Dallas Cowboys Draft Strategies (Pt 4): Emulating The Colts and Patriots
Follow me on a little trip down memory lane. It's the end of the 2009 season. Your team has just lost its final postseason game in a fashion that was not in line with the performance in most of the previous games, both during the regular season and the playoffs. Your GM even publicly scolded your teams’ offensive line:
"Our offensive line, by our standards, did not have a good game. They were outplayed by our opponents’ defensive line. […] Therein lies the result. It had nothing to do with strategy or preparedness or toughness or effort."
Many observers argued that the performance of your offensive line has been sugar-coated anyway, because the few positive stats your offensive line accumulated were more a result of the mobility and quick release of your Pro Bowl quarterback than anything else.
Heading up to the 2010 draft, most analysts believed your team would beef up an offensive line that was widely felt to be in need of some talent upgrade. Your team plays right into this perception by cutting a player from the left side of the O-line. Now imagine that your team, despite a publicly perceived dire need along the offensive line, does not pick an offensive lineman in the first three rounds of the 2010 draft. Nope, your teams goes out and drafts positions that many felt were in fact relative positions of strength.
Sound familiar so far? Believe it or not, the team we're looking at here are not the Dallas Cowboys.
The team I just described are the Indianapolis Colts, widely recognized as one of the more successful drafters of the past decade or so. In today's post, we'll look at the Colts and Patriots and see what would happen if the Cowboys emulated those teams' draft strategies. Once again we'll use Drafttek's Online Draft Simulator (ODS) to run our mock drafts for each scenario. Read up on it here if you missed the first couple of parts.
About a year ago, David Syvertsen at the now defunct newerascouting.com analyzed the Colts past 12 draft classes and concluded that the key to the Colts success was following a three-point philosophy:
1. Build around your strengths
2. Find players that fit the system
3. Draft the overachievers
During last year's combine, Colts GM Bill Polian explained his draft strategy:
"We always try to draft the best player available, and the best example I can give is Reggie Wayne," he said. "We had a big need for a cornerback that year, but we could not agree on who that should be. So we turned around, traded down, and took Reggie Wayne, who was the best player available at that pick. And it turned out to be the right thing.
And it always is, you should take the best player. You might be wrong in the assessment of the player, but as long as you take the best player your odds of success are very much greater."
An argument could be made that the Colts are one sack away from being a perennial 7-9 team, but since that is likely true for most other teams as well, we'll shelve that discussion for now.
While Bill Polian has come under criticism lately for his draft results, the Colts have been quite successful despite picking at the very bottom of each round for most of the last decade. So let's try to figure out what the Colts' three-point strategy could look like for the Cowboys.
First off, outside of a personal interview, I don't know of any measurables that would identify 'overachievers', so I'll skip that point, which leaves 'building your strengths with players that fit your system'. Over the last few years the Cowboys strengths have arguably been the passing game and the pass rush, along with a solid, if unspectacular running game.
In the logic of the ODS (see detailed explanation here) that would make receivers and OLB's a P3 priority, where you want to get a starting caliber prospect without reaching. The QB and RBs get a P4 grade, which should give you some solid depth at those positions.
Historically, the Cowboys game has always been built around solid linemen on both sides of the ball, so I'll add the big guys with a P5 code. What I'm looking for here are some safe guys that I can groom and who will eventually become my starters. They may never make the Pro Bowl, but if I can get enough of them I'll make the playoffs. Here’s how the Priority Codes might shake out in a Colts scenario:
| Offense | Defense | ||
|---|---|---|---|
| P3 | WR | P3 | OLB |
| P4 | RB, QB |
P4 | - - |
| P5 | OT, OG, OC |
P5 | DE, DT |
| P9 | All others | P9 | All others |
So now we feed these positional priorities into the ODS, where we also mix in a little Drafttek Big Board, add the team needs for the other 31 NFL teams, spice it up with Drafttek's proprietary algorithm, et voilá: a Cowboys seven-course draft menu:
| 1st Round | 2nd Round | 3rd Round | 4th Round | 5th Round | 6th Round | 7th Round | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Player | Robert Quinn, OLB, North Carolina | Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama |
Chris Hairston, OT, Clemson |
Greg McElroy, QB, Alabama | Cedric Thornton, DE, Southern Arkansas | Anthony Gray, DT, Southern Miss | Jeff Maehl, WR, Oregon |
| Reach/ Value | -1 | +22 | +19 | -11 | -9 | -22 | -29 |
This mock gives the Cowboys a fearsome passrusher in DeMarcus Ware's mold. And although RB is not that high of a priority for the Cowboys, when they see Ingram still on the board for their second round pick they immediately grab him. The Cowboys are surprised to see Hairston still available when they pick in the third and take him. With the fourth pick, the Cowboys grab QB Greg McElroy. Like RB, QB isn't a need position, but if you think the Colts know something about drafting, this could be one scenario that fits that BPA strategy. McElroy, like Garrett, may never become a starter in the league, but could be a good backup with McGee. Plus, the Cowboys get a head start on a guy who could be their coach twenty years down the line...
The remaining picks are strictly for depth. Following the Colts strategy (and the mock above is just one permutation of many such draft outcomes) carries the real risk of not drafting any immediate starters for the O-line - then again, the last time Bill Polian drafted an offensive lineman in the first round was in 1995 when he was in charge of the Panthers. It also doesn't address the needs in the Cowboys secondary. Both points go to show that a strict BPA approach is not much more than a fairy tale.
Having said that, there are names on that mock that I really like, but filling all the holes on the roster via free agency may be too much to ask of the Cowboys front office.
This year the Patriots have an astonishing six picks in the top 100, two each in the first, second and third round. This is no coincidence. The Patriots are the classic draft pick stockpilers, a strategy that favors quantity over quality.
Contrary to what many believe, the Patriots are not great drafters, but by collecting as many picks as they reasonably can, they are playing a math game and simply increasing their odds of hitting on a starting-caliber player at a relatively low cost.
This is a strategy that can be particularly effective if you have a core of players that you want to build a team around, but it is not a good strategy for finding those elite players that you need in order to have someone to build a team around. Or as BTB member White Wolf so eloquently put it:
They [Patriots] can’t afford all these picks/players. They need something besides smurfs at the skill positions.
A stockpiling strategy is about finding value low in the first round and acquiring multiple second and third round picks. The Patriots achieve this by doing three things:
1. Player trades: trading veteran players (usually at the end of their contracts) for draft picks.
2. Draft-day trades: trading down to the end of the first round or top of the second, where talent is good and contracts are cheap. And then trade down some more to get even more picks.
3. Future picks: trading a draft pick in this year's draft for a pick in next year's draft.
Jerry Jones is no slouch himself when it comes to trading down, and he claims to already have received two offers to trade down at No. 9, so let's see how that strategy could work out for the Cowboys. Importantly, 'stockpiling' is about stockpiling in the first three rounds, not about picks in the fourth round and lower like the Cowboys' 10 triple-digit picks in 2010.
Trading for future picks is (nearly) out of the question. Unless it's a deal that's just too good to pass up it's not something we're likely to see this year where the Cowboys have a lot of holes to fill. Similar situation for player trades. The Cowboys have four veteran players whose contracts expire in 2012 (McBriar, Brooking, James, Spencer), and I don't think any of them are suited to get the Cowboys the high draft picks they would be looking for with a stockpiling strategy.
Here are two trades designed to maximize the number and value of picks in the top 100 for the Cowboys:
1. San Diego 18 + 61 + 89 (1337) for Dallas 9 (1350)
When Robert Quinn is still around at number nine, the Chargers pull the trigger and trade up to re-establish a semblance of a pass rush in San Diego.
2. Chicago 29 + 62 (924) for Dallas 18 + 170 (924.4)
Chicago is desperate for O-line help, and when Anthony Castonzo is still around when Dallas is on the clock, the Bears know they must jump ahead of the Giants to get him.
Ignoring compensatory picks, the Cowboys now have nine picks, a first rounder (29th), three second rounders (40, 61, 62) two third rounders (71, 89) and their original fourth, fifth and seventh rounders (109, 139, 210).
Here’s how the team at Drafttek currently see the Cowboys team needs:
| Offense | Defense | ||
|---|---|---|---|
| P3 | OT | P3 | CB, DE |
| P4 | OC | P4 | DT, OLB, ILB, FS, SS |
| P5 | OG | P5 | - - |
| P9 | All others | P9 | PK |
We will use these pre-set needs to run the ODS with the Patriots/Stockpiling scenario for the Cowboys. Here is what that draft could look like:
| Round / Pick |
Player |
Reach/ Value |
Rationale |
|
1st (29th) |
Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin |
+3 |
Let's hear it from Gabe Carimi himself why he would be an instant upgrade on the right side of the line for the Cowboys: |
|
2nd (40th) |
Mike Pouncey, OG, Florida |
-9 |
Pouncey's size and versatility make him the top guard in the draft and the Cowboys are delighted to get him in the second round. |
|
2nd (61st) |
Allen Bailey, DE, Miami |
+6 |
Allen Bailey is a classic Cowboys pick. Outstanding athleticism and skill set, great combination of size and speed, but he's never quite put it together for a dominating performance. The Cowboys believe they can coach him up and add a little more bulk to his frame without losing his athleticism. |
|
2nd (62nd) |
Curtis Brown, CB, Texas |
-9 |
The 6-0, 184 pound corner has great speed and great hands. Brown is easily a top 5 corner, but his draft stock wasn't helped by the Longhorns' 2010 season. Brown is a recent riser on many draft boards after posting very good Combine numbers. He'll see a lot of action on special teams and in nickel/dime packages, and may be Newman's successor as early as 2012. |
|
3rd (71st) |
Tyler Sash, SS, Iowa |
-9 |
Sash is probably the second best strong safety in the draft after Clemson's DeAndre McDaniel. Sash played in a pro-style zone defense and would likely challenge for a starter spot immediately. At 211 pounds he may need to add some weight, but he has good speed and is a solid tackler. He's also shown that he can lead a defense. |
|
3rd (89th) |
Titus Young, WR, Boise State |
+28 |
Titus Young simply represents too much value to pass up at the end of the third round. Young is a burner who's drawn comparisons with DeSean Jackson for his blazing speed. A good route runner who's a home run threat with the ball in his hands. |
|
4th (10th) |
Chris White, ILB, Mississippi St. |
-6 |
White is a tough inside linebacker with good instincts and a great football IQ. |
|
5th (139th) |
Jeremy Beal, OLB, Oklahoma |
-13 |
Beal was the Big 12 Defensive Player of the Year and a first-team All-Big 12 pick in 2010, putting up 66 tackles, 18 for loss, 8.5 sacks, six pass breakups and three forced fumbles. He had a very bad showing at the Senior Bowl which saw his draft stock plummet significantly. As late as November 2010 Beal was considered a potential first round prospect. |
|
7th (210th) |
Tejay Johnson, FS, TCU |
-15 |
Johnson is said to have good leadership skills on the field, and great instincts which make up for his lack of speed. |
The Cowboys end up parlaying their first round pick into two additional second rounders and one extra third rounder. On paper (or on your screen, as it were), this looks like a solid draft. All the major need areas are addressed with good prospects. It's likely that more players in this draft class would make it in the NFL than in a draft class without any trades.
But are there enough difference makers here, or have the Cowboys just drafted a bunch of role players? Only time will tell, but based on this mock, it's easy to understand the allure of a stockpiling strategy. Except of course if you draft a bunch of smurfs.
[Tomorrow we'll have the fifth and final part in this series up, as we look at what drafting against the other teams in the NFC East could look like]
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Comments
FIRST!
Like the first three. After that would like to see us take Titus. I know he has some character flaws, however this is Roy W’s last year b4 we get rid of that rediculous contract and wr’s typically take 2 yrs to develop. How bout adding him to Witten, Austin and Dez!
If we had a draft like that I'da thunk I'd died and gone to heaven.
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem.
+1
both were good but the 2nd one would be miraculous. Especially if either safety is any good
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah I don't think so...
There’s several issues with the Colts and Patriots’ draft strategies. As much as the Patriots get praised for their draft strategies when they’ve traded down, in the past four years they’ve passed on Dez Bryant, Michael Oher, and Clay Matthews. Three pro bowl franchise players. In fairness they got Devin McCourty instead of Dez Bryant, and McCourty’s pretty good…but that 2010’s draft was an anomaly in terms of talent available in that draft. The players that the Cowboys would likely be passing on would be guys who are true blue chippers. The reason why the Patriots and Colts are so good every year is because they have each have one of the ten best players to ever play the game, yes, they draft well. They have fantastic scouting departments and good coaches, but it’s really Manning and Brady that get it done for them. I’m firmly of the “get their guy” strategy. If you can trade back and “get your guy,” awesome. Otherwise, do your best to get your guy.
Despite what you may think Colts and Pats aren't one man teams
Brady and Manning are great, but they wouldn’t have had as much team success without great players around them which were drafted by the BPA strategy.
In Romo we Trust
"great players around them"
Well the Patriots have Vince Wilfork, Jerod Mayo, and Devin McCourty, and other than that their defense kinda sucks. Tom Brady’s making guys like Aaron Hernandez, Julian Edleman, and Brandon Tate look grate because he’s no worse than the tenth best player ever.
The Colts have Reggie Wayne and Jeff Saturday is pretty good too, other than that Peyton Manning’s pretty good at making mediocre WRs look great and avoiding sacks in general. Ask Brandon Stokely about that one. Their running game completely blows, and the O-Line needs a lot of help, Manning is the guy that makes that offense.
I love this...
10th best player ever. Where do you make this stuff up? Brady has become great, but his first and second super bowl victories were because of the great players they had on defense. And also now we know, because they knew what the offense was going to do. Funny how without players like Brusche, Seymour, and co, they haven’t won a super bowl.
Peyton Manning has won exactly one super bowl, and it just happened to be in the season that he had a great running game, solid defense, and 2 star WRs. Great QB’s don’t win super bowls, great teams do. What all this had to do with me liking the second draft in this post is still a mystery.
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem.
Well they pretty much won the 2007 Super Bowl if it wasn't for Asante Samuel dropping an easy pic or David Tyree having elephant semen on his hands or something
And yes, Brady is a legit great…he may get too much credit for his Super Bowls, but he’s done great things with a mediocre offense around him and has had a couple of all time great QB seasons too. As far as Manning goes, he may be the greatest player ever. If you don’t realize that, you’ve got the wrong hobby. Anyways, what this has to do with your post as to liking that draft? In the first reply, I noted that the Patriots, specifically, have an overrated draft strategy. In trading down they passed on a couple of franchise players and ended up selecting averageish players. They’re great at catching guys who slip through the cracks, but as far as an overall draft strategy the “trade down” strategy has its issues. Yeah, its great when you look at it in a mock and the players you get…however, once you see what players you’ve passed up and the impact they can provide it becomes troublesome.
Greatest ever. LOL.
I’ll take Jerry Rice, Emmitt Smith, Lawrence Taylor, Joe Montana, Troy Aikman, ah hell, I could go on forever. Peyton Manning is a great QB, but the greatest player ever? Not. And my hobbies of none of your business.
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem.
that is funny
Everyone seems to judge qbs on playoff success and Manning has been extremely mediocre in that department, but still, he’s the greatest ever.
If that isn’t contradictory I don’t know what is.
In Romo we Trust
SSS
It was a different game back then, there’s other factors at play. You’re smarter than that…those who judge QBs on playoff success are idiots. Sure, it’s a factor, but to place as much emphasis on it as most people do is just plain stupid.
by Omar Little on Mar 25, 2011 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions
and you proved my point since the Pats got upset in the playoffs
same with the Colts….thanks.
The years they were successful they had much better players. QBs by themselves can’t win or loss games.
In Romo we Trust
Sigh...
No, I didn’t. Your point: the Patriots and Colts have a trade back, BPA, stockpile approach to the draft which leads to their success. I’m telling you that their success hinges on the fact that they have two all time great QBs. I’m saying that the greatness of their QBs is what keeps them in contention. If they had a better draft strategy where they tried to acquire great players high on draft boards, as opposed to what they do now, they would win even more games.
The fact that the Jets fluked their way into victories over the Patriots and the Colts, the Colts victory was a bit foreseeable since that team was fairly medicore, but fluke victories happen. The 2007 Giants beat the 2007 Patriots, small sample size, get over it.
by Omar Little on Mar 25, 2011 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
I like that mock a lot
It would be nice to get a 1st rounder better than Carimi, but he’s an instant upgrade at RT. Pouncey could easily step in for Bigg or Kosier, though I just don’t know if he’ll be around that late.
Greetings from the Humungus, the Ruler of the Wasteland, the Ayatollah of Rock and Roll-A. I laugh at your puny plans.
first
That first draft says that Greg McElroy is from East Carolina U.
Second, Colts build around their strengths, but never draft QBs. Doesn’t that take away from the thought that QB gets a P5 designation?
thanks for the pointer. McElroy is fixed.
As for the Colts, after Manning, they did draft Jim Sorgi in 2004 and Curtis Painter in 2009.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions
That second draft
looks to be nearly perfect, from my point of view. If that actually happened, I think Cowboys fans would be feeling really optimistic.
However, from a philosophical point of view, the Patriots would find a way to get a pick or two extra for next year and would dump a veteran that nobody would expect them to dump, to get an extra pick or two. That’s the real difference. Even talking about trying to trade Newman, Cowboys fans start cringing. Pats would have said goodbye to him in 2010.
Exactly
The Pats always trade into next year. Their late 2010 third round pick becomes the first 2011 second round pick. Last year the Panthers used that pick for WR Armanti Edwards, this year at #33 he Pats could be looking at WRs Jon Baldwin, Leonard Hankerson or combining picks to move up from the mid first and grab Julio Jones – NICE.
I would love to see the trade downs work out so well. Carimi shold be a solid RT, but I would like to see one of those 3 seconds become 2012 first or a combined 2012 second and 2011 third.
So who starts at FS next year?
"You can't live a perfect day without doing something for someone who will never be able to repay you."
- John Wooden (God rest his soul)
More like
TBD :-)
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
Love the Patriots draft
Like OCC says, the Patriots don’t draft better than other teams, they just draft more. That’s how they get more good players.
If the Cowboys draft went that way, as per the post, most holes would be arguably plugged. Now not every player might work out, but because you get so many, quote a few will. Instead of 3 players in the first 3 rounds, you have 6!
love the Patriot draft trade scenario
but I agree with Chia, Carimi is gone by 29 and so is Pouncey at 40.
Maybe
Nobody know until the players are selected – Dez was supposed to be gone by #24 last year.
If Carimi is gone, maybe Derek Sherrod is still around, likewise Pouncy could be replaced with Wisniewski or Ijalana. Maybe the Boys go in a differenct direction and take Jake Locker at #29 – who really knows which prospect will be available and percieved as a value by Jerry Jones? The point is with the trade downs, Jerry would still have two more chances in the late second round.
I agree that trading down is a really reasonable way to go
I’m just cocerned that trading down that far will restrict their draft options. If O-line is the top priority and I think it is, trading down to 14-15 makes more sense. Then you could be assured of getting one of the top linemen. With the Rams you should pick up a #3 and #4. This would allow you to trade back up into the first to grab Pouncy or one of the many good DL’s or stay put and pick at #40. Then you have the option to trade back into the second with the extra picks if someone again falls. A trade with the Dolphins would also give you the same set of options.
That may very well be true
But you know what I found interesting? I’ve proposed something like 12 different mocks over the last week, some of them more realistic than others, and I tried very hard to vary the picks in the 1st and 2nd rounds as much as possible. And almost every mock got a comment that “no way” was this or that player going to be available at this or that spot.
That tells me one thing: there will be multiple prospects available for the Cowboys, regardless of which spot they actually end up picking in. Of course, that is unless a black hole opens up in the middle of the first round and swallows 15-20 top prospects.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Does this model
this computer driven model, pick every pick in the draft? So this model is actually predicting that Titus Young drops 28 spots in the 3rd round, for example?
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
So it appears it does. This is a neat little program. I wonder how it anticpates narrow player lists, ie each team having only 120 players on its board, and if that’s a major detriment to it’s accuracy
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I can "grab" players
If the algorithm suggests a player that I don’t like, and there’s a player further down that I like, I can tell the programm to "grab him if he’s still available when I pick.
Case in point: In the “Patriots/Stockpiling” mock, the program suggested the Cowboys take Marcus Cannon, OG/OT, TCU with the 40th pick. I didn’t like that idea and “grabbed” Pouncey who was still available a few picks further down.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
this program is trying to be fair
if we had that 2nd mock, I think this draft would border on historical in many ways
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
And it always is, you should take the best player. You might be wrong in the assessment of the player, but as long as you take the best player your odds of success are very much greater
this is key quote to me.
to reinterpret a Ben Franklin quote
those that sacrifice talent for need are likely to end up with neither.
by Fan in Thick and Thin on Mar 24, 2011 11:50 AM CDT reply actions
I'm not real high on Allen Bailey
I think there might be a better 5 technique option there. I guess whats desirable about Allen Bailey is that he’d be a mediocre 5tech, but on 4 down linemen packages, he’s had success as a pass rusher from the 3-spot (DT)
ie he’d line up next to Ratliff on 3rd down, like Stephen Bowen does. Sadly neither Bailey or Bowen are good as DEs, not like Ware and Spencer. If we drafted this player I’d expect to see him drop in to coverage while Spencer and Ware rushed as a DE and blitzing OLB
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 12:03 PM CDT reply actions
Do NFL teams
deploy similar technology? Do they have live simulators working in the War Rooms or is it still white board/index cards?
I appreciate the disclaimer for the Colts, Polian has taken some shots for his f=drafts over the last few years. The write-up on the accompanying click-though for the IND Drafts during his tenure is revealing, a similar analysis for DAL could be as well.
We live life forwards and understand it backwards
They do
STATS Llc offers a software tool called ICE (Interactive Collaboration and Evaluation) for exactly such a purpose. It is of course vastly different from the ODS that Drafttek offers, but it is much more than a traditional draft board.
Below is a screenshot, and here’s a link to an article on the software tool. And this is just one example, there are probably more.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions
the Cowboys were light years ahead in computer aided draft technology
up to and including Jimmy’s trade chart. I’d think we’d at least share the lead in this role
by AustonianAggie on Mar 24, 2011 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Love the Patriot draft
If Carimi is gone there is always Solder. I would actually like Watkins over Pouncey. Getting an OT in the first and the extra picks in the 2nd and 3rd would be great. I also love the Tyler Sash pick and think he will be a fan favorite.
I love extra late picks
but only if the boys use them to move up. Generally their draft choices in rounds 3-7 don’t pan out very well. I’d be more comfortable with more picks in the first or second round and even the early third than multiple late picks. Look at what the Patriots have done. They have 2 firsts, 2 seconds, and 2 thirds this year. Belichick can pretty well do whatever he wants with that arsenal. The only problem he has is being able to find roster spot for all of them if he doesn’t trade some of his picks.
Agreed.
I don’t like the way that you just pile up extra late round picks, especially in this year’s draft. There’s a few guys in the later rounds that I’d love to take a chance on like Demarcus Love, Ricky Stanzi, and a few others. Other than that, I think most of these late round picks are going to be basically slightly better versions of Orlando Scandrick. Meaning, solid bench player, shouldn’t be starting much more than two or three games a year…but nothing to get excited over.
An argument could be made that Polian is the best GM in the league
and his draft strategy is taking the BPA….that should tell you something.
And how does Pouncey end up being available at 40 in all these mock drafts?? I think he’s easily a first round pick and would actually be surprised if he lasted past pick 20.
In Romo we Trust
Why is Pouncey available at 40?
The easy answer is because he’s rated 49th on the Drafttek big board, and no other team considered grabbing him ahead of the 40th spot in the simulator.
The slightly more complicated answer is that there are 3 other linemen ranked higher than Pouncey due to their positional versatility. I think it’s safe to say the experiment with Pouncey playing center at Florida failed. That makes him a guard only, with no positional versatility. Players ranked above Pouncey:
#27 Stephen Wiesniewski (OC/OG)
#37 Jason Pinkston (OG/LOT)
#40 Marcus Cannon (ROT/OG)
The value of these players on the drafttek board lies in the fact that they can play two positions, Pouncey cannot, which makes each one of the three players more valuable than Pouncey. I may not agree with drafttek’s ranking, but I understand their logic. Anyway, as they update their big board every week, everything might look different next week.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I disagree
Pouncey can play both guard and center….drafttek is way off base on this guy for sure.
In Romo we Trust
I think it’s safe to say the experiment with Pouncey playing center at Florida failed.
I have to agree with OCC. I think Pouncy is great, but he will look to be only a Guard in the NFL.
even if thats the case, he'll never get past the Steelers at 31
who would love nothing more than to have identical twin brothers playing side by side for years to come
In Romo we Trust
I think you are probably correct there
One would think that makes the Steelers OL that much more cohesive at a much faster rate. Especially since the work ethic of the Pouncey brothers is apparently high.
Regardless is Pouncey is there or not, we should still be able to have a good choice at OG at #40, unless another “1st Round talent” guy is available at #40.
As always, I love all the analysis, thanks OCC
I really like what you have been doing with this series, it is great see how a different approach can reap different results.
Obviously the second mock is the best situation. Regardless of the exact names, I think the thought process is great with the second mock.
A Day 1 starting caliber RT – Round 1
Additional Depth at OG, DE and CB
Later Rounds get a couple Safties and an ILB and WR
Living in Oklahoma, I had the opportunity to watch a lot of Jeremy Beal play and while I really like the guy, I don’t know that he would do much in the NFL as a 3-4 OLB. IMHO
OCC
I haven’t looked at the Draftek drafting predictor thingy yet, but I was wondering if you can save your settings? Can you re-run these during the draft and show an updated predicted pick once actual picks start coming in. It would be cool to see a real time update during the draft. If it is a little time consuming, maybe a few of us can take on responsibility of various agreed to philosophies and share results during the draft?
probably not
I can only work one mock at a time with the tool, and I’ll be way too busy with other things during the draft. But the tool does allow you to “Mock” the draft live, including draft day trades. The tool reaches its limit when you get 64 players selected that differ from the tools’ projections, but that should probably take you into the fourth round on draft weekend.
by One.Cool.Customer on Mar 24, 2011 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions
while you cannot "permanently save" the mocks
Once you set it up as long as you do not hit “New Simulation” the settings will remain the same.
"And one should bear in mind that there is nothing more difficult to execute, nor more dubious of success, nor more dangerous to administer than to introduce a new order to things; for he who introduces it has all those who profit from the old order as his enemies; and he has only lukewarm allies in all those who might profit from the new. This lukewarmness partly stems from fear of their adversaries, who have the law on their side, and partly from the skepticism of men, who do not truly believe in new things unless they have personal experience in them."
Niccolo Machiavelli
by I am Ironman!!! on Mar 24, 2011 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks
At the very least, I’ll play with it this weekend and then after your series is over on various philosophies I may create a mock and update it live during the draft and post my updated prediction.
You have
IMO interpreted “players that fit the system” as “players at positions of need” in scenario 1. I would say players that fit the system for example would be for the Cowboys Von Miller, because he projects well as a 3-4 OLB, and his pass-rushing prowess would not be wasted at 3-4 DE where it is harder to pressure the passer.
IMO, an over-achiever is a player that is good, but has below average measurables.
And personally, I don’t think B Polian is a great drafter, sure he drafts at the bottom of every round, but his team right is basically Manning and a couple DE’s. I don’t think Belichick is a great drafter either, of all his picks, how, many have worked out? Am I completely against the trade down/get value strategy? No, but I think if there is a guy we REALLY like, and the price of a trade up isn’t unreasonable, we should do it EVERY time, regardless of whether we’re in the 1st round or 5th. I’m sick of hearing stories about some O-line prospect Dallas was eyeing up in the early rounds, only to watch him go a few picks earlier. If you’re not certain he’ll fall to you, TRADE UP! (within reason). Rant over lol.
Interesting series of articles OCC, rec’d.
I would love this
Cowboy’s Von Miller
"And one should bear in mind that there is nothing more difficult to execute, nor more dubious of success, nor more dangerous to administer than to introduce a new order to things; for he who introduces it has all those who profit from the old order as his enemies; and he has only lukewarm allies in all those who might profit from the new. This lukewarmness partly stems from fear of their adversaries, who have the law on their side, and partly from the skepticism of men, who do not truly believe in new things unless they have personal experience in them."
Niccolo Machiavelli
by I am Ironman!!! on Mar 24, 2011 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions
cowboys have to trade down
The more I look at the cowboys needs the more holes I realize they have and will continue to have because they are getting old in so many key spots. If Jerry really looks at his roster he will figure out that accumulating more second and third picks will benefit the cowboys so much more. This league is built on youth and speed and the cowboys really need that especially on the o-line. Cowboys should jump on Derek Sherrod in the 1st rd and Danny Watkins if he’s available with one of the 2nd rd picks.
Great Draft Cool
Though I can only hope those players are there at those picks, the fact remains that there will be good players at those spots that will fit the Cowboys. The one thing that makes me encouraged by this years draft, is that with all the mocks and drafting at different spots good players were available. If Jerry can get one trade down to mid-first round he will have a hard time not getting four good players this year. Nice work on this article. Well done Sir.

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