Felix , Tashard and the run Dilemma
by DallasPalace on Sep 24, 2009 12:10 AM CDT
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In an embarassment of riches, the Cowboys do have a "run" dilemma. How do they keep all 3 of the heads of the monster satiated? I'm worried about that very much, because we have what other teams don't. Another issue at hand about the "run" dilemma is just how much to use the run versus the pass. Against the Giants, alot of people such as myself feel we did not run enough. The Giants seemed to know our pass plays before we knew we were going to run them. Mysterious, isn't it? Hmmmm?
Was the offense in formations that obviously flagrantly gave away our playcall, and gave the Giants a red flashing alert signal saying "Pass over to there"? The first Romo interception was a little freaky, because the Giants defense against the pass on that play looked too good.
After my mind has settled down here from the frustration of watching my beloved team fall to the Giants again, I started pondering that play a little bit. I wanted to start asking myself questions about what to do offensively to throw the Giants defensive reads off, and this is what I came up with.
I wonder if Jason Garrett has ever considered putting Tashard Choice out there with Felix Jones at the same time.
But if he put both of them out there, couldn't he show the Giants that same formation that made them think "pass to that side", then dump it off to either Tashard or Felix to the other side for a screen?
The Giants defense is fast though. A short pass like that is almost like a run, and it's safer than the forced passes Tony took down the field.
I'm not saying it would work, but it's worth a try. Just in general though, showing pass then going screen or run, has that even been tried?
In any event, Tashard is lethal in his own right, and something else about him- he is a Giant killer. He is always making big plays against them. He had 2 first downs in our second posession that were nice plays. But he didn't get into the game too much after that. We need to use this guy more. What a dilemma. and We haven't even brought up Barber yet......
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Actually all three RBs were in on the same play in the Giants game
Tash and Barber lined up in the backfield, then Felix, who lined up out wide, motioned into the backfield.
The Knights season may have just ended, but the Cowboys year is just begining!
Have they even run a screen
so far this season? I wasn’t able to watch the Giants game…
The reason I voted for Tashard is
He has already had alot of screens go for big plays. Last year, against Pittsburgh, he was devastating with the screen against they’re defense. I would use Felix as a decoy, and fade him to the other side of the screen. How much you wanna make a bet the defense bites, and goes in the direction of Felix? Touchdown, Tashard Choice!
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 24, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Choice was also great on screens against the Giants last year
but so far as I could tell Garrett called zippy screens last Sunday night.
Also, our biggest playmaker (Felix) has no catches this year and two (2) for his career. THIS IS COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE!!!!! WTF?!?!?!
It's been two weeks bro...
and it isn’t like Dallas has had problems moving the football. Offensively it’s been not turning the ball over.
by The Immortal Iron Fist AKA AFB on Sep 24, 2009 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
Its one thing to complain about an offense when its struggling but, hot dam dude, we are number 3 in the league and marching up and down the field. We are trying to keep 8 different guys involved within the parameters of time, down, distance, and score. Without those 4 TOs we would probably be second in the league. Its been 2 games and Felix struggles catching the ball a little. Maybe we should allow the offense a few more games.
KICK ASS every day!!!
Some of us out here...
on the fringes of Cowboy fandom, life is tough. The economy is only now starting to get better, taking things one day at a time. We’re starving out here. Starving for a victory, a big hit on special teams, that look on Brandon Jacobs when we are up on the Giants when time is running out, That look of fear in our opponents when we play them.
Just starving man, starving. I’m hungry.
Let me triple that sentiment DavidH22- WTF!!WTF Mentally, like that, I wonder if that frame of mind can travel through the internet right to the offensive coordinators office, pop up on his screen, and have that light go off in the head.
I understand alot of people think pass offense only means throwing the ball to recievers.
Some of us out here, though, interpret pass offense as to the running backs. Why would you even draft playere LIKE THAT and be not wanting to get the ball in their hands in the open field as much as possible? I’m sorry to say I don’t feel that strongly like that about the recievers. We don’t need to have that be the case though to be successful on offense. The thought of using Felix and Tashard like that is what this offense needs to think like to “get over the hump”. Boy, what a jumpstart that would be.
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
I get you...
but we’ll see the screen eventually.
One of the problems is that Dallas is moving the ball pretty efficiently right now anyways… patience grasshopper.
by The Immortal Iron Fist AKA AFB on Sep 24, 2009 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I 2nd that
Take away even two of our turnovers against the Giants and you have to figure we put up between 34-38 points. So objective number one has to be reducing turnovers, but to add to your point, it’s harder to pick off throws to the running backs. I know Garrett probably doesn’t want to have a dink and dunk offense, but when you have a talent backfield like this, it’s not really dink and dunk because they can make plays and keep the db’s and lb’s honest.
31 till I die
by FelixFanclub on Sep 25, 2009 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions
And that's the real objective...
when your trying to set up the pass, rather than just looking downfield, making your reads, and going through the progressions to pass.
How much you want to bet that if Felix or Tashard had gotten a few of these type of conservative passes, they would have turned them into big gains? And further, how much would you bet that after a couple of plays like that, any team we play would not have the safety ED REED DEEP? Even Baltimore wouldn’t do that with Reed anymore if there was too much success with these kind of passes. These kind of plays make linebackers react too. Why not have less coverage on Witten or Marty B? Then, a pass like that can be thrown to Hurd (or whoever) and even if it’s not complete, it’s not a bad playcall.
You would force the defense to change with plays like that to Felix or Tashard. I hope that Garrett makes it a priority to get the ball to these guys like that, and you have to pick the right times to go long, not just because you want a touchdown.
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 25, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Well...
You’d think that running for 250 yards would also have to force defenses to change right?
by The Immortal Iron Fist AKA AFB on Sep 25, 2009 7:00 PM CDT up reply actions
You would think that
but unforunately Immortal, that wasn’t the case. They gambled, and we didn’t make them pay. They Gambled that in the end, Tony would throw turnovers. We gambled, and believed, that they were banged up in the secondary. Some of us here have always believed the Giants secondary is not only talented, but very deep.
I’ll say it again, like I have in other posts- was it my imagination, or did I see a few fake handoffs that looked like if the ball would have been handed off, the RB would have had clear sailing for maybe, 20 yards? I saw this more that once I might add. Imagine that- add another 60 yards to the 250 we gained on the ground.
The fact remains, running like that didn’t force them to change. They gambled, and were right. Tony and Garrett succumbed to the unbelievable seduction that the passing game has to them, and it was just what they what the doctor ordered as far as the Giants are concerned. Is it so hard for them to believe that we would win a game on the ground?
Believe it or not, that 250 yards you quote, that’s just a number to me. The only number that really matters is wons and losses. We needed to run more, about 15 percent more. They set the trap, and we took the bait. They abandoned they’re usual stiff run defense for defensing the downfield pass, even after we ran for 250 yards. Garrett abandoned the run at every convenient chance, at the time we needed to use it most. That’s why 250 yards doesn’t mean anything, especially if your not willing to read it for what it is. The Giants had not shown the ability or need or they just couldn’t stop the run.
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 26, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions
I think you may be
making way too much of what is essentially one bad play to make your argument about running the football more. Romo shouldn’t have thrown the ball deep in that situation in Giant territory to a guy who was covered. No one disagrees with that fact, even Romo. However, it is a leap to say that somehow by running more that the 50/50 ratio in the Giants game would somehow “gurantee” a different outcome. I don’t think you can really make that case. Guys fumble just like QBs get intercepted. Also, there are running plays that get stopped for no gain and get you in long down and distance situations. Then what? Run some more?
I, for one, do not have a problem with a 50/50 pass run ratio. I have a problem with poor decision making. Cure the decision making issue, the problem corrects itself.
One bad play?
I’m sorry Jevans, let me get this straight, you think I’m basing my argument of running and screen passes to the backs as playcalls over downfield passes based on one play? No. What about Tashard Choice in screens in the Pittsburgh game? How about that second Giants game? sorry, maybe not the run, but the screens are not used enough. Even runs should be used more though.
Did you see the Giants-Bucs game today? I watched it completely, and nothing happened that has made me back off my belief and opinion about the Giants. You can’t take they’re defense so lightly to just blurt out a statement like “I don’t have a problem with the playcall” as far as passing in general is concerned with regards to them. If you call it, you better have earned some respect from they’re defense (in other words, have some success passing). It was a backup CB, Tyrell Thomas, coming up with an interception against Leftwich not unlike Romo’s interception in as much as the throw wasn’t necessary. The Buc’s were about to come back and make it 14-7 if they would have scored. Instead, the Giants won 24-0.
We had a horrible day passing against the Giants. They’re defense had everything to do with that. Nothing happened leading up to that play that would leave me to believe with confidence that they would not sniff it out, just like other horrible interceptions. This kind of risky playcalling (passing at an odd time that wasn’t really necessary) is what allowed them to even be in the game leading up to that point. Those kind of passes did not just happen in this game alone, and not even against the Giants only, in the past leading up to this game. Can’t we just say it out loud? “This has happened too much”, accept it as truth, and leave that kind of risky offensive playcall alone? It’s risky because the Giants have proven that the Cowboys have to be patient with the downfield pass, and earn that right to make that pass by having success passing before you try passes like that. Is it so hard to respect the fact that they’re pass defense is good enough to stop our pass offense? Even they’re backup CB’s and they’re backup safeties are very good. We have to be very careful when we pass the ball against them, If that hasn’t been proven by them yet to this coaching staff, then we are doomed to repeat the interceptions again if they continue with the current offensive mindset (In regards to the Giants).
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 28, 2009 12:31 AM CDT up reply actions
The Bucs got shutout...Yes I saw the game
We put up over thirty points on them so we must be doing something right on offense already. You glorify their defense, but we did enough to win the game on offense. Our only problem is not the play calling, but rather trying to limit those turnovers.
Sorry Rio...
It’s the playcalling in my opinion that caused the turnovers. Those kind of plays may have provided a victory when T.O, was here (not definitely though), but now they are inappropriate for the type of offense we should be trying to become. No one wants to accept that we may have to change as an offense. In my opinion, we have 2 players we have to try to get the ball to in the open field, and that is Felix and Tashard. If we do that, and have success, whether it be run or screen, then the passes down the field will be there. If we don’t, then I believe we will continue to struggle trying to force our pass offense to succeed. This is what I truly believe Rio. Defenses are just too good anymore to just line up and arrogantly think that you will pass down they’re throat regardless of what defense they are playing. We have the weapons to be successful in a short passing game and running game. We just don’t playcall like that. It seems that Garrett abandons the run for the downfield pass just when the defense knows he’s gonna. Some teams can defense that very well, whether we want to believe it or not.
Me giving the Giants defense credit has little to do with praising, and more to do with just giving credit. Please don’t make it out to more than what it is.
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 29, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions
dillema?
having 2 quality RBs that compliment each other and bring a REAL 1-2 type punch.
THEN having a backup who is reliable enough to actualy play along side the other 2 guys
its only a dillema for the defense. period.
sometimes I wish we would have run a bit more in that giants game. im not gonna lie. i was depressed by the performance of romo. BUT IN NO WAY am I asking for his head or anything close to it. when I saw him throw it deep, the first thing i thought was “nail in the coffin” … then it was picked off. hindsight is 20-20 and there are always things we shoulda done. but there is not a doubt in my mind that garret needs to make the calls based on the type of game romo is having …. if hes HOT … let him sling it. (thats my opinion … hes that type of player)
FOR THIS WEEK against the panthers. we really need to keep deangelo and the daily show off the field and that would generally mean more running. like jaxon said, we should be able run right up the gut all day. stick a safety over steve smith and we should really be golden. I also think they should rest barber regardless, let choice handle barbers role of bruiser and keep felix in the same as his usual …. but felix should get more touches.
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I hope Felix does not have a lot of touches i play him in both of my fantasy leagues this week!!!
On a side note though a Cowboys win is way more important to me……So run Felix run
In the end..
Felix did have more touches, but he got injured again. You may want more touches for Felix (so do I), but he is not a workhorse back like Tashard. He doesn’t run up the middle like Tashard either (my opinion). Sometimes, it’s those 2 or 3 yard gains that are the biggest plays. Watching Tashard last night even make a 2 yard gain, it seemed like he did so when the play could have easily been for a loss. What that tells a defense is this simply: “your not gona stop me even if you do have success”, that is why runs that are hard earned like that can’t do anything but boost your confidence.
I do not want to loose what Felix brings to the offense to injury. I believe Felix is our most valuable role player. His role is to be out there if Barber or Choice are out there, and be a factor in the passing game. Our running backs have to be used in the passing game more, specifically Felix and Tashard. Felix has not developed as a reciever yet, and that is why Garrett may not be making playcalls like that yet, but I believe it is in his future. Anything, and I mean anything, we can do to get the ball in Felix and Tashards hands in the open field is what will cure all ills this offense is suffering from. Everything else will fall into place (hint: passing and our D).
I say these things because a Cowboys victory is all that matters. Run Tashard, Run!
PS- Felix and Tashard in the same backfield? Why not? only good for the team will come out of that situation, make no mistake.
"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"
by DallasPalace on Sep 29, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions
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