The VRR: Cowboys 2009 Rookie Class is Almost Signed
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 2:00 AM CDT
in Dallas Cowboys News
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The Cowboys have signed three more rookies to contracts: linebacker Brandon Williams, kicker David Buehler, and safety Mike Hamlin. The players agreed to four-year contracts, which should reflect the following base salaries for rookies:
Without a first- or second-round pick in this year's class, the Cowboys' rookies likely will sign four-year deals with minimum base salaries of $310,000 (2009), $395,000 (2010), $480,000 (2011) and $565,000 (2012). The difference, of course, is each player's signing bonus money, which will vary based on their draft positions.
The Cowboys received a $4,639,193 rookie pool to sign their picks. A little more than $16,000 was used for rookie free-agent signing bonuses.
The team is still working on signing linebacker Jason Williams and quarterback Stephen McGee. They are both expected to agree soon and will be participating in training camp.
Offensive lineman Robert Brewster is also expected to sign, but the complications from his shoulder injury and torn pectoral muscle will likely end his season.
More VRR after the jump.
Quarterbacks dominate TSN's list, "10-Pack: These players should feel the heat in '09." They rank Tony Romo at number two just behind LaDainian Tomlinson.
The Cowboys have admitted they cut receiver Terrell Owens in order to clear out the primary impediment to Romo's genuine leadership.
If Romo were a genuine leader, he would have found a way to get Owens under control.
Romo, who was undrafted and who has achieved more than he or anyone else ever dreamed possible, seems to be content with his level of success.
He'd better find a way to raise his threshold for contentment in 2009. With Owens gone, so are the excuses. Romo needs to take the team to the playoffs, and he needs to win at least one game when he gets there.
Otherwise, Romo could be done in Dallas. Sure, owner Jerry Jones will say he fully intends to keep Romo, no matter how bad it gets. After all, that's what Jones said about T.O.
Ray Buck at the Star-T compares the quarterback position of the Dallas Cowboys with other "hot seat" positions in sports.
Guys who made it famous: Dandy Don Meredith, Roger Staubach, Troy Aikman.
Others who showed: Craig Morton and Danny White never get enough credit. Ditto for Li’l Eddie LeBaron, who allowed Tom Landry to line up his 1960 expansion team and get off a snap. Gary Hogeboom, Steve Pelluer, Chad Hutchinson and Quincy Carter, so to speak, all fell off the wagon, along with a few easy-to-forget names following Aikman.
Current job holder: Tony Romo
Comment: This entry appears No. 1 on the list because maybe it is. It doesn’t matter if the Cowboys are contenders, or pretenders, the QB spot gets a ton of sizzle. Faithful Cowboys fans know that 12 years have passed since the team won a playoff game. Serious Cowboys fans know that Romo is 0-3, including last year’s no-go.
ESPN's most recent power rankings have Dallas at number 14.
Hat tip to BK Arsonist.
Timmy Mac asked Bill Barnwell from the Football Outsiders five data-driven questions about what we can expect from the 2009 Cowboys. His answer about Terence Newman's durability should help us all sleep better this fall.
You made a compelling case in the book about the drastic difference a healthy Terence Newman makes for the Dallas defense. He'll be 31 by the season opener and has been hobbled the last two years. What are the odds that he can stay healthy this season?
- We're not at the point yet where we can say that a particular player has, say, a 75 percent chance of playing 16 games, but there's reason to believe that Newman should be able to make it through a full season as the Cowboys' starter. It's not like he's Chad Pennington; Newman made it through the first 64 starts of his career without missing a game, and there's every reason to believe that the surgery he during last season cleared up the groin issues he was facing.
If Newman plays like he did after he returned from his groin injury last year, the Cowboys would go from a good pass defense to a great one.
Some players have already voiced their concern about the turf at the Alamodome.
For all of the benefits the Cowboys gain from spending three weeks in the Alamo City — its proximity to Dallas, the air-conditioned Alamodome, the abundance of adoring fans — there's a negative (Patrick) Crayton says can't be ignored.
Practice on a turf field.
"It beats your knees up, man, wears them down," Crayton said last month at minicamp.
Other players echoed Crayton's thoughts on returning to San Antonio, where the club also trained in 2002, 2003 and 2007. Dallas practiced outdoors last year in Oxnard, Calif., on natural grass.
"That's really the only con about San Antonio," linebacker Bradie James said of the dome's turf.
Here is a schedule breakdown and some general tips for attending training camp.
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1st?
Thanks for the late night update and for the link on what to do for training camp. Me and my wife are thinking about heading to SA for a few days to see TC. We’ve only seen one pre-season game before, so it would definitely be an experience. Keep up the good work :)
Romo criticism???
I’ve been a Cowboy fan for a long time and I just don’t get the criticism of Romo. Sure he hasn’t won a playoff game, but he sure was close each time he had a chance and it required some awfully bad luck to cause him to lose. One day he’s going to win it all. He has the talent to do it.
I remember quite a few games where Staubach really stunk up the joint. Nobody ever seems to remember that. We weren’t calling for his job at the time and it is completely ludicrous to do the same to Romo. We are very fortunate to have Romo. I love the excitement that he brings to the offense. He plays with reckless abandon, like Farve. But that is also how Staubach played as well. You never knew when Staubach would make a great play, because he never gave up. Romo is the same. I’ll take the genuine anticipation that Romo brings to a game over the hopelessness that previous quarterbacks have brought. I’d also take the excitement of a Staubach over the play-it-safe approach of an Aikman.
Some of you will criticize my comments as a homeboy, but I think that I am being much more of a realist. We have a good thing with Romo and if Jerry were to look to another QB next year, just because Romo didn’t win a playoff game, it’d be the craziest move he could possibly make.
+100%
we’re very fortunate to have Romo. he’s still young in his career. 36 starts I think. and he’s shown more than many great QBs had at this point in their careers, who also had less stats and no playoff wins. he is already one of the top in the game and his upside is huge. and you’re right, it isn’t just that he can be a winning QB, it’s the fun he has and brings to the game that makes him fun to watch. I’ll take a boring QB who wins over an exciting QB who loses, but I’ll take an exciting QB who wins over both lol. i’ll be frustrated if we don’t win a playoff game this year, but unless he takes a big obvious step backwards, i won’t be ready to toss him overboard even if we don’t.
+1
Most Giants fans and Iggles fans I know (family in that area) – if they’re honest – will say they’d rather have Romo than their guy. That’s McNabb (4 NFC Championship games) and Eli (SB) … and that doesn’t even surprise me.
FanSince72, I’ve got you by two years (I’m 46), I hung my head when they lost to the Colts in their first SB. But I agree on your comparison of Romo to Staubach. Romo brings a certain energy to the field, and lets you feel like we are not out of any game. I loved that in Staubach, and I’ve already seen quite a bit of it from Romo’s short career. Staubach spent 4 years in the Navy, Romo was riding the pine. The detractors forget too easily how lean the years since Aikman have been.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
Ummm, no thanks
Can’t speak for Eagles fans, but you can have yours, we’ll keep ours.
Homer: Aw, twenty dollars! I wanted a peanut!
Homer's Brain: Twenty dollars can buy many peanuts!
Homer: Explain how!
Homer's Brain: Money can be exchanged for goods and services!
Homer: Woo-hoo!
by bigbluethruandthru on Jul 28, 2009 6:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Well, since I grew up on the Jersey shore with a family full of Gints fans...
Let me just say you’re in the minority among the folks I talk to… the fans were trying to run Eli out of town the December before you won the SB !!! And you heard more of it last year as well… you can keep Eli, and hope your defense wins another one.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
I live in the heart of Giant country
You are absolutely right. Eli was dog poo with Giant fans that year they won the SB, after Dallas destroyed them early in the year (1st of 2 wins against them) I had many Giant “fans” who absolutely hate everything about the Cowboys tell me the only reason Dallas was better was because their QB stunk and Romo was really good.
In fairness, Manning has progressed a lot since 07 but I still be a lot of their fans would make the trade. With Phil probably not so much. I don’t think Romo has had many good games against them.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions
With Philly, they'd take McNabb in his prime
But the Philly fans I’ve talked to (only a few, but they were NFL fans) said they thought the Cowboys got lucky finding Romo. Philly has been itching to run McNabb out of town for a few years now.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
Yeah, it's 2009, not 2007
In 2006 most NFL teams would have made a trade for Michael Vick if available. Eli turned the corner that Romo has not yet done (winning in the playoffs. Scratch that, how about getting to the playoffs every year?), and this year, 2009, no true fan of the Giants team would make that deal.
Homer: Aw, twenty dollars! I wanted a peanut!
Homer's Brain: Twenty dollars can buy many peanuts!
Homer: Explain how!
Homer's Brain: Money can be exchanged for goods and services!
Homer: Woo-hoo!
by bigbluethruandthru on Aug 1, 2009 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
You got it exactly right, Fan
The whole tone of being a fan has changed since those days. People think a player should produce a Super Bowl from day one or hit the pavement. All the guy has done is re-write the franchises’ record books (on a team with two HOF QBs in its short history) and win games. Instead, we get crap like the TSN blurb that attempt to find one or two flaws to pick at. I love this one:
If Romo were a genuine leader, he would have found a way to get Owens under control.
Really??? How did that work for McNabb, Garcia and all the coaches along the way like Reid and Haley? These are some quality guys we’re talking about. What a moronic comment. Anyone with half a brain would realize that you can coax and stroke Owens into playing along for a time, but he will not be controlled. By anyone, including himself.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
he will not be controlled. By anyone, including himself.
how true… how sadly true
even as recently as the 90s, you didn’t hear a large buzz from Denver about ousting Elway.
Welcome to the world of online / instant / universal griping?
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
co-sign
Celebrity or Imposter?
YOU Decide...
http://www.xanga.com/metaltometal/689036052/celebrity-or-imposter/
+1000
Couldnt have said it any better.
They also leave out the dynamics of the relationship. Romo was a nobody when he started and TO for all of his BS actually took to Romo and helped him immensely with his progress and confidence. Having a guy who can take it to the house and did helped Romo over many hurdles. It also seemed that TO took a special interest in Tony and did all he could to support him. Unfortunately the time had come for Tony to be the alpha male in the huddle. I just dont believe TO was wired for that transition to happen. I also think Tony had a fear of jumping TOs ass when half hearted effort was involved. Does TO blow up on him and is that helpful to the team for the drama that will sure follow.
For me that raises the next question. What kind of credibility do you have when you jump a lineman for mental breakdown but ignore TOs giving up on a route or blowing an assignment. Can you lead 9 men in a huddle, overlook 1 and be a leader with credibility. I dont even think I would have credibility with myself let alone others.
Leadership can be described in many ways but in an offensive huddle it comes down to can this guy takes us down in the final minute and give us a chance to win. Do the players believe he can. I have witnessed 2 playoff games. One he delivered and another its tough to say who let down who.
If the line can stay healthy and we stay committed to balance, Romo will deliver in the clutch. This is a guy whose whole career is succeeding when the deck seems stacked. His entire football career has been the long hard road, why should have it changed once he was named starter. We seem to be on the path he has always taken. The good news is he has always triumphed.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
Tony Romo is not the first Dallas QB to be criticized
Go tell Danny White how much tougher it is these days, I think he will have a different take on things. The biggest difference I see is that Romo really hasn’t been challenged like those earlier generation QB’s were. Craig Morton was actually a pretty good QB and Staubach took his job. Danny White was benched for Gary Hogeboom and then Steve Pilleur was in the mix. Romo has had basically no competition or anyone pushing him.
Nobody has suggested (that I’ve heard anyway) for Jerry to look to another QB next year. The kid they drafted is more than a year a way but may challenge Romo at some point in the future. I think it will be healthy for Romo and the team when he has some legitimate competition, just like competition always improves performance.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions
the problem with that
is that there is only about 10 NFL qbs who could realistically challenge Romo and they all start for other NFL teams.
McGee might someday, but that won’t be for at least another 2 or 3 years.
In Romo we Trust
The pressure from McGee will start before he's ready to be a viable threat
I agree he won’t be ready to actually earn the job until probably 2011 but I can picture scenarios where there will be a lot of pressure from outside the organization starting next year. If Dallas doesn’t end the season strong this year and stumbles some next year I think Tony Romo will be in the cross hairs of the fan base and media. Even if he is as good as advertised and makes really fast progress, McGee won’t be ready to step in and play better than Romo at that point.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions
the pressure from outside the team is irrelevant
Jerry Jones will simply laugh at notions of McGee competing with Romo for the starting qb in the immediate future just like he laughs at the unfair criticism of Romo currently.
In Romo we Trust
No actually Florio
did say that.
Otherwise, Romo could be done in Dallas
What is different today is the level of interest, the level of coverage and a corresponding lack of patience.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I missed someone actually saying that, it's absurd
I do disagree there’s less patience now though. I think it’s always been very high, probably higher in Dallas given the expectations for the team.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions
Romo can expect
to have doubters among the fanbase until he pushes his game to the next level and wins in the post-season. This is the Dallas Cowboys we are talking about, and “pretty close” doesn’t cut it.
This is one Cowboys fan who is hoping — expecting — Romo will elevate his game to the next level this season.
Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.
I generally agree
People will ride him like a pony until the team wins some play-off games.
I think his game is already at an adequate level to win a championship. Eli and others have proven that. But if the team is going to place the heaviest load on him to drive the offense, then yes, he’ll have to improve his decision-making somewhat, and elminate the fumbles.
But as always, the team will go about as far as the O-line permits it to. That’s my biggest concern going into this season.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
+1
That is also my #1 concern. Healthy and consistent O-line play for 16 games. I honestly think the rest of the team is in pretty damn good shape. If we get that one O-line wish, we should compete for a very surprising season. Surprising, that is, to other teams’ fans.
by KaceOFbass on Jul 28, 2009 11:15 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Romo has not been the problem,
Reeves, Jones, Henry, and Williams have been the problem.
Injuries to Newman and Kosier have been the problem,
Having to play Proctor because our center needs help with line calls is the problem.
Playing injured vets while young talent like Scandrick and Choice and I add Free sit on the bench is the problem.
I could go on for days with this but Romo is not the problem.
Those are all legitimate
But I don’t agree Romo doesn’t share some of the responsibility. I think not acknowledging he’s been part of the problem late in the season and in the playoffs is being blind to reality. Every team has injuries every year and you can always point to multiple reasons for losses.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe not THE problem, but a large part of the problem.
He’s just as culpable if not more so than any other reason.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions
So he's not part of the problem?
Are you saying that Romo bears no responsibility for the Cowboys struggling in December the last few years? Because I have stats that show otherwise. His level of play drops drastically every year in December. Since the QB is the most important player on the team, it affects the team the most when he doesn’t play well.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions
I never said that
Of course he bears responsibility for the Dec struggles, absolutely, but to say he’s a large part of the problem or more culpable than most is simply not true.
In Romo we Trust
QB play is not a large part of the team's success?
So how the QB plays is just a small part of how a team does?
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Baked, you make one argument, then defend a different one
All Terry said was that he disagreed with your statement that Romo was a large part of the problem, and more culpable than others. Of course the spotlight – and the offense – is on his shoulders. But anyone that watched the second half of that Giants game knows it was the O-Line FIRST, not Romo, that caved. Romo almost won that game DESPITE a horrible performance by the O-Line and a weak defensive effort. You disagree with THAT?
Arguing it was Romo’s fault, then arguing it was his fault simply because he’s a large part of the team’s success holds little value when you look at the details.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
The Giants playoff game?
He threw the last pick into double coverage when he had plenty of time. He threw a crazy air ball behind and over TO when he was wide open earlier for a TD. Teams blitz, it happens. As much as he gets paid, he has to help make them pay for it, not just blame it on the line because they are 5 guys blocking 7.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Define large part of the problem.
If the most important player on the team isn’t playing well, how is that not a large part of the problem? Romo usually plays poorly in December. That’s a huge problem for this team, in my opinion. And clearly in the opinion of a LOT of sportswriters and analysts, because I am not the only person saying it. To win down the stretch and in the playoffs, you need your best players to play their best. For whatever reason, our best player tends to play his worst at that time. That’s a large part of the problem, if you ask me.
It doesn’t make sense to me to say that your best and most important player playing poorly is only a small part of the problem. In my mind, it’s the biggest problem.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
If that were the case
But because it’s a team sport you can’t demonstrate that either. For example, if the line plays poorly, the most important player on the team will have no shot at playing well.
The second point is that no matter how important the position, a team won’t win without consistent play from the whole team. Elway is arguably among the best QBs ever to play. It took improvements on defense and the running game for him to achieve what he did. A QB isn’t 90% of a team’s success. He can only detemine so much.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I didn't say 90%.
I agree that the whole team has to play well, but it’s much easier to overcome other individual players’ poor play than the QBs. I’m not saying he’s 90% of the team’s success, but I would say he is at least 25%. That’s way more than any other individual player. When I look at last December and think what one thing would have made a difference, I have to say QB play.
All you have to do is look at the Cowboys’ record when Romo’s rating is above or below 72, which is pretty low. Above 72, they are 26-6, and 3 of those losses were his first year as a starter. Below 72, they are 2-7. I think that shows a pretty clear link between his play and wins and losses.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
this is your best case ...
and clearly Romo has been inconsistent…
I guess it comes down to this for me: when you have a guy that routinely puts up HOF numbers, often playing behind a VERY MUCH LESS THAN AVERAGE offensive line… playing with a #1 WR that, while also putting up impressive numbers, routinely drops 3rd down passes (Imagine Romo with Irvin :) … it’s hard for me to get to worried about our QB.
At this point in Romo’s career, he’s show me far more HOF moments than disappointments. Does he need to be more consistent? SURE! But is his job in jeopardy? Not if I’m the GM.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
to worried = too worried
dunk … another pet of mine = pet peeve w/ words like “too”!
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
It's not just Romo, either.
If you look at the past 3 years for the Cowboys with other QBs, including Bollinger, Johnson, and Bledsoe, they are 0-5 when their ratings were below 72 and 4-0 when above 72. I think that shows that if they get even mediocre QB play, they usually win, which also shows that that is one of their biggest problems, if not THE biggest problem.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Or it shows
that for example Dallas has done poorly manning and preparing its offensive line over the long haul.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Poorly?
3 out of 4 make the Pro Bowl and that doesn’t even include Colombo (who’s been great) and Kosier (whose worth is now unquestioned after last year).
All this gnashing of teeth over backups…what inane arguments and fear mongering.
Name a team, and I’ll name 5 guys that can’t be replaced. Better yet, just name any LT, DE/OLB, CB, or QB on any team and you can pretty well bet that their season is going down the toilet.
It's not personal, it's just business
Flo was a lifetime achievement selection
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Isn't Winning or Lossing Part of the rating
It’s like saying look when they loose they usually loose.
No.
Wins and losses have nothing to do with QB rating.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
as well they shouldn't be
QB rating is an individual stat, wins/losses is a team stat
In Romo we Trust
And to get real technical ...
It is a Passer rating, not a QB rating.
It does not count sacks, it does not count fumbles, it does not count rushing yards by the QB and and overemphasizes TD passes. On the other hand, it rewards the QB with yards after catch (should belong to the WR).
by One.Cool.Customer on Jul 29, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I disagree it overemphasizes TDs
It actually punishes you much more for INTs than it rewards you for TDs.
In Romo we Trust
and now to get overly technical ...
my point is, TD passes are less indicative of passer performance and more indicative of the teams ability (e.g. turnovers deep in the opp’s territory, terriffic runing game on 3rd downs to sustain drives etc) and the coaches ability (e.g. playcalling that favors the pass vs. the run in the red zone) to put the QB in a position to throw for a TD in the first place.
In fact, if the TD pass were of such monumental significance for passer performance, ‘TD attempts not completed’ should also figure separately in the stat, and not be buried in the overall compl. %age.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jul 29, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Aikman had a rating system that was pretty good, I thought.
A few years back he used to do the Aikman ratings or something, that was much simpler. Basically it was just yards per attempt with 50 yards subtracted for each turnover.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 30, 2009 1:10 AM CDT up reply actions
I know you didn't say 90%
The percentage is immaterial. Too many teams to count have won Super Bowls (not to mention any number of playoff games) with QBs who were well below Romo. Big Ben was a miserable 80 rating last season. He didn’t make the difference for them, his defense did. Eli was like 84. He didn’t carry anyone either.
In fact teams that win generally have a unit that performs exceptionally well, not just a guy. Think Giants, Steelers, Colts, Ravens. Occasionally a team is balanced and consistent in all phases. Think Patriots.
Romo is more than enough QB to win a championship but either they will need to be consistently good across the board or an entire unit will need to be a strength for the team. Up to this point there has been nothing except the offense that has been close to being a dominant unit.
This season, the offense should be pretty good but with the inconsistency on offensive line, I doubt they can carry a team through. So it’s not even going to be Romo that makes the difference. It’s going to be improved STs and a dominant defense that gets it done. I think Wade finally has the peices to have that kind of defense, so that’s where I lay my hope for the season.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Dunk, you realize what you said here, right?
If the O-Line stays healthy (not a totally unreasonable assumption), then we would have the potential for both a dominant offense AND defense… like the Patriots.
It is not a small IF to want this line to be solid… but IF they are, and Romo has time, and Felix and Barber and Choice get their holes, and Wade’s D plays like most of us expect…
This team could be as dominant as any since… well… 94?
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
I never said small part BPS
stop putting words in my mouth. Romo is the qb and he can’t do his job if the OL doesn’t block or his receivers don’t get open and catch the ball, and the last time I checked Romo doesn’t play defense.
In Romo we Trust
That's a pretty accurate assessment, in my opinion.
Yeah yeah, I love Romo’s heart and grit and love of the game, etc., etc.
But that exactly sums up the problem with him that his “critics” have had, and he has yet to answer the bell and dispel them. For a guy that hasn’t won a playoff game, much less a Super Bowl, it’s cringe inducing to see him constantly mentioned alongside Favre, Staubach, and others. He hasn’t earned that yet.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 9:28 AM CDT reply actions
He hasn't earned the stripes, sure
But he’s put up some very impressive numbers, many times under the pressure of big games. He’s looked GREAT for stretches, has orchestrated a few come-backs, even overcame his own mistakes on a few occasions. Throw in a few of the crazy plays he seems to make on a regular basis, and you get a little closer to the reason he’s compared to some of the greats.
Is he there yet? I don’t think anyone says he is… but is he capable of getting there? THAT is where I think most true Cowboy fans should be excited, not talking up McGee.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
Who's talking up McGee, besides Tex?
The article doesn’t even mention McGee, it just says that there is a lot of pressure on Romo because he hasn’t played well in December and has the highest profile job in sports. It’s basically reiterating what has been said hundreds of times about him, that he has to prove that he is a leader, not just have it handed to him, needs to play well for 16+ games, not just 12, and a huge step toward both of those would be acting like he wants it a little bit more than he has thus far. I think that’s fair. If he played merely average in December, that would be a major upgrade.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions
my reference was to the detractors here at BTB
After a Romo-bashing session, you usually get a McGee comment. It comes more from history than from your comment or this article.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
thats the problem
Romo has played merely average in Dec, while everyone expects greatness.
In Romo we Trust
No, he has played poorly.
In 3 years as a starter, he has 8 games with a QB rating below 67 in December. In comparison, he has had only 1 game with a QB rating below 72 prior to December, the Buffalo game in 2007.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions
71.9
Last year, if he had been 71.9 for the year, he would have been ranked 30th in the league, in 2007 that would have been 26th, and in 2006 it would have been 28th. That’s well below average.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Average in the playoffs
is playing poorly for a Dallas Cowboys QB.
Pretty good doesn’t cut it.
Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.
Name the players on the team
who played well in those losses. The list will be short.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Tashard Choice...ummm...hmmm...
L.P. Ladoceur…ummm…hmmm…
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
That's subjective, obviously.
Most of the team played well against Pittsburgh.
Choice, Witten, Crayton, and Owens played well against Baltimore, and the defense did until their Romoesque collapse.
Philly – Choice, Owens, Witten, and the D never stood a chance due to the offense’s poor play (13 drives, 6 – 3 and outs, 5 turnovers).
Oh, and Folk in every game, I guess.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Romo did not play great vs Pittsburgh
But he did more than his share in the other three games. He was simply brilliant against the Giants. He led the team back against the Ravens, one of the best defenses in football. You do remember that he was playing in pretty intense pain and limited mobility?
The defense played well against Pittsburgh and NYG but pooped themselves hard against Baltimore and Philly.
Philly was a team effort.
What does all this mean? First, this team will go nowhere without good offensive line play. It cost them any chance in the Giants’ playoff lost and you could not have missed their horrific play last season – romo got injured… twice. Brad and Bollinger got absolutely buried. Second, the team needs to execute more consistently. They simply cannot win if one or more elements of the game don’t show up. You can’t have ST compromise a good defensive effort, or the defense negate a strong offensive game.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I don't dispute any of that.
But Romo is just as much as responsible as anyone else on the team, given his poor play in all of those games except the Giants game, where the rest of the team also played well. The QB is the most important player on the team and if he is playing well, the rest of the team generally follows suit, likewise, if he plays poorly, it’s difficult for the rest of the team to play well.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions
on this "it's all on the QBs shoulders" theory
you give credit to Romo for the 13-3 season? also for all the other wins, right?
just asking
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
I think he could be the best QB in the league.
I know people think I’m a Romo “hater”, but I’m a HUGE fan of his. I have 4 jerseys, my computer wallpaper, t-shirts, and other stuff with his name and number on it.
If you look at his numbers through November, the guy has to be one of the best ever. His career QB rating in those months is 107.3, which is just crazy. But I can easily see that he generally goes in the tank in December. As much as I love the guy, I think that criticism of him is fair, given the pattern he has developed.
So, yeah, I give him all the credit in the world for those wins. He’s awesome. I just wish he would be awesome for the whole season, not 75% of it.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions
On this you have a good point... i agree with you
But the way you present that in other places puts too much of the blame on Romo, and ignores the rest of the Team’s faults.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
You're the same as me
I wanted Romo to start long before he did and recognize how much he does very well. The problem is, we’re considered “haters” if we say anything less than he’s the greatest of all time. There are very few people who post here who aren’t zealots one way or the other about him, we’re in a small minority. The guy is very good and exciting but he has flaws and so far hasn’t shown he deserves to be mentioned in the same sentence with the great QB’s (for that I’ll be considered a hater).
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions
The silent majority
I’d actually bet that the vast majority of us feel the same way.
Only Tex and Terry seem to be the zealot type…though there are quite a few haters, they’re just a vocal minority.
It's not personal, it's just business
I think your view
is pretty balanced. I don’t rank him with P Manning or Brady, nor with Staubach or Aikman. I know he has great potential and I am excited as a fan that the team even has a chance. But Romo has a lot of things to police up and it sounds like they’re going to try to do that this seasonl.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Eesh
It’s almost as if he’s alone out there. How was Romo’s health for the final four games last season, courtesy of Flo and Procter? How did the defense play in “crunch time” against the Ravens?
Sure the QB is the most important player, but this whole team has to step up. And if they as a team think like some do – that this is all about Tony – they will most definitely fail in December again.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Who says he's alone out there?
Heck, every game he plays poorly, we can count on every single other player on the team being blamed for it, so that’s not true.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions
My point is
this entire team has to play at a high level to win play-off games. Romo could have had the game of his life and not rescued the second Eagles game because no one else showed up. Teams don’t win Super Bowls with one guy playing at a high level. They have to hit on multiple cylinders to have a chance. Where’s the criticism of Ware for failing to “take over” the Eagles game and nail McNabb? Where’s the questiong of Brady James in stopping Westbrook?
Romo is one of about three or four players on the team who play at an extremely high level. Sure, he makes mistakes.Sure, he wants to and needs to correct them. But his results are remarkable.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Results
I don’t find Romo’s results remakable at all. I find quite a few of his plays and some games to be remarkable, but overall his results are merely average – a couple of playoff berths but not even one playoff win. He has shown to be a great early season quarterback but his play deteriorates when the games mean the most. What is remarkable about that? He is a remarkable fantasy football quaterback through Thanksgiving, but as far as the NFL is concerned, his overall results are average. And let’s not forget that Romo has been surrounded by an all-star cast of skill position players and an offensive line that consistently is ranked in the top half of the NFL, and often times in the top 25%. There are many NFL quarterbacks who would have looked a whole lot better over the last three years if they were fortunate enough to be in Romo’s shoes.
Romo has put up some impressive stats and compiled wins to be sure, but all that is countered by his poor play when the games are most important. Until he corrects that enormous flaw in his game, he will never be viewed as a great NFL quarterback by anyone except diehards fans who refuse to accept reality. And if he does correct that flaw, I will be jumping for joy and will be most happy to recognize the huge improvement in his game and his status among the elite NFL quarterbacks.
by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2009 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
1th!
Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.
Cowboy Louie, Cowboy Louie, Cowboy Louie...
Fades in late games that are important? Like the Green Bay game in 07? Like the Giants game last December? Like the late drive against the Raven’s Defense last year? THAT is his enormous flaw?
An average QB? An all-star cast? Injuries late last year: MBIII, Felix, Flo, Kosier, Witten, TO’s psyche (often injured), and Romo himself. All Star?
If you want to criticize Romo, there are things that deserve mention… but this list seems more hater than reality.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
Cowboy Louie
Is the same guy who fails to believe that Jimmy Johnson was the guy who orchestrated the Walker trade and that Jerry Jones was completely and totally the GM in the 90’s dynasty even though all evidence, documented and otherwise points otherwise.
So I find it hard for someone to speak about reality when they pretty much take factual information and just say “uh screw it.”
Romo needs to improve in situations and he has had problems in December and cold weather but he’s still a good QB.
by The Immortal Iron Fist AKA AFB on Jul 28, 2009 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions
This is perhaps
the number one myth. That when the games are important, he wilts. In fact, there have plenty of very important games where he has excelled. At least BPS had some stats on his side to show that Romo’s numbers declined in December. I’m not going to chronicle all the big games he’s played well in – it’s been done ad nauseum.
If you “average” his performance, his career rating is tied with Eli Manning for second behind Brady. Those didn’t just happen. He earned that. Of course having talent around you helps. But so does being able to play the position at a high level.
The only real argument is whether December performances are Romo’s problem alone or whether the team as a whole has performed poorly. I contend that long before Romo stepped under center this team struggled to win games in any month, but especially in December. That trend has continued. I think it is due to not having any particular strength for the team to anchor on once the competition peaks in intensity. They are inconsistent in all key areas (to include Romo for ball security).
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
biggest myth is absolutely correct
Romo is clutch and plays well under pressure 98% of the time, the only game I saw him play poorly under pressure was the Pittsburgh game and I’m giving him a pass in that one considering he probably couldn’t feel his fingers by the 4th qrt, I know I couldn’t and i was wearing insulated, thermal gloves.
In Romo we Trust
mmm... insulated thermal gloves
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
98% of the time?
Honestly… “Romo plays well under pressure 98% of the time”? Like the pressure games last December when he tore up the league?
Nevertheless, your post wasn’t a complete waste. I got a good laugh out of the thermal gloves. Your ability to come up with excuses for Romo’s poor play is apparently endless. But the thermal gloves one might just top the list to date.
by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions
he played well against the GMen
I believe that game was in Dec and just as pressurized as the Pitt, Balt or Philly games.
In Romo we Trust
response
Yes, BPS has provided excellent statistical evidence of Romo’s December demise so it makes no sense for me to repeat it again.
I have not made the argument that the Cowboy’s December problems are Romo’s alone. The argument I make is that Tony Romo plays far worse in December, when the games matter most, than he does the rest of the season. Until he changes that he will – correctly – be seen as simply a good quarterback who can’t get the job done when it matters most.
Guys who think Romo is a top-flight, Franchise qarterback can continue to justify that perspective by ‘averaging’ (your words) his performance and coming up with all sorts of other excuses. The fact remains that until he proves that he can lead a team and play as well in December as he does in through Thanksgiving, he will be known as a guy who puts up nice stats for a season but folds down the stretch. I am through getting caught up in the Romo hype. I have been fooled by that nonsense two years in a row. I will not get sucked into believing he is the The Man until he proves it. Do you really think Romo is going to play excellent football in December and January this year, leading the Cowboys deep into the playoffs? Or is it more likely that he will play bad, the team will go 2-3 or 1-4 and miss the playoffs? Until proven otherwise, I’m predicting history will repeat itself.
by Cowboy Louie on Jul 28, 2009 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions
I am not justifying anything
I’m stating my opinion. Clearly you have one too.
I don’t accept that he just folds in December until I have an idea of WHY he’s folding. If you offered that he has small hands and can’t grip the ball, or that he wears down, or really anything that made any sense, that would be worth considering. Using the fact that he has not yet won a lot of games in December as proof that he isn’t capable is a logical fallacy. It’s not proof that something is wrong with Romo, it’s only proof that he has not yet done it. Saying “he has to show me” doesn’t add anything to the debate.
My contention is that the NFL is pressure filled and difficult all season long. A guy who can put up “nice stats” Sep through Nov can do the same in any month. If he were a “choker” he’d choke on Monday night football against a division rival as quickly as he would against a December team when the playoffs are locked up (2007).
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
just like history repeated itself when
P Manning lead his team to a SB in 2006 after several performances like Romo in Dec/Jan, huh?
In Romo we Trust
That will be
the perfect argument just as soon as Romo wins that Super Bowl.
Oh boy, can’t wait.
Keep doing what you been doing, keep getting what you been getting.
It's still a good argument in terms of
not judging a QB too early in his career over whether he can or cannot achieve something.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
The offense by December '07
LT = shadow of his former PB self
LG = Procter was only constant
C = great if not in shotgun
RG = beast
RT = mauler, but did get beat some
- WR = A-hole
- WR = transfer student, plantar facetiousness
- WR = contributor
- WR = unable to stay healthy
- TE = warriored it out even though grimacing often
- TE = got in the game some
- HB = toe, not effective
- HB = IR
- HB = pleasant surprise
FB = adequate, I guess
- QB = hurt throwing hand
- QB = hurt team
- QB = gramatica
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions
The only comparisons are how they are similar at the same stages in their careers.
Nobody has put in the ROH or HOF. Labeling a guy as cant win the big one after 2.5 seasons is know as premature ejac er.. labeling. Its a little early.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
He didn't say he can't.
He said he is under pressure to do it. So far Romo has demonstrated major performance anxiety in December.
Didn’t Staubach win the Super Bowl his first year as a starter? But if he follows Favre’s career trajectory, that means he’s about to win 3 straight MVPs, so that would be awesome.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Performance anxiety
is more than a stretch. Ware is about to be the highest paid player on the team. Did he get the yips too?
That whole notion is overstated and overrated.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Look at his numbers.
8 games with a QB rating below 67 in December in his career, 1 game below 72 in September to November for his career. Clearly the guy plays worse in December. I’m as big a fan of him as anyone, but I have no choice but to recognize that for whatever reason, he typically plays poorly in December. I hope this is the year he finally shakes that problem, but he hasn’t yet, and we won’t know for another 5 months.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
They sucked in December
long before he started QB as well. There is a trend, but I think it would be a mis-read to lay it on Tony alone.
Here’s how I honestly see it.
Since the start of the Parcells’ era, Dallas has gone with over-sized linemen. before Tony, Dallas attempted to be a run-first team but lacked the RB talent to execute it. Bledsoe came in and Dallas was almost a pass-first team just out of necessity. While big lines are well-suited for the run game, they typically do not do as well pass blocking. Bledsoe could not ahndle the inconsistent line play and began single-focusing on Glenn as he tried to speed his read and delivery up. Romo’s quick release and mobility hid that flaw and the line looked pretty good, but the combination of Romo, Witten and TO allowed the team to track up running yards, often late in games with a lead, and other times using draws and delays. When one part of that line was missing, Romo’s mobility paid fewer dividends. And when December rolls around, you must be able to run and a team taht gets its run off deception and surprose isn’t going to make it.
The most consistent palttern for Dallas is an inconsistent line.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
And the second pattern
is that I think until recently Dallas drafted poorly and played too much in FA. I think they are reversing that trend and we are starting to see the results – more depth, more balance, a return to “Bill Bates” over “Terrell Owens”.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I just dont buy into that. This whole franchise has sucked in Dec long before Romo.
I havent seen Romo play well, but I havent seen alot of help either. The teams just havent been on the same page as a whole and some key injuries.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
Didnt read all the posts before responding, sorry for repeating Dunkmans post.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
Who can keep up!
It’s almost like game day…
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
The whole team is probably too involved in Salvation Army
and other charities around the holidays to focus on football.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not laying the blame solely at Romo's feet.
I am just saying that I think criticism of him is fair. Just like I think it’s fair for the rest of the team.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
And he is going to be open to criticism no matter what.
Just like Ken Hamlin is when he can make the TD-saving tackle even though the guys in front of him failed to do their jobs.
Always that last guy to not make the play that stands out.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
I was thinking the same. Hitting is in the air. The smell of fresh cut grass....
Who says spring is the time for love.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
"If Romo were a genuine leader, he would have found a way to get Owens under control."
I don’t agree with this at all. Not that Romo’s a great leader – he’s obviously not. No one has been able to keep a lid on TO. Donovan McNabb, in my opnion, is one of the gutsiest players in the league and a GREAT leader on the field. He was not able to keep TO quiet, and I don’t think anyone is.
Why does noone blame Parcells, Terry Glenn, or Roy Williams for the first playoff loss?
Handling the extra points is a job no starting QB ever has = Parcells’ fault
Fumbling in your own end zone = Glenn’s fault
Allowing Jeremy Stevens to get behind you in a crucial moment = Williams’ fault
Even after the botched kick, Romo still gave the team a chance to win on the ensuing drive.
And isn’t he 0-2 in the playoffs as starting QB, not 0-3, or did I sleep through a whole season?
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 10:12 AM CDT reply actions
Someone did.
None of those guys are here anymore, so I’m guessing that at least somebody thought they were part of the problem.
He was counting years without a playoff win, not actual playoff record.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions
That's kind of what I thought, with the "including last year’s no-go".
But this team showed that it was not up to playing playoff-caliber football late last year. So, 0-3 should not be tied to “serious fans”.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
"If Romo were a genuine leader, he would have found a way to get Owens under control."
Couldn’t you substitute Bill Parcells, Andy Reid, Jeff Garcia, Steve Mariucci, D. McNabb, et al in place of Romo and still have the statement carry as much truth?
TO is a great talent. Love him or hate him, you have to ask yourself why is there controversy everywhere he goes and at what point does the controversy outweigh his talent?
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
Romo
Hypothetical: He’ll win a playoff game and then the critics will say he’s not capable of winning the SB. He’ll win a SB and they’ll say he’s a one hit wonder. He’ll win 2 or 3 and many years after he’s retired they’ll say put him in the HOF claiming they always knew how great he was.
You can find a schmuck under nearly every overturned rock.
That's exactly how the logic works
They assume that because someone has not done it they cannot do it. Eli was tarred and halfway feathered, and suddenly he’s Hillbilly Jesus in the Big Apple. He didn’t win the Super Bowl, he and his team did. They all had to buy in, they all had to play at a high level, they all had to persevere.
As a fan, it’s not necessary for me to decide today what Romo’s legacy will be at the end of his career. There is absolutely no way (and therefore no reason) to know what that will be. I am grateful that the Cowboys have a QB who helps the team win games and plays the position at a high level.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I don't think anyone thinks he can't do it.
But given that he has had 3 opportunities, it is absolutely acceptable in my opinion to question whether he can or not since he hasn’t yet. Just like it’s unfair to say he absolutely can’t because he never has, it’s equally unfair to say that he absolutely can when he hasn’t yet.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions
It's not logical
If he can do it in the regular season, he can do it in the playoffs.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
He only does it for part of the regular season.
His play goes through a noticeable drop off every December. It’s like someone draws a line on the schedule.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions
And we know this Romo, right?
We know that the line is giving him the same amount of time, that the defense and special teams are palying well…
Romo knows he needs to be a big part of the December answer. But I think we’ve all watched the games and we have all seen a complete collapse of the team. Please tell me you don’t think the defense has been championship-caliber the past five seasons. Special teams? Among the worst in the league. Consistently. The offfense? Among the best, but only under Romo. So Romo is supposed to make up for the other two phases?
I think that although he’s the poster child for losing late, he’s only one factor among many and probably less to blame than most.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
The rest of the team has been overhauled.
At least half of the defensive starters will be new, they addressed the kicking game in the draft and fired the D and ST coordinators. Like Romo, Garrett is also considered in the hot seat because he wasn’t replaced although his unit underperformed. We will have at least 2 new starters on offense, possibly as many as 5. Basically every single unit on the team will look different next year than they did most of last year except for QB. So of course he is under scrutiny.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh definitely
and the QB will always be under scrutiny. That’s fine.
But that’s why they undertook those particular changes. They assessed waht they had and worked on the real issues. The offense is productive. Unless you are Josh McDumdum, you don’t take the strength of your team and parlay it into a weakness. The defense under Wade’s hand was beginning to become a strength and the ST were an embarrassment. They acted decisively in those areas and this team will be better than most people think next season.
If the line holds up.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
They didn't address the line.
So they must have considered it a strength, too. I think it’s odd that the line is knocked so much for their performance, but we will essentially return the exact same unit this year, backups and all. The coaching staff must not consider them the weakness that people on this site do. They did have a decent ypc on runs and were average in pass protection, so I think their level of play has been made out to be worse than it was. I mean, Tashard Choice ran behind the same guys as Barber and against better defenses, but had over a yard more per carry.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Right
I think they considered anomalous due to injury. I’m not sure I agree, but I have to take their assessment over my less informed one.
They were only average because Romo is mobile. Extrapolate their performance with the “KIller Bs” at QB and that’s who they really were last year.
Watched those December games several times now. Romo was dodging like Roger.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Switch Romo with any QB
If Eli played for the 2008 Cowboys, would they go to and win a playoff game?
McNabb?, Warner? Big Ben?
I don’t think so. I know it’s impossible to say for sure, but each of these, I believe, would have struggled on the Cowboys last year.
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
Eli, Peyton and Tom
would have done worse because they could not have avoided the jail breaks that Romo contended with.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I think they all would have won Super Bowls again.
Including Warner and Roethlisberger, and McNabb would have gotten his first win.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Last year?
Behind that line? No chance in H-E-Double Toothpicks. Not unless they change the rule and let you throw the ball from your backside.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I interpret your statement
.. to mean that Romo is the weakest link on the team. Since he would be the only component to be changed, and a Super Bowl win would be the result of having Eli, Warner, McNabb or Roethlisberger as Cowboys QB.
Am I interpreting you correctly?
"He has a peculiar felicity of expression." John Adams
Oh, I thought we were just making stuff up.
I mean, as long as we’re just speculating, all those guys have been to the SB before and all have won it besides McNabb.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
I was just joking around.
Trying to keep things lighthearted.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions
This statement moves the conversation from logical to surreal
Unless these guys also play strong safety, and maybe double as a decent LG, you’re dreaming to think this team would do better under these other QBs. Dreaming.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
It's impossible to know isn't it?
Is it any more ridiculous for me to say that they would have done better with those proven QBs than to say that they wouldn’t have won 2 more games. Who knows?
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
EW!
If Eli played for the 2008 Cowboys …
I just threw up in my mouth a little …
Congratulations Bob Hayes
"I played for the world's greatest professional sports team in history. Once a Dallas Cowboy, always a Dallas Cowboy." - Bob Hayes
http://www.bloggingtheboys.com
by Raul Villaronga on Jul 28, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions
#14 Cowboys?
LOL
Jesus I hope this team proves that wrong or it’s going to be a very disappointing season for us :(
That's actually pretty good...
especially considering it’s coming from ESPN. Most others have the Boys around 18 or 19.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Just as it should be
I think they thought they were pretty good coming into last season. And with good cause. But maybe they didn’t have that “work hard every day” mentality because they felt they were there. I’d much prefer to have them scrap it out this year and develop the grit and hard-nosed attitude that recent SB winners have had.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
At least they don't have to work their way up the rankings to have a shot at the championship
like in college football. Not to mention they don’t have to be 16-0 or 15-1.
That's about where they finished last year.
I don’t think that they’ve clearly improved at any position, although they do have some free agents and young players in position to step up. I hope they do better, too, but I think that’s a fair position based on what we know so far and where they were last year.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I dont know, special teams looks a hell of alot better just get a kicker who can reach farther than the 10
yard line and getting our punter back. I have to believe our Special teams coach is better. Better field position alone makes us better. i didnt even mention Felix returning kicks or all of the young fast hungry rookies.
A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Gen. George Patton
I agree.
On paper, they look better in the kicking game, but they haven’t actually even seen these guys in pads yet. Since none of them were really studs in college, it’s hard to say that they are for sure going to help out, and some articles are saying Buehler might not even dress for a lot of games if he does make the team.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions
They got a much better coach
and players who are hard-nosed, willing tacklers. I think it’s a safe bet the ST will improve. Of course that’s easy to say when you ranked near last.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
And now they have a ST coach w/o a bowl haircut.
That should help.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions
it's also basically the same team that went 13 - 3 and entered last season as SB favorites
can’t have it both ways
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
It's a very different team.
They will have tons of new starters and players compared to that 2007 team.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Where?
Jones for Jones is an upgrade
Bennett will be an upgrade
If Austin beats out Crayton that will be an upgrade
Reeves and Jones for Scandrick and Jenkins is an upgrade
Sensenbaugh for Williams is an upgrade
Igor for Canty – Howcan you go wrong with a guy named Igor?
Carpenter(if he wins) for Burnett might be a downgrade
Williams for Owens is a downgrade although Williams will catch more than 50% of the balls thrown to him.
Just stay healthy and we ar going to be a really ood football team
by Musiccitynorm on Jul 28, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
At least a third of the players that play regularly will be different.
SS, CB, ILB, OLB, DE, WR, WR (maybe), Nickel LB, nickel CB, 2nd TE, one RB, maybe FB. That’s a very different team than the one that went 13-3. Whether they are upgrades or not remain to be seen. Compared to the 2007 team, none of those positions are being replaced by a proven better player, except 2nd TE. I’m hoping that they’re all upgrades too, but that’s a lot of guys to speculate about for a preseason prediction, and you could probably do the same for most teams.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
The pre-season predictions last year were for SB ...
Since THEN, we’ve upgraded or stayed even at:
SS, CB, ILB, 2nd WR, nickel CB, 2nd TE, RB and FB…
The only positions that you may have a case are OLB, DE and 1st WR…
But then again, last year’s team injuries that skewed the ’08 record:
(all of which will be improved before any future injuries)
Punter, TE, O-Line, RB, QB, CB (Newman)
And that does not take into consideration any ST improvements (we can’t get worse)…
Given this, I would say the SB predictions of last year are at least as valid as the one’s saying we’re about 18th best in the league.
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
oops, this was a reply to BPS
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
I agree.
I think 18th is too low, but 10-15 is about right. I also think, knowing what I know, that a case could be made that this is a Super Bowl caliber team. The problem with that is that with the amount of new players that we are bringing in or have returning from injury, there is a lot that is just speculative. So it makes sense that they would default to about where they were at last year, which is 14th to 16th.
by Baked Potato Soup on Jul 28, 2009 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I like the cautious optimism that sneaks out every once in a while on this thread...
People talking realistically of a dominant D … of a healthy O-line making the O look like ’07 …
… and talking about Super Bowl caliber teams.
Damn, optimism always peaks for me within 24 hours of Training Camp!!!
Tar Heels = National Champs in Basketball ... #1 in Baseball ... Top 10 this year in Football?
Tony Romo
I think Romo will have to up the ante,but i believe he can.The distractions are gone ( genuine or not ) and we have an up and coming receiving corps and the best set of tight ends and running backs in the league never mind the division.Go Cowboys.
What I think will help Romo the most is
All of our recievers can catch the ball! Witten and Bennett can both catch the ball, Williams makes circus catches, Crayton can catch, and Austin did not have a droped ball all of last year. Add in the running backs can catch too and its complete group ofQB friendly receivers. Even Hurd has good hands.
Does anyone have an informed opinion on Brewster
I tried to find something on the internet last night about what his recovery will be like. Some things I read suggest he’ll never be the same. Does anyone know about that injury? What a shame if he’s not able to fully recover, the scouting report was pretty good on him.
by StillHateTheGiants on Jul 28, 2009 2:07 PM CDT reply actions
A buddy of mine..
..who was all juiced up, tore his once after attempting to put up more weight than he could handle. It’s definately the type of injury to set you back, strength wise, however, as long as he doesn’t try and ‘rush’ his rehabbing of it, it’ll turn out alright. It’s kind of like… working out for 5 years straight, and quitting cold turkey for a couple months. You still are damn strong, but not as much if you continued to lift.
Hooah.
Funny
Even though there is no report of it, my first thought was “juice”.
Happens a lot, not only because guys over-load, but also because it makes them more prone to rips and tears.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Hey guys!
Mr. Jerry Jones is doing his live State of the Franchise right now on DC.com!
The season begins in 3...2...
Can you tell us what he says?
I left my “Franklin Universal Jerry Jones Translator” at home.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
I would be able to tell you what he says...
if I heard what I thought what he said was what I thought was right…
or what I thought I heard correctly…
then, I think I could tell you more of what he said…
if what he says is comparable to what I heard.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions
You've definitely been listening
to Jerry speak. Slow down. Deep breath. Think of waterfalls.
Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig loves it.
Favorite part of JJs roster rundown
… a healthy Romo and a ‘functioning’ Kitna …
by One.Cool.Customer on Jul 28, 2009 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Please Correct Me If I'm Wrong...
…But Ray Buck of the Star-Telegram is WRONG.
Tony Romo is 0-2 in playoff games.
Our Beloved Cowboys DID NOT make the playoffs in 2008.
They lost in the playoffs during the 2007 season to the Giants — with Romo as the starting QB.
They lost in the playoffs during the 2006 season to the Seahawks — with Romo as the starting QB.
Unless I’m forgetting something, isn’t that only TWO LOSSES?
Celebrity or Imposter?
YOU Decide...
http://www.xanga.com/metaltometal/689036052/celebrity-or-imposter/
Yes
The “reporter” decided that since they did not make the playoffs this year that should count as a loss for some reason.
The "reporter" should change his first name, his middle initial and his last name
Instead of Ray Buck
It should be…
Hey U. Suck!!!
Celebrity or Imposter?
YOU Decide...
http://www.xanga.com/metaltometal/689036052/celebrity-or-imposter/
He's just tryin' to push our boy down more.
The season begins in 3...2...
by Aaron Novinger on Jul 28, 2009 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions
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