DT: Seawright signing
by Eagles suck on May 20, 2009 7:29 PM CDT
42 comments
I didn't find anything written on the blog about the Seawright signing. Perhaps its so uninspired that no one commented? Or perhaps I just missed it.
Either way - my comments: why are we in love with players who have been out of the league? And are we really going to give a roster spot to a player who, while a clear need for us, couldn't make any other team's roster?
Spears will play NT? Unlikely. The kid got pushed around in the middle last year during pre-season. Next we'll try Cory Procter there in the middle.
Why oh why Jerry didnt you draft one DT?
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12 draft picks...
- 2nd oldest O-Line in the NFL… They draft ONE O-Lineman.
- Major depth issues at DT… Completely ignore it.
(clapping) Nice work, JJ!
When we were signing him
He told Wade “Coach I can do better”, well we shall see
"We play to win the game" - Herm Edwards
by nicholas.rodriguez on May 21, 2009 8:23 AM CDT reply actions
Jonas Seawright
Undrafted out of college
Zero sacks while at North Carolina
Didnt play football last year
1 career NFL tackle
Whew, now I feel better about the NT spot! And to think I was ever worried!
ok,
would you rather have back up NT or a nickle LB? would you rather have depth at NT or depth at Saftey (where starters aren’t that great to begin with). Would you rather have depth at NT or draft depth and future starters for OL? would you rather reach in the draft to fill a need or take best player available?
by CowboysFanatic on May 21, 2009 10:17 AM CDT reply actions
But that's what we did ... reach
Most every draft expert I read said Dallas reached at almost every pick. Jason Williams could have been had with our next pick. Robert Brewster could have been had two picks down the line. Butler, Williams, Smith, Hodge could also have been picked later.
The real value in a draft is picking guys where they belong. If they had done that, they could have added a NT and still got these same guys.
Another way to look at it is, do we need to have 12 OLBs on the roster going into camp? We can’t keep them all. So, why not pick a position in the draft that would actually have a shot at making the team?
not true
I have much more trust in Tom Ciskowski than these so called draft experts who are not employed as NFL GMs or scouts, so if you want to believe these guys go ahead, I’ll trust Tom and say they weren’t reaches.
Also, it is pure speculation on your part that our top picks would have been available later on, you don’t know that at all.
If you force a position in the draft and reach, more likely than not that player will bust. There is always next year for a NT to be drafted. You can’t draft every position in every draft.
In Romo we Trust
Of course its speculation
As is your defense of this draft class. Who knows, if these guys are all out of the NFL in 3 years you might be saying the same thing as I am.
I’m glad you have faith in Cis. I liked last year’s draft class a lot, so I know he’s got some ability in spotting talent. I just didnt like the philosophy of this draft. If we are as close as we think at a shot to win a title, why do we need 12 draftees? We wont be able to keep many of them on the roster. I would rather have packaged those picks and moved up and taken a shot at, for example, 2 more third rounders. Guys that have a chance at being a starter one day and not future back-ups. I’m not suggesting they reach for a player just because of the position, but you can position your draft picks where they belong with trades up and back.
For instance:
Early 2nd – Ron Brace, NT
Early 3rd – Jarron Gilbert, DE
Mid 3rd – Jason Williams, ILB
Late 3rd – Rashad Johnson, S
5th (Comp pick – cant be traded) – David Buehler, K
6th (Comp pick) – Stephen Hodge, S/LB
7th – Mike Mickens, CB
I like this draft much better as I believe it has some guys that could take over and start in a year or two, but still emphasizes special teams.
I'll tell you why
because our current backups really suck, we need to churn the bottom of the roster and to improve our ST play which was horrid last year.
I got news for you, if we drafted Brace and Gilbert, their impact this year would be very minimal. I think the majority of our draftees can make the team this season because guys like McQuistan, Proctor, Carp, Brown, Watkins, Carter, Octavien and Rodgers are garbage backups and ST players.
In Romo we Trust
Actually, that's not news to me
I wouldnt expect Brace and Gilbert to have much impact this year, although I do think both players could get 10 snaps per game in a rotation to keep the starters fresh.
And I did keep an emphasis on special teams in my draft by getting Williams, Johnson (the best gunner available in the draft according to Rick Goselin), Buehler, Hodge and Mickens. I was able to improve special teams and still pick some guys who can be groomed into solid starters.
Again, you would still see churn with a draft of only 5-7 players. By picking 12, we will have to cut some guys who are good enough to make other teams. Instead of picking a bunch of guys in the bottom 10 on the roster, why not try to improve the middle of the roster which in turn pushes guys downward to improve the bottom of the roster as well?
we did improve the middle of the roster
I believe guys like Williams, Butler, Brewster, Hodge, Hamlin, Mickens and Smith all can be good, solid backups and represent a huge upgrade over our current backups.
Obviously the Cowboys didn’t feel Brace or Gilbert were worth a 2nd rd pick and thats good enough for me.
In Romo we Trust
Wrong on both points
First off, the players you mentioned (Williams, Butler, Brewster, Hodge, Hamling, Mickens and Smith) are not middle of the roster guys, they are bottom of the roster guys. Think about it, the roster has 53 spots. All the starters take up the first half of the roster. Then the specialists and key back-ups take up the next 10-15 spots. That’s Folk, McBriar, Ladouceur, Scandrick, Crayton, Kitna, Felix, Choice, Martellus, Holland, Ellis, etc. All those guys are more important to the team than these rookies. Therefore, these guys did not affect the middle of the roster. They were added to the bottom of the roster.
Regarding the value of Brace and Gilbert, you can’t say where they valued these guys. Brace was selected 40th, well before Dallas was first on the clock at 51st. You might have a point about Gilbert, but I think they felt he could be had later. I heard/read several opinions (including Norm Hitzges right before Dallas picked) that Gilbert would have been the selection at #69. He went to Chicago at #68. So, maybe they didnt like him at #51, but they probably did like him.
I still disagree
You can’t tell me that some of these rookies won’t be key backups this season, especially if Carp and Ellis are let go.
I believe guys like Williams, Hodges, Hamlin could be just as valuable and see as much playing time as the other “key” backups you mentioned.
In Romo we Trust
Of course you do
There is a posibility that one or two of them (Williams and Hamlin are the two most likely candidates) will become key backups. But my point is still true that the players drafted primarily affected the bottom of the roster.
Not many of these 12 draftees project as starters in 3 years. A few of them have a chance, but most of them are either special teamers like Hodge and Buehler, or long-term projects like Brewster and McGee.
All I’m saying is I would have preferred a strategy of less bodies, but the ones we would select having higher ceilings.
Some of our starters aint so hot either
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
+ a billion
I think I would have cried a tear of joy in that situation… I like most the picks (exept the kicker) and maybe a WR in place of Jarron….maybe (I don’t remember if there was a good one there).
God 1st, Family Always & Dallas Cowboys 4 Life!!!!!
what is this obsession with a backup NT?
The Cowboys will obviously sign a veteran after the first wave or two of training camp cuts who will serve as Rats backup…no big deal IMO.
Everyone needs to chill about this.
In Romo we Trust
Right, it's silly.
Just like when everyone was worried about the backup QB spot.
by Baked Potato Soup on May 21, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I feel better about Jonas
than I do about Junior… and yes.. YOU DO need a backup at every position… even if he’s just a body… keep ol boy Rat fresh, and see great results…again.
Hooah.
I never said we don't need a backup NT
My point is that the player doesn’t have to be all pro, I think any veteran cut in camp by another team will do.
In Romo we Trust
I disagree
There aren’t extra, capable 3-4 NTs out there. Sure, there will be someone cut. But if that player is remotely serviceable, he’ll want starter salary and will probably get it from another team. So, that means we’re likely picking up a player like… Seawright. Or Andersen.
I do think the team has failed to address this issue for more than one year and ends-up playing inferior players and/or with inferior players on our roster (Tank, Remi).
And what’s our aversion to drafting a NT? Patriots did it. Why can’t we? And to think that Ratliff was actually drafted to be a DE.
sure there are
there will be veterans available who can effectively play a 3-4 NT who will be cut at the end of training camps, no doubt about it and I guarantee they won’t want starter money.
Why would they? They just got cut for crying out loud.
In Romo we Trust
You would argue with a statue
Terry, there really arent that many capable 3-4 NTs in the NFL. Matter of fact, I would guess its the hardest position to fill in football. There just arent than many guys who weigh 320 lbs and are strong (not just fat) and have a high motor. Think about it, most fatties have no energy at all.
Additionally, guys with this build dont stay in top shape for long. It’s harder to maintian that body than it is, for example, a linebacker or cornerback.
Who are these players that will “no doubt” be cut that you “guarantee?” Give me some examples of possible cuts. I’m calling you out because I really dont think you know what you are talking about.
who says they have to be 320??
I’m sure Wade would be okay with a guy around 295-300 lbs if he was a quick player like Rat.
I’ll remind you at the end of camp when we sign somebody to back up Rat how much I don’t know what I’m talking about.
In Romo we Trust
Are you saying that another team will cast off a Pro Bowl NT?
I think it’s pretty obvious that Ratliff is a special player, and most guys his size can’t man that position. Look at Tank Johnson last year. Even given Ratliff’s awesome abilities, there were times when he got moved out pretty easily on the inside runs and allowed other teams to blow our linebackers out, too. I’m not banking on finding another DT with Ratliff’s size, strength, speed ratio, so the best bet is to at least get a guy who can man the role for a play or two at a time through size alone.
by Baked Potato Soup on May 22, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions
no, not at all, didn't come close to saying that
I’m saying Wade obviously doesn’t think that a really fat NT is necessary in his defense, a lighter, quicker NT can do the job.
In Romo we Trust
Let's not assume everything Wade thinks is right
that would be a mistake, given his track record…
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
They dont have to be 320, but it would help
The ideal NT would probably be 320 with a great motor. We’re probably not going to find that, so you either need a great motor and give up some on the size, or get a space eater and live with the fact he wont have the push and energy you get from Rat.
The part I questioned your knowledge on is the availability of decent NTs. I think these guys are harder to find than other positions, so even the mediocre ones will be on rosters and not available. Honestly, I hope I’m wrong just as much as you do.
340 would be better
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I'm comparing the same nonchalant attitude to a glaring team deficiency.
Last year everyone was like, oh, they’ll take care of that, don’t worry. Or, the other train of thought was, well, if the coaches trust who we have, we should be fine. That’s a hilarious train of thought that I see often on this board, despite repeated evidence to the contrary, but that’s a whole different topic.
Anyway, everyone thought we would be just fine and backup QB was no big deal, and it bit us in the ass and was a major factor in missing the playoffs. Last year, despite his struggles at the position, the Cowboys had a pretty good player at backup NT. If he struggled, what are a bunch of scrubs going to do? It’s a little scary that they are once again displaying the same attitude that hurt us last year, and further shows that just relying on this coaching staff to know something that we don’t is not a good bet.
by Baked Potato Soup on May 22, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions
And last year aside,
A backup NT will play a lot more often, like every single game, than you plan for your backup QB to play.
by Baked Potato Soup on May 22, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions
unlike you, I trust the team knows what it's doing
I’m not going to press the panic button if or when Rat gets hurt.
In Romo we Trust
No offense, Terry, but that's your problem
I appreciate your trust in the Cowboys leadership, but you have to admit, their knowledge and leadership has let us down before. How did you feel about Brad Johnson last year? Still think that was a good decision in having him as the back-up? How did the Pacman thing work out? Still on-board with trading a 1st, 3rd and 6th for Roy Williams when no other team would trade a 1st alone for Anquan Boldin? How about drafting Bobby Carpenter in the 1st, Jacob Rogers in the 2nd, James Marten in the 3rd and Skyler Green in the 4th?
My point is this: not everything the Cowboys do is right. Not every move needs to be defended. When all you do is cheerlead for the team and cannot be critical, you lose some of your credibility. It’s ok to debate some of the decisions made by the team and even Jerry and company would admit they have made mistakes. We’re all on the same team here. You don’t have to contradict everything you perceive to be somewhat negative or critical.
you must not read all of my posts
because I have been very critical of the team and certain players on occasion. I absolutely hated the Pacrat signing, thought Jerry made a huge mistake and I was right.
Didn’t like Parcells decision to draft Carp or Rodgers, hated those moves as well.
I also am on record for not being a fan of the RW trade last season as well.
Now as for Brad Johnson, I had turst in Garrett on this one, but he was wrong, it happens sometimes.
Although I am generally positive and optimistic regarding the Cowboys, I don’t just cheer lead for the team, I definitely criticize, you just generalize too many of my comments by failing to read everything I post, or at least remember.
In Romo we Trust
Did you say that when Dave Campo was the HC
…and Larry Lacewell and Jerry were drafting like they did this past draft?
"Well, we didn't block real good but we made up for it by not tackling."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Because there is no backup NT
Every other position has a back-up who would be at least “capable” to hold down the position for a game or two. This is the only position in which that statement is not true.
QB – Kitna
RB – Choice
WR – Crayton (assuming Austin starts)
TE – Bennett
OT – Holland (Bigg kicks outside, although no one wants to see that)
OG – Holland
C – Proctor
NT – ???
DE – Hatcher
ILB – Carpenter
OLB – Ellis
CB – Scandrick/Jenkins (whoever doesnt win the starting job)
S – Hamlin/Watkins (scary)
Some of these positions dont have all-pro talent backing them up (Center, Tackle, Safety come to mind) but it wouldnt be the void that NT would leave us with.
There is literally NO ONE there. Sure, there are some camp bodies like Siavii, Tim Anderson, Casey Tyler and Seawright, but none of these guys are going to make the roster. Last year’s back-up (Tank) looks like Bob Lilly compared to these spares.
Maybe we will pick-up a veteran when cuts start rolling in, but it sure would be nice to let that guy get some reps with the team he is going into the season with. There’s value in learning our defensive system and getting familiar with the guys he will be playing with.
You still don’t see a problem, do you?
season hasn't started yet
I’m sure that position will be addressed prior to Sept 13.
In Romo we Trust
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