last in sack-to-INT ratio in the league or how we were…oh never mind. You’re right, of course, he was the best NT in the league.
Let’s just use your logic…
Since Ratliff had better sack #‘s than any other NT I mentioned, he must be better than all of them. The only way you could say, "that’s not what I am saying" is to invalidate the logic altogether and you wouldn’t want to do that, right?
My point is this; if Rat can get 7.5 from the nose, how much more could he add if all he had to do was beat Tra Thomas instead of Shawn Andrews and Jamal Jackson?
Fighter, I appreciate your opinion and I don’t mean to devalue it, but the NT position in a 3-4 is NOT one that you measure by stats alone and surely not one to rank order by sacks. I think most people would tell you that Ratliff is not in the same class of NT’s as Hampton, Ngata and Wilfork despite his better fantasy football numbers.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
So you're saying NT is responsible for team rankings?
I’m not saying he’s the best 3-4 NT, I’m saying he’s perfect for the Phillips 3-4, especially against the pass. Getting pressure from the middle is far different than playing in space over the OT (who btw blocks Ware if they take Canty/Spears?). You’re not using any logic at all other than only a 350+ behemoth can make an effective NT. I’ve tried to debate that with facts.
A team that leads the NFL in sacks and pressures, which according to you starts with the NT, should get a little more credit at the NT position. Further, Tank played many of the early downs and, according to the coaches, was the biggest liability against the run.
Further, I’ve repeatedly stated I want a big mauler on 1st and 2nd downs, because our group was one of the leagues worst on 1st down YPC. But tackles, sacks, and most of all Pro Bowl invites (especially for a NT that has to compete with the 4-3 DTs that get many more stats) are relevant measures.
You keep dogging the guy saying we need someone bigger. I think you’re wrong and Wade has continually defended Rat at the spot. I trust the coaches’ opinion far more than even my own. I defer to their ratings. And they say you’re wrong.
Res firma mitescere nescit
I'm not dogging him, I am a big fan, but...
he’s out of position. Wade can defend him all he wants, but he isn’t the prototypical NT and if he was, Wade wouldn’t have to defend him in the first place, would he?
When you have arguably the best OLB in the league drawing doubles, usually other players get theirs, so again, my take is don’t be so quick to buy the hype with his stat line. You keep harping on his sack totals and if you look at the first 10 games, he got six sacks. In the last six? one and a half sack.
He is, in fact, getting worn down…
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
The best way to decide if Ratliff is an effective NT is not only with stats
but whether or not he did his job consistently. Can he be blamed if Canty didn’t play the run as well as he could have?? Or that Tank Johnson was a liability against the run?? When you watch the games Ratliff is doing his job in Wade’s 3-4 D. He’s getting pressure, collapsing the pocket, and making the tackle. Whether or not he can keep it up for much longer or not is a different question than whether or not he’s done it so far. Because the answer to that question is yes. He’s did it better than any other NT in the league last year IMO.
The thing is, we’d all love more pressure but pressure was not the problem last season. We had pressure. Got it from the center of the line and whichever end Ware was on. Got it from Ellis and James too. Pressure can only go so far though when a QB doesn’t even have to go through his reads. He can just chunk the ball deep when his WR’s get one on one with our safety.
I don’t think anybody’s opposed to getting a NT but I think the chance that we’re going to find one who plays the position as well as Ratliff is remote because Rat has shown that he’s one of the best. If we’re concerned with Ratliff not being rotated as much and being kept fresh then I think that’s a valid concern. We need someone who can take 15 or so plays a game away from him.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
I still like Brace at #51 if he is there...
as he could become an every down NT and allow Ratliff to slide out.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I've got no problem sliding out Rat if there's someone that can do the job too
I’m still not sure about Brace. I’m kind of schizophrenic around draft time about who I like and don’t like. If we did draft him though you won’t here me bit**ing about it. Is he a 3 down NT?? Or will he come out on passing downs??
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
I think he would come out
unless he flashed penetration ability…
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Why have him in there on passing downs..
let the guy get rest and have Rat and Spears/Olshansky in the middle with Ware/Ellis/Spencer on the outside
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 2:28 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm really getting tired of my inability to spell words right. It should be "hear". Damn it!!
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Typos are allowed on Blogs
It’s in the rules.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I love Brace
I’ve been a big proponent of his for awhile, but have finally succumb to Raf’s knowledge of Safety concerns, and generally the need for OL over DL.
If you have the following available, who do you pick?
-Gilbert, DE
-Unger, C
-Robinson, G
-Delmas, S
-Brace, NT
I’d beg the rest of the league to let me have all 5 and would sacrifice the remainder of the draft. I’ll even pitch in next year’s #1.
I think there is adequate safety depth (I really can’t tell the diff between the top 10), Guard (though Robinson is special), and even DT. I particularly like Dorrell Scott who should be available in Round 3 or even Round 4.
Since we have DE depth and the starters are set, that leaves Unger.
Yuch! Logic like that sucks.
Res firma mitescere nescit
I think I'd end up having to take Robinson. I think he can be a special player.
If all five of those guys are there, and it was up to me to make the choice, I’d be second guessing the hell out of myself.
I like Shipley as a Center prospect more anyway. Not quite as polished maybe but stronger, weighs a few pounds less but is shorter so he’s more squat. Penn St. rushed for 193 yards a game last year and had six 200 yard rushing games for a total of over 2519yards in 2007. 27 rushing TD’s and 4.8 YPC. In 2008 they rushed for 2671 yards, 36 TD’s, 5.23 YPC, and 205 yards a game. Their 2 main RB’s last season rushed for 6.47 YPC and 5.5 YPC respectively. The best thing about him is he can be had around the 5th round. Maybe end of the 4th.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Plus, their O-line only gave up 13 sacks last year.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
I like Ant Caldwell
A better prospect than Shipley…
And his strengths are his Intelligence and perfect snaps….
We need a smart guy cuz we have 2 rush defenses in our division, so basically at least 1/4 of our games in a season are against teams that like to exotic blitz so we need someone to make the right line calls….
Also to not have Romo have to run around to catch a bad snap ever again would be a blessing
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 23, 2009 12:21 AM CDT up reply actions
I like Caldwell too but I don't think there's much
if any dropoff from him to Shipley. Shipley’s a little quicker IMO and he’s stronger. When I have a center who may not be the biggest I at least want them strong and Shipley’s stronger. Both of them played for big time programs, both good run games, and Penn St.‘s was even a little better. I guess I can’t tell you how smart Shipley is. I can just point to production. I’d say that really the only thing I like about Caldwell over Shipley is that I think Caldwell can project to guard too.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Would it be a problem trading next years #1 in order for us to obtain a pick at the top of round 2 this year ???
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions
That's the general rule
You give one round higher in next year’s draft for the same general area (#20 in the round for us). So to move to the top, we’d still have to kick another pick or so to move up to the top.
Res firma mitescere nescit
I hate that idea.
Seldom works out that well.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
From a fan's perspective
The draft is not as much fun when your team doesn’t have a first-round pick.
Everything's looking up, Milhouse!
by accidental innuendo on Mar 21, 2009 7:41 AM CDT up reply actions
lol....which is why I wanna move up as close to rd 1 with a future pick, and worry about it later...
like govt money….lets just defer it to the next crop of prospects..
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 21, 2009 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
wish we could find a sucker every year
Everything's looking up, Milhouse!
by accidental innuendo on Mar 21, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions
I want to keep our first next year...
Even though we could probably trade again next year for a pick its not guaranteed and next year is strong in one of our needs..Safety….There are at about 4 first round prospects at safety next year… But with the Salary cap being all crazy this year it possible we can trade our first next year for a late first this year….Especially because everyone thinks the sky is falling in the Big D
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 23, 2009 12:24 AM CDT up reply actions
How about Peppers?
Have the Pats traded for him??…I wonder what it would take him to get him. I am guessing something like Spencer, Hurd/Crayton and some picks. Imagine with him lined up opposite Ware. I know i am stretching here….the money is just not enough to sign both Peppers and Ware to long term deals.
unless of course 2010 remains uncapped....
Muhahahaha….
0 = The number of Super Bowls the Eagles have won.
I don't want a team full of other team's superstars.
Why is that so popular? I think it provides false hopes. I want another dynasty, not a one night stand.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree...
But I bet if he goes the Patriots it will work. That team somehow always seem to get great play from other team’s superstars.
0 = The number of Super Bowls the Eagles have won.
They know how to turn them in to role players.
Their success has led to the stigma that egos are checked at the door in favor of the no “I” in team approach.
I wonder if Belichek has developed a personality Wonderlic-type test to give vets to see if they fit the system.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
We have a history of forking it up with big names from other teams. When was the last big name highly coveted Free Agent signing that elevated Dallas’ play?
You can’t say T.O. since only two teams coveted him. ;-)
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
here we go...only two teams coveted him....LMAO
we signed him within 12 hours of his release…..
by CowboysRnumba1 on Mar 20, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Leonard Davis? If not, then Deion.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 20, 2009 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice!
Deion certainly.
Bigg is on that path.
Still, not a good record on that front…
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
FA only around since 94
The first few years, we were net losers due to our dynasty.
The late 90’s/early 2000’s we were in cap purgatory.
Only recently has GM Jerry been spending like a Democrat. But other than Vanderjerk and Rivera’s injuries, there doesn’t seem to be that many misses.
Res firma mitescere nescit
mmm...
Charles Haley
Deion
Ray Donaldson
Rocket Ismail
La’Roi Glover
Glenn, Keyshawn, Fergie
Bledsoe…ok, this a stretch, but he and Vinny did help improve the team until Romo matured
T.O. – whether you like him or not, he was an improvement
Rivera – if only for 2 years
Bigg
And if you relax the highly coveted, you could add quite a few more. I’d even go with Hamlin because while we signed him to a one year deal in 07, he was a coveted FA in 08 after a Pro Bowl year.
Res firma mitescere nescit
Haley wasn't a free agent signee
I always liked Glover.
Deion was the best
Keyshawn never impressed me except for a big catch in San Diego.
Ferguson? Blah…
Vinny? No
Bledsloe may have hurt more than helped
Agree on T.O. as an upgrade, but he wasn’t highly coveted, just highly paid (dont tell CRN1 I said that)
Rivera reminds of back issues
Bigg is the real deal
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I wouldn't say any of those guys
were “highly coveted” FAs as 5blings was talking about, except Bigg and Deion.
Glover and T.O. were huge signings who elevated the team’s play. Haley was acquired via trade. The rest of the guys had to fill in for roster defeciencies and/or brought in to transform the team Tuna-style.
George Teague, Brock Marion, the Roy Williams-of-old: Where are you?
by Aaron Novinger on Mar 22, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think so....
I think you’re being perfectly optomistic. There is absolutely no reason we should have the number 1 or 2 defense in the league.
"Attitude reflects leadership." - Remember The Titans
Is Damarcus Ware a free agent?
i can’t find out anywhere eles i think he is though am i right
This year it comes down to....Who Wants It More!
1 year left.
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Dood...
If he was, you and the whole world would have known about it.
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
+100000000000
Everyone in the Milky Way would know
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 21, 2009 2:54 AM CDT up reply actions
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