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Battle for starting SS and roster spot?

 

With Gerald Sensabaugh expected to miss 3 to 4 weeks with a subluxation in his left shoulder who takes over the starting safety spot? Before preseason, Michael Hamlin would probably be the guy most of us would choose to be back there, but his name hasn't popped up in a big way during training camp. The only time I heard his name mentioned was after he had his concussion/neck strain last game. Barry Church and Danny McCray by reports have been solid in practices and done a fine job on games as well. McCray looking like a special teams ace. But do you trust the SS gig to a rookie? Is Michael Hamlin any less of a rookie than these guys? Will this also serve as criteria for which one of these guys gets cut?


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I have a question I need help with

If Sensi is out but will be back, will he still count as one of the 53? I assume he will, but I don’t know how the short term injuries work. They aren’t like IR, are they? And if you sign someone but then have to cut them a few weeks into the season to bring someone else, how does that work? Do they just get paid on a prorated basis and then become a free agent available for anyone to sign?

If someone can answer, or give me a good link, I would certainly appreciate the chance to get smarter. Or at least better informed.

By the way, I love the help us new guys can get help from the vets here. One of the reasons BTB is the only site to be on.

The new mantra: No more injuries. No more injuries. Everybody now: NO MORE INJURIES!

by Tom Ryle on Aug 22, 2010 11:52 PM CDT reply actions  

Yes, he would be part of the 53 man roster. Only 45 dress on gameday.

Formerly Bye, Dawk :(

by JimmyK on Aug 23, 2010 7:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

I do not have a link,

 I think the PUP list is the only way the team can hold you and not be on the 53. That is out side of IR but there you can not come back that season. But for Sensi to make the PUP list is to be out all off season and camp. So that can not use that for him. For him to come back and play he will have to be on the 53.

by tattooed cowboy on Aug 23, 2010 12:26 AM CDT reply actions  

Right

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 23, 2010 2:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

Nope

PUP: Too late for Sensi. Players are eligible for the PUP only before training camp starts. You’re not eligible for the PUP list if you’ve started training camp on the active roster. If a player begins training camp on the PUP list, he can be moved to the active roster at any time, even after one practice.

A player who enters the regular season on the PUP must sit out his team’s first six games. If the player is not activated within three weeks after the first six games, or does not begin practicing within that three week window, he stays on the PUP list for the entire remaining season.

Injured Reserve: Once you’re on the IR, you’re done for the season. A player on the IR may not practice or return to the active list in the same season.

If a player like Sensi, whom the team values and expects to be back within a couple of weeks, is injured, the team will take him off the game day active list, but maintain him on the 53 man roster. Once he’s healthy again, he’s back on the active list on game day.

If this injury would have happened in week 12, the team likely would have placed him on IR, thus moving him off the 53 man roster, and giving the team the opportunity to fill the 53 roster with additional depth at the position.

by One.Cool.Customer on Aug 23, 2010 3:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

once again OCC comes up with the facts that we need

in the immortal words of Wayne and Garth….“We’re not worthy! We’re not worthy!”

by I draft the Cowboys!!!! on Aug 23, 2010 3:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

I truly bow to OCC

Exactly the kind of info I was looking for.

Now if I can just retain it for more than half a day . . .

The new mantra: No more injuries. No more injuries. Everybody now: NO MORE INJURIES!

by Tom Ryle on Aug 23, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

DOH

I didn’t read tatted cowboys explanation thoroughly enough, and I was too lazy to look it up, unlike the German. Those guys are such sticklers for rules.

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 24, 2010 1:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Barry Church is the front runner for Sensi's backup spot, he replaced him in the SD game and made plays

I have serious doubts about Hamlin even making the team now. He’s missed too much time, both last season and this pre-season, while both Church and McCray have impressed. Not to mention AOA being drafted. He could get caught in the numbers crunch. There’s only 13 days until the roster cut to 53.

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 23, 2010 2:09 AM CDT reply actions  

I second Church,

He’s been very impressive. If he can continue making plays durring the next 2 preseason games I say give him a shot.

by Bermystar on Aug 23, 2010 6:56 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I think Hamlin is going to get cut...

This Church kid is really showing something

by Boyzfan94 on Aug 23, 2010 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm down with Church.

He could handle it against Wash and Chicago. They’ll be playing mostly nickel against the Bears I’d bet.

http://twitter.com/BloggingTheBoys

by Aaron Novinger on Aug 23, 2010 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

Church looked capable.

Of course, if I had my druthers, I wouldn’t have TWO new safeties on opening day. But watcha gone do?

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Aug 23, 2010 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Church lookd great

He broke up a pass against Antonio Gates. Is there a harder task for a strong safety in the NFL?

And then you’ve got McCray who has been a special teams dynamo. I was listening to an interview with DeCamillis this afternoon and Joe could barely stop talking about how much he liked McCray. I have a feeling that if Joe has one pick for the 53, if they ask him “Joe, it’s cut down time. You get one guy on this roster, who do you want?” Joe is going to say McCray.

Then you’ve got AOA who looks like all the raw tools you could want in a strong safety. Big, strong, fast, good ball skills.

So where does that leave Hamlin?

by Blue Eyed Devil on Aug 23, 2010 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hamlin is valuable

and an awesome player, we just haven’t seen him very much. He, out of any safety we have, can play both safety positions. If he has a good outing, he will make the team. If he doesn’t play well, I believe he still makes the team.

"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"

by DallasPalace on Aug 24, 2010 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

What happened to Hamlin

I wasn’t one of the people on his bandwagon. But I remember hearing some of the receivers and coaches talking about how he would be a solid choice for starting FS (if not for Ball). I’m shocked that we haven’t heard anything from him since training camp started. Now it looks possible he might not even make the team – behind a couple of walkons. What happened? Is he hurt?

by JimmyJohnson on Aug 23, 2010 7:18 AM CDT reply actions  

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/news/story?id=5415237

That and probably lack of production. Your guess is as good as mine

Although I'm not a Jets fan, and most certainly not a USC fan, I'll root for any team that Mark Sanchez plays for. Mark Sanchez for Superbowl MVP and President 2012. The change that only I can believe in.

by NYHorn on Aug 23, 2010 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Master Po say

“If a Safety is not on the field, is he a Safety?”

Seriously, I think there is something to this lack of hearing from Michael Hamlin in camp. I can empathize that injuries can prevent him from being able to make a splash, but bottom line, these first four weeks in camp would have been his time to make a challenge to Ball.

Would he even have been listed as backup to Sensi since he was fighting with Ball for the Free Safety job?

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Aug 23, 2010 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Another overrated Cowboy....

Sensabaugh.

I’d rather go with the younger players. Many of the guys I wanted traded are now hurt; Spears, Kosier, Sensabaugh.

by Cwon1 on Aug 23, 2010 1:40 PM CDT reply actions  

You can't lose your starting job because of an injury

but you can get cut off the team in training camp. Hamlin may not deserve it but I think he is going to get cut because of his lack of practice and playing time.

- "If you know so much about women why are you here at the Gas 'n' Sip on a Saturday night completely alone drinking beers with no women anywhere?"
- "By choice! Man"

by fan since '65 on Aug 23, 2010 3:27 PM CDT reply actions  

Once Hamlin gets healthy

he should start over Church as he’s simply a much more talented player.

In Romo we Trust

by Terry on Aug 23, 2010 4:04 PM CDT reply actions  

lol

Terry aka Mr. Matter-O-Fact

That’s a pretty baseless statement.

by Dezstroyer88 on Aug 23, 2010 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thats ridiculus. You play the guys whose combination of making big plays and not making mistakes.

I other words you play the guy who is playing best.
Both guys were play makers in college who arent known for their foot speed. Where exactly is he “much more talented.”

Ability is a poor mans wealth.
The main ingredient of stardom is the rest of the team.
Talent is God given, Be humble. Fame is man given, Be grateful. Conceit is self-given, Be careful.
-John Wooden-

by squidlo97 on Aug 23, 2010 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Church

was all MAC and if wasnt for his speed might of been drafted
Mike Hamlin was good at Clemson but I havent seen or heard anything come out of Valley Ranch recently talking him up
Campo talks up his players and Id say Hamlin getting cut for Church is a good idea and not a reach

by Archie Barberio on Aug 23, 2010 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Based on what?

Church was out there against SD’s first unti offense and he was making plays.

Hamlin has dropped of the radar screen. Maybe it was due to injury, but that’s life in the NFL. Lose time, get out played by replacement, get cut.

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 24, 2010 1:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

Who says

It’s gotta be Church or Hamlin? I think all of you are really meaning to say the name…..Pat Watkins. He is the one that is hurt the most by Church and McCray doing well. We don’t know what Hamlin is capable of yet. We do know what Watkins is all about……

"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"

by DallasPalace on Aug 24, 2010 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

based what i've seen from Church & Hamlin

its not as close as you make it to seem & Church was only out their bc Hamlin had an injury. Hamlin has the size/ability to play FS & SS, plus he’s better in coverage then Church. theirs no question Church can tackle but he lacks a lot of ability in coverage. Church is a lot like Roy Williams & we all saw how that went, plus how does a safety run out of gas & let the QB tackle him?
 this is just my opinion from what i’ve seen & read, i don’t mean it as any harm. Church could turn out to be a probowl SS but i think Hamlin is way ahead of him in the scheme & coverages right now. go watch some old Clemson games w/ Hamlin playing & you can see the kid has a lot of ballhawking ability, the same can’t be said about Church

Move Over Sweetness, Make A Place For Emmitt!

by Va_Cowboy_Fan on Aug 25, 2010 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Another expert on Church speaks

I’m glad you know all about Church’s abilities and limitations. So now he’s as bad as Roy Williams in coverage, nice. I didn’t see that in the SD game.
My point was that the guy was no slouch at Toledo, and he’s shown what he can do in a game situation. Hamlin was a stud at Clemson, got the coaches excited with his camp last season before he got injured, did the same this year, before he got injured. See the pattern? I hope he is the next Ed Reed, but until he shows he can do it, it’s all speculation based on expectation. He’s got 2 games to show what he can do.

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 26, 2010 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

your the one acting like an expert i just replyed to it

i just stated a fact that its not as close as you made it out to be. Hamlin is far from dropping off the radar screen. what did you see in the SD that makes Church so great already? he picked up a fumble in a preseason game that landed at his feet & got caught by a QB before he could score? i don’t know his limitations & i never would speculate about them but the comparision (his abilities) about Roy Williams has been made by alot of experts, i didn’t just make it up lol. i don’t argue the unseen future w/ anyone but the facts about Church are another story, its no secret he’s slow & has stuggled covering.
 Hamlin is a lot better athlete, faster & has more experience in this defense, i’m just stating a fact. just bc Hamlin went down to an injury didn’t change his knowledge for the game. Hamlin is a lock on the roster this year & Church just got on the right side of the bubble. i think we would be in huge trouble having a undrafted rookie starting at safety that struggles w/ his speed & has a limited idea of what he’s doing on the field, you can’t learn an entire playbook in TC. i don’t know what Church can be in the future but hopefully we don’t have to find out this season. he made a good play picking the fumble up but he’s not ready to start any games by a long shot.
 Hamlin gives us a better chance to win right now if Sensabaugh is out, which is just a fact. i just replyed to your post bc it seemed like you discounted Hamlins ability for a guy thats never been in a 3-4 or a meaningful NFL game as a undrafted rookie. i think Church is more of a project that has some upside but i doubt he could out play Watkins atm. Hamlin was also drafted as a FS more then the SS bc of his athletic ability/speed but if he can move to SS then it ups his value on this roster. so do i believe Church will be a great player? i don’t know bc i can’t see the future but my common sense tells me he’s really raw atm. i want all the Cowboys players be the best they can be & i would take Church over Watkins if we have someone to replace him on special teams but right now Church is a nobody.

Move Over Sweetness, Make A Place For Emmitt!

by Va_Cowboy_Fan on Aug 26, 2010 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

A Terry post! Open fire!

If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot. ~Dean Smith

by Benthere on Aug 24, 2010 2:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

IN other words.

Ability is a poor mans wealth.
The main ingredient of stardom is the rest of the team.
Talent is God given, Be humble. Fame is man given, Be grateful. Conceit is self-given, Be careful.
-John Wooden-

by squidlo97 on Aug 23, 2010 4:50 PM CDT reply actions  

I was never really a Mike Hamlin guy

prolly because he shares the great last name of another mediocre player in Jen Hamlin
Church I was on since day one thinking he could make the team
crazy how Hamlin goes from preseason hype possible starter to being cut
interesting

by Archie Barberio on Aug 23, 2010 4:54 PM CDT reply actions  

He hasn't been cut yet

But he is in jeapordy if he doesn’t perform.

"Amongst the enemy's Lair, there will always be a DallasPalace!"

by DallasPalace on Aug 24, 2010 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

So it looks like Hamlin will be the first to get a crack at SS

Reports from ESPN and DMN says he got the reps with the first team at SS and coaches are still high on him. I still have hopes that he’ll come around. We’ll see this week.

by Cowboysaficionado on Aug 23, 2010 10:43 PM CDT reply actions  

M Hamlin was a playmaking safety in college

i can’t see anyway Church gets the nod over Hamlin imo. Chruch is battling to make the roster & has a lot of ways like the the old Roy Williams, his knock was that he’s an in the box safety for the most part. i did read Church was doing some positive things w/ coverages but he’s still raw. Hamlin was a huge camp standout last year on defense & special teams, the guy has speed & tackles well. the concussion Hamlin suffered opened the door for the undrafted rookies to get some playing time & possibly replacing some core special teamers but i don’t think they know the defense like Hamlin.
 i’m all for the best player to win the job & i’m just stating that Hamlin is very athletic ballhawking safety that plays whistle to whistle so i wouldn’t count him out. also w/ Hamlin, Church & McCray all being able to play SS, if one of them shows the coaches they can be consistant then it might make it hard for Jerry to resign Sensa to a big contract. Sensa might have to either lower his dollar amount on a contract or play somewhere else.
 1 thing is for sure, you gotta love how Campo coaches up the DBs & how he stays late on his time to help them. Campo never had a real chance to succeed as a HC w/ Quincy Carter or any of the other scrubs at QB, plus the whole team was just young & raw except for E.Smith…i think Campo can coach young players really well & he seems to be developing our DBs w/ quality. i can’t remember the last time we had so many CBs & Safetys that we couldn’t decide who to keep. i hope McCann doesn’t get picked up off waivers & makes it to the PS bc next season he could become a keeper.
 Hamlin has a chance to show what he can do & take another step in the right direction but if he stinks it up then they won’t have far to look for a replacement….

Move Over Sweetness, Make A Place For Emmitt!

by Va_Cowboy_Fan on Aug 25, 2010 2:11 PM CDT reply actions  

Then the best solution may be to keep Hamlin, Church, and McCray

And let Sensi play out his one year deal. He’s been an adequate SS, but not irreplaceable.

Thank you #22, for everything you did for the Cowboys. There will never be another one like you.

by APerfectStar on Aug 26, 2010 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

i dont think that is going to Happen

Jerry has already said that he wants to give Sensi an extension. Now with the Play of our safeties has that changed Jerry’s Mind? Who Knows…..

by I draft the Cowboys!!!! on Aug 26, 2010 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I doubt Sensi leaves as well.

BUT, Sensi has said he won’t negotiate on a new contract during the season. IF a deal doesn’t get done before Week 1 (probably won’t be) and IF Hamlin, Church and/or McCray really impress this season or IF Sensi gets hurt… then it could happen. In which case, he’d be kicking himself for not getting a deal done.

Chances of all of that happening? I wouldn’t bet on it. I think Sensi is back next season as well.

Rabid and luvin' it

by lonewolfz28 on Aug 26, 2010 9:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Roger that on Campo.

he does coach up the DBs, and he didn’t have much to work with when he was head coach here before.

"We'll see." --Bill Parcells

by Uncle Angus on Aug 25, 2010 4:00 PM CDT reply actions  

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