Jamal Williams anyone?
by TCBinNYC on Mar 4, 2010 3:36 PM CST
52 comments
SD Chargers Special Teamer Kassim Osgood has tweeted that Jamal Williams has been cut by the Chargers. If true, do the Cowboys have interest? Williams is a Wade Phillips guy playing for him in San Diego. Wade was his coordinator in 2005 and 2006 when he was an All-Pro. This does make some sense.
Williams is coming off major surgery after he played just one game last year, but should be fully recovered. I can certainly see a scenario in which Williams plays 20 snaps as Ratliff's back-up. Or packages where Williams is on the nose and Ratliff and Olshansky are the Ends. Or maybe my favorite - a 4 man front with Williams taking two blockers on the Nose, Rat as the under tackle and two ends flanking them. Sure would be nice to have Ratliff playing one other blocker as opposed to two.
And I doubt Williams would be all that expensive. Even if Dallas makes a play for a big time free agent (I prefer Antrel Rolle) Williams might accept a 3 year - $15M deal, which falls under the low-end free agent signee (Dallas can sign unlimited at this level) as long as he agrees to a structure of Yr 1-$3.8M, Yr 2-$4.9M, Yr 3-$6.4.
Thoughts?
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Im sure he wants to start and we all know he wont get that here
plus a lot of teams are switching to 3-4 defense so he will sign with one of them
So why not the team
with a former coordinator who knows what kind of player he is? This could be interesting but I don’t know much about the guy.
I think it will!
"Emotion is highly overrated in football. My wife Corky is emotional as hell but can't play football worth a damn."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Actually, I hope they draft a guy like Cody or Dan Williams...
"Emotion is highly overrated in football. My wife Corky is emotional as hell but can't play football worth a damn."
- John McKay, the first coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
I think it would be a good move if done at the right price.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
he could be lured by:
1) chance to win a Super Bowl
2) chance to start if he proves he can still play at starter level; they’d move Rat to DE (not saying this would happen, but it can be sold as a viable option to a player considering where to sign)
3) familiarity with system; doesn’t have to learn anything new
The guy doesn't have much left
If he wants to win and ease into a familiar system with a former DC, he’s going to think long and hard about the Cowboys. Good post.
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by accidental innuendo on Mar 4, 2010 7:52 PM CST reply actions
You have no idea what he has left.
YOu can make an assumption based on his age, injury and size. But since he only played one game last year and he’s fully recovered, you cant say that for sure. I would at least have him take a physical.
I think you completely missed the point
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by accidental innuendo on Mar 5, 2010 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
I'd be down with him if things worked out in the Cowboys favor.
BTB League Consolation Ladder Champ...thought you knew.
kick the tires
If the guy passes the physical, I am all for it.. A healthy Jamal Williams, seems almost to perfect.
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True, I misspoke in the initial thread
We could sign him for any price.
BTW – PFT is now saying that San Diego is trying to get him back. I havent heard any word on any other interested team.
Well
You have to imagine that there is at least some interest from either party, Wade and Williams, to reunite in Dallas. Players, especially as they age, tend to follow coaches from team to team, once they find a coach they have success with, and coaches like to have players that they have worked with before. And after the instant success of “Wade guys” brought in last year(Brooking and Igor), I can’t imagine he wouldn’t want to bring in someone at a position of need.
I also love the idea of a 4 man front with Igor, Rat, Jamal, and whomever we have it DE, where it be Spears/Bowen or another pick/signee.
I'll live and die with number 9....
I don't
I also love the idea of a 4 man front with Igor, Rat, Jamal, and whomever we have it DE, where it be Spears/Bowen or another pick/signee.
The Cowboys use 4 man fronts in pass rush situations, which is something that Williams could do once upon a time but not anymore… You should use your best pass rushers in 4 man fronts, Williams wouldn’t be one of them.
Now, if you’re talking about red zone Defense against the run? There you have a point, but the Cowboys don’t use 4 man fronts in there…
Viva México! Go Cowboys!
True
Williams may not be a pass rushing NT/DT anymore, but considering Dallas applies pressure with their linebackers more often then not, they need to have someone who can be a space eater and tie up linemen. As much as I love Ratliff, and I really do(hence the profile pic), I don’t know if he is that guy and they could really use an improvement in that area. Plus, even on “pass rushing situations”, you still need to be honest and respect the run.
I'll live and die with number 9....
Space eaters is a double edged sword
They eat space against the run, but they also eat space that blitzers need if they’re supposed to attack the sides of the NT… Williams used to have the lateral quickness to move aside at the last moment for a LB to shoot through, but he doesn’t anymore.
Look at the last few years of Ted Washington, that’s the current Williams, still a really nice player against the run when healthy, but not much anymore.
Viva México! Go Cowboys!
Goal line
more beef on the goal line is what I want and Williams is….beefy
by nicholas.rodriguez on Mar 6, 2010 5:21 PM CST up reply actions
Jamal Williams costs maybe 3 times Siavi, but I don't think
he’ll deliver 3 X the production
Here’s Jamal Williams stat line -
year team games sacks tackles
2004 Chargers 15 4 32
2005 Chargers 16 0 53
2006 Chargers 16 2 69
2007 Chargers 13 0 39
2008 Chargers 16 1.5 56
2009 Chargers 1 0 3
career Total 148 13 394
1.5 Sacks, I thought he was a back field disruptor? Anyway, I don’t see how he’d signifigantly improve over Siavi at this point. Jamal Williams was at his best in 2004, 5 and 6. Would he improve our back up NT spot by a value worth 2.5 million a year?
Wrong
You can’t judge a 3-4 NT on sacks, as for the most part, the majority don’t pressure the backfield. Ratliff is really an exception to the rule. Williams would be a major upgrade over Siavi, and being that there is no cap next year, I don’t see how a one year deal(which is what he’d get, 2 at the most) would be a bad thing. Williams was the epitome of a run stuffing NT, and a space eater, and you can never have enough depth on your dline.
I'll live and die with number 9....
Do you know who Jamal Williams is?
If you think he’s a backfield disruptor, you’ve never seen him play. He rarely gets into the backfield, but what he is is a 360 lb wall in the middle of the field. He takes on two, sometimes three blockers from the offense. It usually takes that many guys to hold him at bay and will take three guys to move him from the middle of the field. Teams cant really run right up the gut because he’s clogging that lane.
Stats dont matter for a guy like this. If he’s doing his job well, he causes opportunities for other players around him. For example, he started getting his just atetntion in 2005 – 2007. During that time he was a Pro Bowler all three seasons and was first team All Pro twice. During that time he had two sacks and 1 forced fumble in 3 years. Yet he was considered the best of the best at his job. In the years he was All-Pro SD was 3rd and 7th in the NFL in Rush D. And in one of those years they led the league in sacks (again, he causes opportunities for others.)
So, to your point. How much better would a 34 year old Jamal Williams be than a 32 year old Junior Siavii? About 10 times better. But that wont show up in his stats.
when he was younger
he was in the backfield all the time, he was Leon Lett-esque for a few years
by AustonianAggie on Mar 5, 2010 3:48 PM CST up reply actions
Get off his nuts
Come on man, lets talk about positions of need, & not some random, washed up 34 year old who wouldn’t even start.
Jake Delhomme is better than Kitna, should we waste money on him too? I can pull some random Geezers out of a hat as well, if not better than you can. Get real
"I'm hurt dog, don't ask me if I'm alright. Hell na man. Juaqin said Dominate & we not doin' it. I'm puttin' my Heart into this #### dog. LET"S GO MAN!"
-The Ed Reed
Back-up Nose Tackles is a huge position of need
Junior Siavii is probably the weakest player on the 53 man roster. If you think upgrading our weakest position with a former All-Pro is not significant, you dont understand the game.
What would happen if Ratliff went down for the season? Its possible the whole defense would fall apart. Williams could at least hold down the fort for a year while Ratliff rehabbed.
Getting a quality backup for Ratliff has been a priority for this team for a few years
the problem is trying to find a good one…Good NT’s are hard to come by to begin with so getting a player like Jamal is rare. Wev’e been lucky that Ratliff has been healthy. I think alot on here would change there tune if they had to see Savii as a starter. We would be so screwed if we had to depend on him. Getting a backup NT is a major priority for this team..
"Austin made the play, Austin saved the day" Brad Sham
Guy, if all your concerned with is our starters
You’re wasting your time in this site during the off season. There’s a good chance we will only have 1 or 2 new starters next year.
Come get me when we sign him (AIN'T HAPPENIN!!!)
"I'm hurt dog, don't ask me if I'm alright. Hell na man. Juaqin said Dominate & we not doin' it. I'm puttin' my Heart into this #### dog. LET"S GO MAN!"
-The Ed Reed
Sorry to burst your bubble...
Mr. Williams will be playing in Denver this year, hate to say I told you so
"I'm hurt dog, don't ask me if I'm alright. Hell na man. Juaqin said Dominate & we not doin' it. I'm puttin' my Heart into this ####. LET"S GO MAN!"
-The Ed Reed
I would wait until late in FA for this type of player
He’s not the same guy, he’s strictly a backup now. The proof is that SD took the chance on cutting him to re-sign him at a lower price.
I’d wait until after the draft and the camp roster cuts, then if Dallas hasn’t found a better option he could be signed. He already knows Wade’s system.
to make the jump to the next level, Odrick said today he needs to work on one area. "Just being more violent overall,'' Odrick said. "Play the game and play it right, violently.''
Jamal could be a great fit
If he’s 80% of what he was before, he’d be an outstanding backup NT. I watched him 2 years ago and saw an absolutely dominant guy up front. Super powerful, and would blow up everything run at him. He also could push the pocket. He’d be a great compliment to Rat, playing goal line and short yardage, and eating up some running downs to keep Rat fresh.
After watching Ware tear up New Orleans in the 4th quarter, I think we’d do well to keep our pass rushers a bit rested so that they can get to the qb on those key drives in the 4th quarter when its all passing. That was one of the great things about the 90s dynasty, how they rotated guys in and didn’t seem to tire.
If he’s ok with a backup role and a reasonable salary, I’d be all over him. Although I agree with one of the other comments, that with so many teams going 3-4, there’s probably someone willing to pay big $$ for big Jamal.
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So was Jason Ferguson...
Then he fell off fast, less than half a season. He went from dominate to a 6th rounder from Miami. It seems like once they start to decline it comes fast & hard
"I'm hurt dog, don't ask me if I'm alright. Hell na man. Juaqin said Dominate & we not doin' it. I'm puttin' my Heart into this #### dog. LET"S GO MAN!"
-The Ed Reed
stop gap at best
wouldn’t offer more than the veteran minimum 1 year contract for this guy, whose best asset is his middle clogging size; but one of his negatives is laziness
"What we've got here is failure to communicate"
Not getting him for the Veteran minimum, but a one or two year 2 to 3 million dollar deal might work
In a cap free year a modest NFL contract that does not tie up the team’s post labor peace future would be a low risk. solid reward signing.
Very different players
Ferguson is a tactican who uses leverage as well as anyone. It is unusual for NT of his build to last as long as he had. It is very hard on the body and most of those guys have RB length careers. Jamal Williams is a huge man who wins a lot of battles based off sheer size and strengh. There have been a number of those guys who lasted into their mid-thirties.
Passing a physical is the key. If he has not ruined his leg he still be a very good 20-30 snap player that this team needs. He is the type of lineman that over matches ever center he faces and always requires help from a guard on inside runs.
UPDATE: Williams taking a physical in Denver today
He also has a visit scheduled to New Orleans, but might not get out of Denver. Not looking good for Dallas. Is everyone asleep at Valley Ranch?
nobody in the cowboys war room
has showed a bit of interest on him, why? he’s old but we need a good backup, what if rat gets hurt?
Since they showed no interest in Williams
I think they are looking to the draft to find a backup NT. This is good news, IMO. I’d much rather bring in a guy who can be groomed as a starter while putting in 15-20 snaps a game to spell Rat.
If Rat were to miss any significant time to injury, they might move Drago over to NT. I don’t know if he’s played there before, but he’s strong enough to handle it.
to make the jump to the next level, Odrick said today he needs to work on one area. "Just being more violent overall,'' Odrick said. "Play the game and play it right, violently.''
Agree to disagree
In a perfect world, you would always rather have the younger guy who you can groom vs the older player who used to be a star but is on the down side of his career. That is, assuming the young guy can actually play and doesnt bust.
However, of all the positions on the Cowboys, this seems like the one where we could use the older guy in this spot. For instance, we wouldnt bring in a vet on the OLine because that’s the problem with the OLine – they are too old. I dont think we need a veteran as a WR because he would impeed the progress of the younger guys. We could use an inside LB there, but again, we are looking for a young guy to groom.
But regarding the NT position, we already have our starter and he’s relatively young. We’re just looking for a guy who can take 20% of the snaps to keep our young superstar fresh. The same cant be said about the other positions. Therefore, if we have to use a veteran in one of our positions of need, NT seems the most likely spot to me.
Finally, we only have 6 picks in the draft. And you have to think that ruonds 6 and 7 typically dont turn into much. So, then we really have 4 good picks that could turn into usable pieces. If that’s the case, we cant fill all our needs (or wish list) with the draft. In my mind we could use (in no order): WR, OT, OG/C, NT, ILB, CB, S, KR/PR. Obviously thats a lot of holes to fill with only 4 good picks. If one of those positions has to be pushed a year or two, NT would be a good option since we already have our starter there and he’s not going anywhere soon. A veteran could hold down the fort for two year and then we can draft a young guy to groom.
Well said
We have some pressing needs at other spots, and Jamal Williams could be an absolute beast in a limited role. The one issue w/ Rat is that his size isn’t ideal for holding the point. Jamal would be a great compliment there. Plus, he’d save the wear and tear on Rat on run downs to keep him fresh to pancake the qb in the 4th quarter. If Jamal is affordable and healthy, I’d be all over him.
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by cowboysuberfan on Mar 9, 2010 5:04 PM CST up reply actions
I don't see as many needs for this team to fill
OL, S, DL are the only positions that I’d describe as a need. The Cowboys can fill those spots, and still take a shot or two on finding a WR or CB who can also be a RS. I know the 6th and 7th rd guys have less of a chance to make the team, but we did find Rat in the 7th rd, so I don’t think you should totally discount late picks. The Cowboys have a talent for finding gems in later rds and in the pool of undrafted rookies.
to make the jump to the next level, Odrick said today he needs to work on one area. "Just being more violent overall,'' Odrick said. "Play the game and play it right, violently.''
Scouts.com is saying we are interested in DE Jarvas Green (NE)
ok, not sure why….
"Austin made the play, Austin saved the day" Brad Sham
Isnt Green the same player as Spears?
I think they are both space eating DEs who provide little-to-no pass rush. And I believe Green is a RFA, so we would have to give compensation. I dont get that.
Schefter is reporting Jamal signed with DEN
Jarvis Green also signed by DEN
to make the jump to the next level, Odrick said today he needs to work on one area. "Just being more violent overall,'' Odrick said. "Play the game and play it right, violently.''
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