Time For Some Salary Cap Wizardry, Stephen Jones.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 9:01 AM CDT
in Dallas Cowboys General
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As we found out yesterday, the league and players appear to have decided to reinstate the previous free agency rules, whereby players with 4, 5 and 6 years of service will be free agents, whenever the new CBA is put in place.
And while there is now a lot of hand-wringing and teeth-gnashing over these new rules, particularly as they pertain to Cowboys players like Doug Free, nobody can honestly claim to be surprised by the players and owners agreeing to reinstate the old rules. Least of all the front offices around the league, who are all likely to have had plans in place for any free agent scenario. So where do teams stand, especially the Cowboys?
At first glance, things don't look so bad for the Cowboys. In fact, they look pretty good: back in February, Mike Sando from ESPN's NFC West blog put together an overview of how the 508 potential unrestricted free agents are split by NFL teams. The good news is that with ten unrestricted free agents on their roster, the Cowboys have the third lowest total of all teams in the NFL.
According to the NFLPA, the 508 unrestricted free agents are made up of players with a minimum of three accrued seasons heading into the 2010 season and whose contracts expire or can void this offseason.
The ten affected Cowboys players are LT Doug Free, DE's Stephen Bowen, Marcus Spears and Jason Hatcher, WR Sam Hurd, OG Kyle Kosier, SS Gerald Sensabaugh, OT Alex Barron, FS/CB Alan Ball and LB Leon Williams.
Going by Sando's list, only the Bills with nine and the Broncos with seven have fewer free agents on their current locked-out roster. The average across the NFL are 16 free agents, and our divisional opponents are right around that average: the Redskins have 15, The Giants and Eagles both have 17 free agents.
Obviously, I don't know many of these players each team wants to re-sign and how many of them are scrubs, but it's got to be a good thing for the Cowboys if they have less to do within their own team and can focus on acquiring the right free agents.
But now for the bad news. If - and that's a big if - If the salary cap rules remain the way they are, the Cowboys may have a lot less flexibility with their cap space than many here and elsewhere have speculated. How often have you heard somebody say something like, "Get rid of Barber, Newman and Williams, and that should give you enough money to sign so-and-so?" Well, that person may not have been familiar with the intricacies of the salary cap and how it affects the Cowboys. So here's a small primer on two important concepts, Proration and Acceleration, with a shout out to Raul Villaronga who initially put this together:
Proration: This term defines how signing bonuses are counted against the salary cap. To put it simply, the signing bonus is divided by number of contract years, and the result is applied to a player's base salary. The base salary plus the prorated portion of the signing bonus give you the cap salary for a given player. With some exceptions, the maximum number of years you can use for proration is six years.
Acceleration: This term describes what happens to the prorated portion of the signing bonus if a player is removed from the team's roster. This could mean a release, a trade, or if a player is lost via the waiver wire. Essentially, all future portions of the signing bonus are lumped together in the current year's cap number.
The exception to this rule used to be when a player was released after the June 1. Releasing a player after June 1 allows the team to count the current year's prorated bonus amount to this year's cap and the remaining prorated portions against next year's cap.
So if a contract from this past summer had a prorated $1 million signing bonus with 3 years left, releasing the player prior to June 1st would mean the cap number for the bonus against this year would have been $3 million, but releasing the player after June 1st would have $1 million against this year's cap and $2 million against next year's cap.
So what we'll do now is look at the usual suspects as Cowboys release candidates and figure out the salary cap ramifications of releasing them.
We'll use a straight-up approach where we simply look at the signing bonus and prorate it over the length of the contract. This will not be an entirely accurate picture of the Cowboys salary cap situation, as there are special rules governing likely-to-be-earned incentives, but it will should be close enough give us a good idea of the general situation that Stephen Jones is facing right now.
| in M$ | 2011 base salary | Yearly prorated signing bonus | 2011 Cap Salary | Years remaining on contract | Cap hit if released | Additional Cap space if released |
| Terence Newman | 8.0 | 2.0 | 10.0 | 3 | 6.0 | 4.0 |
| Igor Olshansky | 3.3 | 1.5 | 4.8 | 2 | 3.0 | 1.8 |
| Leonard Davis | 6.0 | 2.3 | 8.3 | 3 | 6.9 | 1.4 |
| Marion Barber | 4.3 | 2.0 | 6.3 | 3 | 6.0 | 0.3 |
| Marc Colombo | 2.4 | 2.3 | 4.7 | 2 | 4.6 | 0.1 |
| Total | 24.0 | 10.1 | 34.1 | - - |
26.5 | 7.6 |
[Note: The contract data is taken from rotoworld.com and other published reports. If you think it's wrong, let me know and I'll make corrections if required.]
The five players in the table above will cost Jerry Jones $24M in real money in the 2011 season. In salary cap money, the players will cost $34.1M because of the prorated signing bonuses. Releasing them would cost $26.5M in accelerated signing bonuses against the 2011 cap. In total, the Cowboys would clear cap space of 'only' $7.6M by releasing these five players.
The Cowboys could also look at Bradie James and Keith Brooking for potential cap relief. Both are in the last year of their contracts and releasing them now would save a total of $5.7M in cap space (James: $3.5M, Brooking: $2.2M), but both are likely to play out their contracts.
Where's Roy Williams you ask? I covered Williams extensively a couple of weeks back, and under the old CBA salary cap rules that we're using for this calculation, it will actually cost the Cowboys $3.7M against the cap if they release Williams this year.
Overall, that salary cap space is much smaller than one would have believed, given the relatively high salaries involved. But the old CBA also had the June 1st provision to help out the capologists. If the same rule applies this year, the Cowboys could release all five players and the $26.5M cap hit could be spread out over two years, with $10.5M due in 2011 and $16.5M due in 2012.
By using the June 1st rule or an equivalent rule in the new CBA, the Cowboys could free up a total of $18.1M in cap space this year, with the downside of having another $16.5M of dead money counting against the 2012 cap.
But we can be sure that Stephen Jones already has a plan for that 2012 downside, and it will probably mean the end of Roy Williams and Andre Gurode in a Cowboys uniform. Releasing Williams after this season saves $2.3M in cap money, releasing Gurode in 2012 would free up $6.5 M in cap space for the 2012 season.
Surely there's a way within all these figures for Stephen Jones to find a way to re-sign the players he wants, sign all the rookies and sign some choice free agents. But it's not going to be that easy. And of course, everything could change with a new CBA and new salary cap rules.
Time for some salary cap wizardry, Stephen.
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Nice write up
thanks for putting in down on “paper”…….gonna be another tight $$ offseason.
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
by BigBad Joe on Jun 22, 2011 9:09 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Question
Where are the Cowboys vis a vis the cap right now? Assuming they don’t release anybody, and that the cap is at about 120 million, as has been reported, how much wiggle room do the Cowboys have?
Right now, they're at around $136.6 million
This is per ESPN.com’s Pat Yasinskas who pulled together a list with how much each team had committed for the 2011 season per early February this year.
The $136.6 million are only for players currently under contract for the 2011 season. They do not include the eight draft picks, they do not include any potential free agent signings, but they also do not include any contracts that the Cowboys might decide to terminate.
Here’s a breakdown of the committed salaries for each NFC East:
Dallas Cowboys: $136.6 million
New York Giants: $126.3 million
Washington Redskins: $115.2 million
Philadelphia Eagles: $80.8 million
And the cap this year is rumored to be between $140-150 million.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I’ve quoted your numbers extensively over the last handful of hours. I would just like to thank you for allowing me to speak with confidence about such topics.
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions
But that larger # of $140-150mil includes the benefits portion of the cap, no?
There is a decent NationalFootballPost piece that helped me better understand the NFL salary cap.
The Salary Cap (Cap) – which defines NFL revenue allocated to players – is one of the most misunderstood mechanisms in sports. It is not well known that the NFL Cap consists of two parts: the "Team Salary" (TS) portion and the "Benefits" portion.
The owners’ offer of March 11
The NFL offered a 2011 Salary Cap of $141 million with fixed increases through 2015. Of that $141 million, the offer contained only $114 million in TS. With further negotiation, though, the owners were prepared to go to a division of $121 million in TS and $20 million to Benefits. With a few more million massaged into the TS number and taken from the Benefits number, we will probably have a deal at some point.
Now, I am not sure if the $136.6mil includes the benefits portion of the ‘Boys salary cap, but if we are at $136.6 TS and the new one is in the 120’s…obviously we are in trouble.
Great writeup by the way. It has me thinking about players being released this season that I did not expect to be unless we signed some big name FA replacment. That is no longer the case. We may have to let TNew, Bigg, and Igor go even with no current replacements and then give young guys or cheap FA solutions a shot. Things could get very interesting…or painful.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
And Our Pain
Will likely result in a big season for Philadelphia. With the salary floor as reported yesterday and only $80 Million against the cap, the Eagles could aford to sign Adrian Peterson away from the Vikings. That addition will equal a scary team for the rest of the division and the NFL.
I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
If he has 4 accrued years he is. And unless i missed something i do not think he's recieved a second contract yet.
Don't believe everything you think.
Your causes are cute!!!
I'm not scared
the Eagles don’t ever run the ball, so Peterson would be a very, very expensive 12-rushes a game player. Seriously, Peterson is a great RB, but he wouldn’t be that much of an upgrade over McCoy (perhaps Osi would disagree, though), particularly in the Eagles offense.
In Madden, that would be a scary addition. In real life, it’s not happening and it wouldn’t be a huge difference maker.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 22, 2011 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions
As much as I defend Andy Reid… I think with AP on his roster he would still throw the ball 60% of the time and, on first down, and on 2nd & 1 …. and, 3rd & 1
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Kudos to the Iggles
For keeping their wallet in the back pocket
Smiles ahead
by accidental innuendo on Jun 22, 2011 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Just to be clear — Free is not included in the Cowboys’ figure?
Smiles ahead
by accidental innuendo on Jun 22, 2011 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Probably not. I don’t know what numbers Yasinskas used, but I doubt he included Free’s first and third round tender from March in an article from February :-)
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
thanks OCC
I wonder if anything they did in 2010 will adversely affect the cap for this upcoming season, barring the new rules…
I don't think so, but I'm not 100% sure.
The closest I’ve found to a full 2010 salary cap list is this one by PFT. It shows that the Cowboys spent $166.5 million last year, second only to the Washington Redskins with $ 178.2 million.
We do know that both the recent Ware and especially the Austin deals were constructed specifically with an uncapped year in mind. For example, Ware & Austin combined for $24.9M base salary in 2010, but will only receive a combined base salary of $6.15M in 2012. That gives you a lot of wiggle room.
The Cowboys also ate about $14M in salary cap in 2010 when they released Flozell and Hamlin.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Do you know if Hamlin's and Hotel's dead money is cleared?
If so, it would mean the 2011 $136.6 mil cap could be reduced by $14m overnight, right? That would certainly provide a lot of breathing room.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
My understanding is the 14mil hit last year in its entirety, and the 136.6 figure would be unaffected. Here’s hoping to a cap closer to 150 than 140…
by TheCowboyWay on Jun 22, 2011 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions
The 136.6m figure is what our cap was in 2010, which included the 14m of dead money. If we no longer on the hook for any more, it would mean that figure drops once 2011 season starts, no?
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
I believe that is correct, assuming the 136.6 is correct, and assuming that I calculated Flozell’s and Hamlin’s accelerations correctly.
You should also factor in that Austin’s salary drops from 17 million in 2010 to 8.5 million in 2011 (no signing bonus for Austin), as does Roy Williams’ salary cap value, from around 17 million (including the 2010 roster bonus of 9.5 million) in 2010 to 9.1 million in 2011.
136.6 -14.0 dead money – 16.4 Austin/Williams salaries = A cool 106.2, which should leave enough room to re-sign Free and everybody else, plus a couple of good value free agents.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Queue sigh of relief...
Or at least spark of hope
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
+136m
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
Yes. $106 million does sound a lot better than $136 million
There’s probably a cool 5-10 million in year-on-year salary increases from ‘10 to ’11 not included in the 106 and it’s still some way off the Eagles’ number, but it’s not that bad at all.
And the Eagles number does not include Vicks 1-year, 16-million deal either.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions
That sound
I was holding my breath as I read along, hoping Jerry and Stephen hadn’t screwed up THAT bad
"We'll see." --Bill Parcells
i don't think Jerry or other owners would allow a CBA to set them back.
resigning Free, Kosier, Bowen & the Rookies should be at the top but i wouldn’t mind seeing a few FAs at other key positions. Free Safety for sure & possibly even Sensabaugh if the price/fit is better for RR systems, DL (Igor & Spears are just 1 trick ponies that dont provide much for the buck. Hatcher didn’t impress me much & finding someone opposite of Bowen is important, Possibly a Guard, Pass rushers never hurt ILB or OLB.
if that # is closer to 100mil like OOC said it’ll be a big spark of hope.
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth!
I do know that Miles Austin is Tony's go to guy,
But Miles could easily be released by the Cowboys, giving us $16.1 million of cap room. That could give us room to resign Terrell Owens at about $4 million or so. I am not saying that T.O. would be signed by us for a second go-around, but that is just an example.
I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
austin is going nowhere, for sure he is staying
before there was law, there were the Cowboys!!!
I dont think so
they way i read it he got pd alot in base salary in the uncapped year, and will count much less against the cap going forward…..so instead of doing an even bigger signing bonus, they pd him a big salary in the uncapped year, so it is not prorated over the lenght of the deal – smart moves by JJ and Stephen
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
+1 it was smart but they knew most of this in advance which is why they did it.
there was a reason FA wasnt that big last year & the ones that did get contracts recieved a huge chunck in an uncapper year.
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth!
Wait, my hands are partially wrung — shall I continue wringing or unwring?
Smiles ahead
by accidental innuendo on Jun 22, 2011 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions
So we just hold our arms straight up in the air?
If at first you don't succeed - blame someone else.
I think that was always the case
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Yes they can always restructure existing contracts
to create cap room. Downside though is that you further mortgage the future.
The rookie wage scale should have some impact on the salary cap.
What it would be is impossible to say until a new CBA is finalized.
+1
If we really wanted somebody we can make it work. I don’t think Jerry thinks we need new CBs though
by somebodyquiet on Jun 22, 2011 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions
i think Philly will go after Nnmadi
but thats a lot of $ to pay for taking 1 WR out of the game & even though they have Samuel as the other CB that leaves a lot of plays to be made for teams that are deep at the skill position on offense. Dallas has a lot of players like Witten, Felix, Murray, Bennett, Philips, RW or which reciever steps up in the slot should have a chance to make some plays with a better OL this season.
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth!
I think we could probably get Nnamdi with some creative accounting
but that would likely be our one shot, and it could kill our salary cap for years if it doesn’t pan out (see the Roy Williams trade).
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe if...
The 5 guys you mentioned above would have to take some serious pay cuts. that’s not happening.
Please no
remember the days of Salary cap hell in the early ’00? Thats what we would look forward too…
by TheCowboyWay on Jun 22, 2011 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Also this was from espn regarding marion barber
The Cowboys have to make a decision on Barber in early June, when he’s owed a $500,000 roster bonus. Cutting him before that that saves the team $2.75 million against the salary cap, but keeping him means he will earn $4.75 million in 2011.
This would, in effect save some cap room behind what is currently in the table, correct?
The roster bonus is not included in Barber’s base salary in the table above.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions
I havent looked at his contract
but the way that reads is that we save 2.75mil in total against the cap as opposed to .3 as above… possibly he has no more proration on his signing bonus? And the hit is 4.75 if he stays?
Considering the source, I am probably grasping at straws here…
by TheCowboyWay on Jun 22, 2011 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, but I cannot tell you how they arrived at their numbers. His base salary is 4.25. Add the roster bonus and you’re at 4.75. He has a yearly prorated signing bonus of 2 million. I don’t know how the Cowboys account for the roster bonuses that Barber is due almost every year, so that may or may not lead to the 2.75.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions
OCC
I think the deadline would be extended for about a week or two if the present deal were to be ratified. This lockout goes both ways meaning that Stephen couldn’t make a decision on Marion Barber even if he wanted to do so.
I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
This is fairly obvious now
But we will not be making a splash in free agency. I think one player — probably a safety — is the best we can hope for. I am a little bummed about this because our core players are on the downside, and after last year, we cannot afford any more wasted seasons.
Otoh, we will definitely get to see a lot more of the young’uns, and we might find a gem or two. And of course, this situation forces Jerry to reflect on the errors of the past few years.
Interesting times ahead…
Smiles ahead
by accidental innuendo on Jun 22, 2011 10:32 AM CDT reply actions
uh yeah we have a big hole at guard as well not to mention Mr.Free who will certainly not be cheap. and two at De not just one. If Newman is cut that would be another hole.
Don't believe everything you think.
Your causes are cute!!!
Like last year?
We need serious upgrades in a lot of places to be “good”
And the year before that we won a playoff game with the same guys
So last year defines our team, and not the year before? Sorry, I don’t buy it. A lot has changed, and his name is Jason Garrett.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
The cap situation isn't that bad
We go down from the $130 originally thought, and one or two veterans gone will still save some money.
It’s still very possible for the Cowboys to get two or three FA’s they like.
And still possible, though not likely, that the ’boys decide to go Asomugha and one or two small-name FAs.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions
The Redskin way?
Couldn’t the Cowboys use the Redskin’s technique of pushing things out into the future everytime we think they are going to be in salary cap hell? If they wanted to keep Newman, couldn’t they renegotiate his contract and give him a signing bonus now with guaranteed money and lower future base salaries which would reduce his yearly cap cost. It would mean Jerry would have to pay more now and convert some future money in guaranteed money but it’d be more cap-friendly.
by qmpham on Jun 22, 2011 10:33 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
Great article.
If this team was performing, no one here would really be sweating our salary cap situation too much. Instead, we are now stuck in a situation where we have a team that is not performing to standards and a salary cap number that is significantly bloated by salaries that are being paid to underachievers. For all of the personal attacks leveled against Jerry, it certainly can’t be said that he isn’t loyal. If you perform, he will pay you handsomely. And in many cases, he will overpay you. I hope Jerry has learned some important lessons going forward. As much as I would love to see Cullen Jenkins in a Cowboys uniform, I think this is the offseason (coming off a 6-10 year) to start cutting back and I hope that Jerry feels similarly.
Look me in the eye. It's okay if you're scared. So am I. But we are scared for different reasons. I'm scared of what I won't become. And you're scared of what I could become. Look at me. I won't let myself end where I started. I won't let myself finish where I began. I know what is within me, even if you can't see it yet. Look me in the eyes. I have something more important than courage. I have patience. I will become what I know I am.
+1 absolutely agree on Jerry
I cant understand why he must resign star players for biggest contracts ? its not about I have money, I can pay him a lot… because with this attitude jerry is going against his own team…. I would try to save every single dollar for cap, you dont need to make Roy the best paid WR, you dont need to make Austin best paid WR ….in my eyes are this contracts such a stupidity
before there was law, there were the Cowboys!!!
There's 2 sides to this:
1) He signed and kept performers in the fold – WIt, Romo, Austin, DWare
2) He made some large, now viewed as unnecessary, commitments to players that didn’t deserve it – MBIII, RW and formerly TO. And we are/have been somewhat hamstrung by the effects
I am ambivalent about the TNew deal – clearly he’s overpaid, but when healthy he’s been an asset
I drink to make other people more interesting
I agree completely.
Jerry’s tendencies can be both a blessing and a curse.
Look me in the eye. It's okay if you're scared. So am I. But we are scared for different reasons. I'm scared of what I won't become. And you're scared of what I could become. Look at me. I won't let myself end where I started. I won't let myself finish where I began. I know what is within me, even if you can't see it yet. Look me in the eyes. I have something more important than courage. I have patience. I will become what I know I am.
I dont think its fair to put TO in the same category as barber and williams. maybe put leonard davis in that gang though.
by DavidLaFleur on Jun 22, 2011 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions
The point on TO
is it wasn’t necessary at the time. And it didn’t keep him from ultimately being TO.
I loved his performance and worried about how we would replace his production when we cut ties, but in the end, it worked. But that was a lot of dead money to carry for a season. We really haven’t signed a ‘Splash’ FA since(RW came through trade)and yet we’ve only managed to clear Flo and Hamlin’s deals. Cause and Effect?
I drink to make other people more interesting
OOC, you may well be one of BTB's biggest assets.
I don’t think any of the other SB Nation blogs have a statistician quite like you.
That said, this situation is actually much better than I thought it was before reading the article. Looks like resigning Free won’t be an incredibly daunting task—but it does limit how much we can spend additionally in free agency.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 12:12 PM CDT reply actions
Agreed, the situation is much better than it initially looks.
My focus in the article was to show that the salary cap answer does not lie in releasing veteran players. And it doesn’t. Perhaps I should have spent a little more time breaking down the Cowboys cap situation in the article instead of the comments, but what’s done is done.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Still believe the issue is fairly serious
There’s a saying in business, about companies emerging from financial re-org and I’ve seen it demonstrated more than a few times – ‘You can’t save your way to prosperity.’ Well, the Cowboy equivalent is, ‘You can’t cut your way to the FA sweepstakes.’ Remember, FA is the equivalent of an auction, and winners typically must overpay to win. Not a good scenario in a salary-cap world.
The issue is Need – by grouping
Must – FS
Might – LT, LG, SS, DL(more than 1)
Are we satisfied the answer for any of these is already on the Roster? When was the last time we replaced 4 starters in an off-season? 5? 6? After the Draft? This doesn’t even consider the likely departure of Hurd or other role players. Even if we are fortunate, creative enough to keep Free, how much of this already limited resource, available cap space will that require? Again, 2nd contracts will now be the big payday with a Rookie wage scale.
And what are the implications beyond just those aspects ?
- we will keep big money on the roster – RW, Bigg, TNew because we can’t afford to release them
- we are keeping age on the roster – TNew, Bigg, Brookings because we don’t have viable alternatives
- we will keep and start , Igor because we’re running out of bodies
- likely Montrae Holland will be a starter who hasn’t been healthy or able enough to play his way into the rotation for any length of time.
Add to that the further implication is this is going to impact this and next season since we need to spread these salary dumps out
I drink to make other people more interesting
True
We can’t fix all the holes on this roster in 1 season. it’s an ongoing process
by somebodyquiet on Jun 22, 2011 6:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Wait... why is Holland starting?
I highly doubt Kosier walks.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 8:57 PM CDT up reply actions
The Philadelphia Eagles
If the Eagles have 17 Free Agents – Doesn’t that mean they have a lot of work and spending to do in house that will bump up their salary cap figure?
Perhaps. But I looked at their free agents, and apart from Vick (who has signed a tender anyway) and some linebackers, none of their free agents struck me a critical signings – but them I’m obviously not as familiar with their roster.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Vick is a must
Bradly will most likely receive an offer however, Philly will not get into a biding war.
I think Philly also has a pair of DTs that they would like to bring back.
Everyone else is expendable to the point that if they left the most fans wouldn’t know the difference or be glad to see them go.
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks for the info
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
Eagles again -
Not this season – but next season DeSean Jackson will be up for a new deal…and two things not boding well for the Eagles…
Maclin makes five times what Jackson makes now…
And Rosenhaus is Jackson’s agent.
The little guy will demand a huge contract….
The Eagles have to keep that in mind because the fan base will not accept Jackson leaving Philadelphia…
Oh wouldn't that be awesome
Its a win win for Cowboy fans. Either Jackson leaves for big money elsewhere or he stays and Eagles overpay. On top of all that his one trick pony is fast expiring. I say in 2013 he won’t even be mentioned anymore.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
Well, we have Mike Jenkins and Anthony Spencer coming up on contract years
So let’s not throw stones from our glass house.
The Ohio State Buckeyes are your Sugar Bowl champions... and for the 7th year in a row Michigan still sucks.
by Blue Eyed Devil on Jun 23, 2011 6:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Mike Jenkins is a must
but spencer if we still have RR can walk
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
DeSean Jackson Dilemma
Seriously,
Maclin makes about five to one more than Jackson…and there have been scuffles on the practice field between the two.
Maclin doesn’t back down either.
Maclin will have a better career overall….He knows it, the coaches know it, the Eagles Brass knows it, but DeSean Jackson doesn’t know it.
It’s a real firestorm brewing in Philadelphia.
Unfortunately, it won't be a problem-because they will just let him walk. This is why the Eagles are in great shape, they don't overpay.
They have a philosophy and stick with it, even when it’s a popular player. They will not overpay! They’re constantly getting young talent and letting them play.
I’ve gone on about this for years, but I don’t know why other teams don’t see what the Eagles and Pats do. You have to be ruthless and let talent go sometimes, then maybe just sign the one or two FA’s that will really make a diference. Get good coaching and throw the young guys in there.
And that’s why the Eagles are competitive every year, while our team goes up and down and up and down.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Realist Larry - Correct
And that’s why they won’t chase Asomugha.
The Eagles and Asomugha is such a smoke screen.
He is 30….they cut 90% of the players who reach that age. It’s the philosophy. Younger is always better.
Especially skill positions.
You guys are right, but at the same time...
How many championships have the Eagles won?
Old players aren’t necessarily worse. You do need those locker room leaders, and the Eagles (as well as Patriots and Steelers) have some older players on the roster.
That, and we shouldn’t forget that the Pats have made some free-agency splashes and taken some risks there.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Thought that as well
It’s certainly made them good, but not quite good enough
I drink to make other people more interesting
How many have we won? And who has gotten a lot closer over the last 10 years, more often?
We’ve won none.
They’ve had realistic shots over and over. 4 NFC Ch. Games?
The Cowboys have one playoff win!
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions
5 NFC Championship Games
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions
and Nuclear Warfare
With the 9th Pick Dallas Selects Tyron Smith...Romo Weeps in Joy, and Bennet says"I might get to go out in the Pass Pattern now!"
by I am Ironman!!! on Jun 22, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions
And to Eagle Fans
They count their playoff wins like they are Superbowls. Haha
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
Ha Ha
They’ve been a lot closer than the Cowboys.
You wouldn’t have enjoyed some serious playoff runs the last 10 years!!
Right. The only people who say things like that are defensive about their team’s failures and don’t want to face the truth.
Their fans have had hope year after year, even with a loser like McNabb at QB. Even with Reid’s unbearable offense.
The Cowboys’ fans have nothing except finally one playoff win. And constant talking every offseason about how their team is so much more talented than the Eagles and everyone else.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
How many have we won? 5.
I know you knew that, but I couldn’t resist.
The Cowboys have won 3 in the Jones era, FYI. The Eagles all time? Zero. I’ll take a team that wins the Superbowl and then falls off for a couple of years than a non-championship team that hovers around above-average.
And if you’re going to blame one playoff win on free-agency spending, I have one word for you: no.
The Cowboys problem has been organizational structure and coaching, not too many good veterans on the roster.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 9:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Steelers too
I was preaching that in another thread. The Steelers and Pats would cut Roy Williams. Well they never would of made that mistake but now is the time to do it. Or next year at the latest I suppose depending on cap and Free’s contract
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
I have full faith in the Jones family....
getting done what this team needs:
re-sign Free, Kosier, and Sensy
sign a FS
by death of the cool on Jun 22, 2011 12:37 PM CDT reply actions
+1
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
My Fearless Eagles FA Prediction -
They will not go after Asomugha. They have a strict 30+ rule and will not enter the $$$ bidding stratosphere he will command. Besides – Samuel is their big ticket corner.
Eagles believe in building from the inside out.
They will address their DL and RT. They need a compliment to Trent Cole and someone to replace Winston Justice as a starter. That’s priority # 1.
They will also kick the tires for Haynesworth if the Skins release the lump.
LB is next. Ernie Sims is a terrific pile jumper…they need to correct that mistake. Overall, Eagles have a mediocre LB crew.
Safety/CB is next. But not Asomugha. They will go second tier at CB and desperately need an experienced safety…especially if they plan to say goodbye to Mikell which everyone believes they are.
The Eagles will sign a slew of FA’s…and may still deal Kolb as well….it will be interesting to see what the defending NFC champs come up with…
Go Cowboys!
The Eagles have a lot of cap space, and have an open championship window
If they believe they’re one or two superstars away from a championship, they will DEFINITELY go after a guy like Asomugha.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Inside sources
Inside sources have told a local reporter who breaks all the big stories in Philly for the last twenty years that they are not going after him.
Remember – Inside Out – CB is “out”
30+ – scares the Eagles more than most.
Asante Samuel – Huge contract already in place.
Safety – 2010 7th rounder Kurt Coleman // Rookie Jaiquawn Jarrett // Injured Nate Allen // UFA Quinton Mikell
Needs immediate FA help at safety.
Could the Eagles land Asomugha – Yes.
Will they – I doubt it.
Honestly
When it comes to draft and free agency, inside sources don’t mean a thing. We’ve seen this dozens of times over the past few years. Some of it is misinformation, some of it is a guy thinking he’s higher up than he actually is, and some of it is organizations putting out lies on purpose.
There’s no way to know… we can only speculate.
by Admiral Dallas on Jun 22, 2011 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually, the positions they value most are QB, OL, DL, & CB.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 23, 2011 9:30 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
And RCB is a bigger need than S. I don’t necessarily know what that means in terms of who they sign, but RCB is the #1 priority.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 23, 2011 9:32 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Asomugha will not be signed by Philadelphia
Washington will get to him first and by restructuring the Cap after releasing Haynesworth. The problem is that Washington might get to enjoy more 2-14, 3-13, and 4-12 type seasons in the future.
I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
Plaxico Burress to the Eagles?
The Eagles do need a big target in the Red Zone.
Avant is a decent three with terrific hands, but not exactly a Red Zone Threat.
Apparently Vick and Burress are pals (not a jail pun…geographic link from Virginia)
I can not get a good Reid (pun intended) on this one.
Riley Cooper is a developing big target, and Reid loves to develop his own guys…so I doubt they chase Burress…but if Burress chases them? To play the G-Men twice a year, to partner with Vick, and to come at a discount, then maybe there is a match.
It’s a toss up…but TNew & Co. may be back to dealing with Plaxico in the Red Zone in 2011.
We’ll see.
To be the best in the division -
The Cowboys have to beat the best! – Ric Flair
And that doesn’t mean a scrub filled garbage game that costs three draft slots at the end of the season with nothing on the line either.
Cowboys should have posters of the Eagles with big targets painted on them at the practice facility…time to get after it.
- Go Cowboys.
I'm hoping for SOME kind of one-time 'amnesty' clause in the new CBA
That could let teams drop some players (or at least ONE player, a la the Allan Houston rule from the NBA a few years back) and get amnesty from the prorated signing bonus element of their cap impact. I would think the players would actually be for this – they have already deposited their signing bonus $, and with a hard cap floor in place teams that cleared cap space in this fashion would have to re-invest real dollars into new contracts. The ‘rich’ owners like Jerry and (God knows) Snyder would almost certainly support it – you’d be getting pushback from the Bengals and Bills of the world but it might be possible. ANYTHING that would let us get out from under Roy’s absurd deal would be a massive help. Of course, a rule like this would help a lot of other teams as well giving them more $ to chase free agents, but Roy’s $-to-production ratio has to make his one of the five worst contracts in the league.
I think Barber and Colombo are certain bets to go. Davis is in decline but had some good aspects to his game (profootballfocus.com rated him much more highly than I would have guessed) so you might ride him out one more year. It could be tough to get rid of Olshansky with most of the D-line as free agents – I don’t know what caused his fall-off in play in 2010 but unless he’s got a chronic injury/attitude problem I bet we give him a shot to turn it around. I think Newman should almost certainly go as I don’t see much upward arc left on his career trajectory at his age. That puts you on the hook to replace him for 2011 to have any realistic hope of competing, though – with our overall cap situation Nmandi is likely a pipe dream at this stage but stealing a Jonathan Joseph away from Cincy could be a possible backup plan.
The Cowboys have zero choice but to do SOMETHING at safety (Huff, Weddle, possibly steal Mikell – who profootballfocus is in absolute love with – from the Eagles) and almost no choice but to re-sign Free (only other credible option I could see would be somehow acquiring Gaither from Baltimore). They’ll also most likely have to sign at least one of our free-agent DL (preferably Bowen) and can hopefully get Kosier back on the cheap for a couple more seasons.
From a big-picture standpoint, the Cowboys’ window of championship contention extends for as long as their true difference makers (Romo, Witten, Ware, maybe Ratliff) can play at a high level – that means from 2011-2013 or MAYBE 2014. Stephen’s cap-massaging magic should be aimed at keeping us alive through that stretch and preparing for lost year where all our salary-cap turkeys come home to roost in 2014 or 2015. We should still be able to sign our guys and fill some free agency holes now and over the next couple of seasons if we gear things to explode around that time. Hopefully after that explosion, we’ll be entering the era where Steven and (please God) another GM-type voice are holding even stronger sway and we can move to a more Steelers/Eagles-like model of contract responsibility (and consistently great drafting to make it possible).
Agree Jay - except for one point
The Eagles draft poorly…that’s the only thing holding them back.
They are the “smartest in the room” types who have to do things differently to prove how much smarter they are than the rest of us.
Remember they passed on DeSean Jackson for Trevor Laws…
Recent first round mediocrity -
Broderick Bunkley
Mike Patterson
Brandon Graham
and now a 27 year old fireman from Canada….great! 2014 he’ll be 31. (Tyron Smith will be 24)
I may have been more accurately speaking of the early-mid 2000's Eagles...
…but I’d still say they’re in the upper part of the league. They have a real commitment to always re-stocking the big boys on both lines and it’s kept them very competitive. As much as I’d like to I wouldn’t cast too many aspersions on the DL guys that you listed. Graham showed some real pass-rush ferocity as a rookie, and Patterson is a pretty stout run-stuffer who profootballfocus had rated as their 18th-best DT in 2010 and one of the best against the run (I realize profootballfocus isn’t necessarily the Bible, but they chart every play for every player and I feel good about them being pretty directionally correct). Bunkley has been slower to develop but is probably a middle of the pack guy – not a stud but not a bust by any means at this point.
With all that said, the Patriots would probably have been an even better example of a team that’s constantly able to re-load most positions through the draft and is thereby able to avoid getting locked in to the bad, big-$ contract.
It seems that teams like the Steelers and Patriots have had a lot of success in grabbing ‘B+’ type guys in the second-middle rounds that they can plug in because of a few built-in difference makers. For the Steelers D, it’s been Casey Hampton as a no-choice double team at NT and a blitzing scheme that’s one step ahead of OC’s that let them keep dropping in replacment parts at DE and LB without a hiccup. For the New England D for years it was a HOF-caliber DR in Seymour that just wrecked an offense’s plans and let some solid-ish players next to and behind him look like world-beaters. For the New Englad O it’s Brady’s decision-making and a scheme that gets B to C grade receivers open on quick cuts more often than any I’ve ever seen. If you’ve got your difference maker, it seems like you’re free to cherry pick and grab solid ‘high floor’ type guys. When you’re swinging for the fences to find that difference maker, it seems like you’re more likely to strike out altogether.
I would disagree with one thing you said, and that's the idea of having a "window"
In this age of parity, as long as you have a good QB, your window is always open.
I don’t like parity, but that is the point, and look at how teams have proven this over and over:
Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Eagles (ugh), even the Giants, Colts……..These teams are competitive every year. They have a philosophy (not all the same one, by the way,) and a good QB. They stick with their philosophy and are all well-run from the top down. It starts at the management level!
If you have that, the window is always open……the one exception being, you do need a competitive QB. Not necessarily Pro Bowl, just good.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions
But it doesn't matter what window we are looking at here.
Maybe they hired the same scouting team that Bill Parcells fired when he joined the Jets. Or maybe the draft is just a crapshoot that it is impossible to predict which players are going to be the stars and who will be the crap that gets cut after training camp. Just because the Eagles draft poorly in the first round doesn’t mean that they draft poorly overall. Romo just did recent first round picks.
I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
Wait, I'm really confused
those numbers – Cowboys 136 mil and Giants 126 mil….that’s committed salaries for the upcoming year? I’m not so sure, because I went back and added up all the salaries for the upcoming year for the Giants (at bloggingthebeast.com), and I came away with a number closer to $90 mil.
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 1:24 PM CDT reply actions
ESPN did a piece on the $ committed to next season. I am incline to trust them just a tad more than a blog websight.
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
probably
wanted to confirm that this was indeed the committed salaries for next year, and not the payroll for this past year.
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
It's the benefit portion of the salary cap
Read above, the cap is made up of true salary and benefit 9the crazy incentives in contracts that must be covered). Every year the benefits portion of the cap is between 20 and 30 mil. That could be your difference right there.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Yeah just read that.
wanted to confirm. Appreciate the help!
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions
that's awesome if this number involves the benefits portion
If we have ~$120,000,000 in TS…I calculated the Giants have about $89,750,000 in TS. That frees up a solid 30 mil.
I’m sure if someone took the time to add up the salaries for the Cowboys, y’all would have maybe around 100 mil in TS and an extra 20 to play around with, right?
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
JimmyK’s list on bloggingthebeast is composed entirely of base salaries, and does not contain any prorated signing bonuses, at least from the quick look I had at the Cowboys data.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 22, 2011 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions
ah so that's what it is.
damnit!
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions
not really
it frees up a roster spot for someone who will actually do something other than celebrate
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
And not only that
but we must be willing to cut bait with underachievers if we really wish to be taken seriously as an organization that is built on accountability and finding the “right kind of guys.”
Look me in the eye. It's okay if you're scared. So am I. But we are scared for different reasons. I'm scared of what I won't become. And you're scared of what I could become. Look at me. I won't let myself end where I started. I won't let myself finish where I began. I know what is within me, even if you can't see it yet. Look me in the eyes. I have something more important than courage. I have patience. I will become what I know I am.
exactly
But that was beat to death in the cut roy williams thread and still people want to keep him
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
Want maybe too strong a word
There are a few of us that see the need to keep him so we dont hamper FA pick ups this year….next year it will not cost us more to cut than to keep, he is a deader than for sure
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
Well.....my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle
"Pleased to meet you, hope you guess my name"
+1
right Kind of Guy is not just someone that lives up to his contract. Roy may not be the best kind of RKG, but certainly isn’t the WKG (To had great production vs. salary, but don’t think anyone would call him the RKG).
It simply doens’t make sense to increase or cap by releasing Roy and not having anyone to replace him.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
ok ok
I am sorry I don’t want the discussion to flow over here haha.
I think Roy is the WKG you don’t it happens haha.
And Joe I see more benefits of cutting him this year then waiting another year. If you are trying to set a new culture in place, you do it with a swooping motion. I hope there is an Irvin on this team that can give JG a list of “paycheck” guys. Or hopefully JG knows of these guys since hes been here for 4 years anyway.
Like I said I expect to see a nice list of people cut when the deal is signed if not that just points to more of the same for the Dallas Cowboys.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
Avoiding WKG/RKG discussion
I repeat…it simply doesn’t make sense to increase or cap by releasing Roy AND not having a capable replacement.
Any culture message is about working hard every day to get better, not trying to prove a point by hampering the team financially and reducing the chance to sign some RKG FAs.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
I can resist
You do not know there isn’t a capable replacement. Like last time I used the example of the Steelers parting ways with Holmes. They had Ward and Wallace who only shown potential. Miles and Dez and better than both of those guys plus Witten over Heath. The Steelers have a standard, a certain culture and Holmes wasn’t it. The moved on and didn’t think twice. It sends a greater message to everyone else then the 2mil more you lose in cap this one year.
Plus is it really that different of paying him 6mil this year and taking a hit of 3mil next year? Vs just taking a 9mil hit this year?
Benefits I see from cutting Roy this year
Frees up money next year for contracts like Spencer
Frees up roster spot for a ‘RKG’ to come in
Allows the team to get younger a WR
Allows the team to churn the bottom of the roster
Sends a message they are serious with “The Cowboy Way”
Forces Miles Austin to take a leadership Role among the WR or Dez if neither has already.
The benefits can take a Butterfly Effect from there too, like if we find out Holley/Hurd/Tree whoever can’t hack it and we cut them which in return allows us to sign another WR or player who turns out to be a superstar…..
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
I think you are mixing real money and cap sapce
Per OCC
But those $13.2 million are not the salary cap cost of releasing Williams. Keeping Williams will count $9.5 million against the cap in 2011 anyway. Consider that a “sunk cost”, basically a cost that has already been incurred and cannot be recovered. Releasing him will count $13.2 million against the 2011 cap. The “penalty” of releasing Williams is $3.7 million that would be unavailable to invest in other players.
If I am not mistaken, there is no cap benefits of releasing him this year – JJ jsut saes real money. I just don’t understand when we are already worried about having cap space to sign Free, Bowen, veteran Safety, and another DE and/or OG that we can afford to take a 3.7mil hit to our cap space in 2011. Even if we manage to split it between this year and next due to the July rule, that is still almost 2mil in each year of wasted cap space.
As for your reasons…
WR are already young
We can churn the bottom of the roster without cutting Roy
It sends a message that we are willing to shoot ourselves in the foot because JJ was an idiot – it’s not like we are releasing Roy for being a bad guy, not practicing hard, or doing nothing on the field.
Miles’ leadership role has nothing to do with Roy
In my mind, it simly doesn’t make sense. And again, we know that the opportunities Ogletree has had he hasn’t done much with. Who do you expect to step up as the #3? We don’t even have legitimate depth to do what the Steelers did who had invested some mid round picks in WR.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
The steelers had as much depth as we do
Again you can’t say someone can’t do it if they aren’t given the chance. Yes Tree has been in on a few plays but come on thats not the same. I don’t care who steps in. I don’t care if it takes 3 guys in the starting lineup and week 7 to figure it out.
Either way we are going round and round.. Hopefully we can talk JETS soon
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
thats taking a short term view of his contract
long term, cutting him now means we pay more in 2011, but it also means hes not on the team in 2012, meaning we are not having this same discussion next year. And at this point, what exactly is RW bringing to the table?
Thank you!
Someone gets it! No one would notice RW not being there. In fact it could create some great mismatches because there will be no tape on the new guys put in.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
If someone can beat him out for the third WR spot
then cut him and eat your losses, but if no one can why, not keep him for 1 more year, if he’s the best option for the third WR. I don’t think he’s at all that devisive.
this sucks
Bruce Carter+Sean Lee=BRUCE LEE!!!!
by Archie Barberio on Jun 22, 2011 1:35 PM CDT reply actions
I don't think we are releasing Newman
but what would our cap space be? how much do we owe against the cap now without doing anything?
Sean Lissemore = The next Bruce Smith
no one really knows
it could be 136m or 108m or somewhere in between.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
+1
Know one relly knows. We need to get one of those MIT graduates that create derivative investment structures to figure all this out.
But like bigham said, I think the 136.6mil may be acurate, but it also includes the benfits portion of the salary cap (the money covering the incentive bonuses) that is usually 20 – 30mil depending on CBA agreement.
Add in some dead money that may get removed once 2011 season actually starts, and perhaps all dead money if JJ has his way in new CBA negotiations – which players would gladly accept because it means more real money for player salaries – and we could suddenly have 20 or 30mil under the true salary portion of the cap.
Really just a wait and see at this point.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
So if we had done this LAST year like most teams, when there was no cap...
..we’d be in a MUCH better position for 2011?
FEAR the STAR.
but WP was still a puppet then with JJ running the show.
Now we have JG. When this CBA is signed I want to see a list of names suddenly cut from the Cowboys. I do not care about what it means for this year unless it prevents from signing Free. This team needs some longerterm goals. Get out of the mindset that they are Superbowl contenders and one player away deal and work on building a culture and a franchise.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
I don't think WP had that much power, nor do I think JG has it.. yet
Finances (cap) are more of a front office thing, I thought.
FEAR the STAR.
I believe that Jerry thinks they can do both, so he’s not going to go on a cutting spree. JG might want to build a culture and a franchise, but he’s going to have to keep the team in contention while doing so—or else he’s out of the job.
And in today’s NFL, Jerry might not be wrong. I’d argue that there’s not a huge separation between the Super Bowl winner and the next 5 or so teams every year, and that a new coach (esp. defensive coordinator/system) has been enough to push several recent champs over the top (Giants, Steelers, Saints, Packers). I don’t think Jerry’s wrong to have high hopes for the coming season already.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 22, 2011 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Considering the Steelers won the SB in Cowher’s final year, I wouldn’t say a coaching change put them over the top.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 23, 2011 9:35 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Okay, I just might have pushed that one a bit to help my point… but they did win a SB with a second-year coach and have consistently reshaped their team this decade without undergoing a major “rebuilding” phase.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 23, 2011 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions
That they have. Successfully.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 23, 2011 2:18 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
The Cowboys are going to have to come up with Big Bucks
Free is going to be able to demand HUGE money
and Bowen is going get paid close to top dollar too. There just aren’t that many quality defensive ends in free agency this year.
Would you guys rather re-sign Bowen at idk $5 mill per....or
sign Cullen Jenkins at say $7 mill per?
Keep Jose Reyes, Trade Fred Wilpon
by BigBlueIntervention on Jun 22, 2011 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Bowen
Besides age, upside, and salary cost, Jenkins is more of a NT. We need pass rushing DEs.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Kegbearer -
Would you have gone D’Quan Bowers in the second over Carter?
Or Stephen Paea over Carter?
I love getting help for the aging ILB’s but not addressing the D Line was more worrying.
I know this was directed at Keg....
but I want to put my 2 cents in…..
I honestly believed that Dallas would take Bowers there in the second, when I saw that he was available I thought, “No way will they pass up a player that was at one time Fighting to be the #1 pick in the draft, not at #40”…While Carter may be a great player(and Fills a need) Bowers would have been a great pick also( may be great, and still fills a need)
As far as Paea?…we already have him on the roster…goes by the name “the Dancing Bear”…..
In other words…Bower>Carter>Paea…..
With the 9th Pick Dallas Selects Tyron Smith...Romo Weeps in Joy, and Bennet says"I might get to go out in the Pass Pattern now!"
by I am Ironman!!! on Jun 22, 2011 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Never a huge Bowers fan for a 3-4
Add the health concerns and I like the Carter pick more. Paea would have been nice, but again I don’t think he is a great fit for DE and we have Ratliff and Brent for NT. I didn’t think there was much left int he 3-4 DE department that I like more than what Carter could provide…could being operative word. I think he immediately helps since we lack a true cover LB for the nickel and him and Lee could set our ILB position for a long time. Also, I think there is better talent in FA for DL (including Bowen and Spears who I would not mind starting for us).
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Byt he way
Just realized you said cullen Jenkins, not Kris. Cullen is mroe DE and the decision is a lot closer…but i think age still wins out and I have high hopes for Bowen (pet cat if you will)
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
I will go with Cullen.
We aren’t even really sure that Bowen is an answer at 3-4 DE. For 2 million more I would definitely take the guy who is a proven force. And yes, he is older. But the guy had 7 sacks in 8 games started. I think a few good years out of him would be more than worth it.
Look me in the eye. It's okay if you're scared. So am I. But we are scared for different reasons. I'm scared of what I won't become. And you're scared of what I could become. Look at me. I won't let myself end where I started. I won't let myself finish where I began. I know what is within me, even if you can't see it yet. Look me in the eyes. I have something more important than courage. I have patience. I will become what I know I am.
Cullen is/was a player
But 30+ with a reoccuring calf injury in 2010. He still is high on my FA list of DL, but with salary cap issues we are facing and the longer term solution from Bowen – considering Ryan’s reaction to watching film of Bowen (so not just my own interpretations) I think Bowen wins out. Not to mention I think the difference would actually be greater than 2mil and that money could be the difference between resiging Free or losing him to another team, etc.
In a perfect world, let’s sign both! HAHA
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
The Cowboys are going to have to cut older players from the OL
Free and Bowen are going to be EXPENSIVE
Goodbye, Newman.
So it looks like cutting T-New is pretty much the only way for the Cowboys to be significant players in free agency. Good thing they can slot in that young CB they drafted in the second or third round this year!
Wait, what’s that? They didn’t draft a CB, they drafted a nickel LB and a complementary RB instead? Damn. You really want me to trust that the Jones’ have a plan for this team?
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 22, 2011 3:23 PM CDT reply actions
The Cowboys will be lucky
Just to be able to sign Free and Bowen , even if they cut Newman
Free is going to be the most expensive free agent in the entire market.
by Jonathan Stern on Jun 22, 2011 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Free won't be close to the biggest contract signed this off season.
And do you count tenders/tags in that #? We don’t know that tenders will hold and be allowed under the new CBA.
Vick, Peyton, Mankins, etc. All will be big contracts, add in alphabet soup and other high profile FA’s and a lot of $ is going to be tossed around by teams that have to get up to the salary floor.
Well said
Free will get paid, but let’s not get carried away
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
lol
Seriously, I’m not sure if you’re familiar with the name Nnamdi Asomugha, who plays a position that is the 2nd highest paid in the league behind QB…..Free will not be the most expensive FA in the market….I think your Cowboy fandom has blinded you, there are a lot of great free agents that will make much more than Doug Free
"I still feel like I have something to offer, and the cynical fan can really kiss my ass. I really don’t care. There’s a bunch of true fans and the people who actually want to take the time to get to know me know who I am. The guy who sits in his mom’s basement and types on his mom’s computer, I couldn’t really care less about." - Chipper Jones
Good Point bringing up the draft.
It really relates to this discussion.
This is why I keep hating on the RB pick. What a waste. You can pick up NFL RB’s off the street. We have one on the PS already!
Wouldn’t it have been nice to have a 3rd round CB or OL or safety or DL? Sure they wouldn’t be a lock to start, but people here are expecting too much from Murray too as it is.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Murray has unique set of skills for a rookie
You won’t find many RBs on practice squads and free agency with his speed, ability to play in the slot/receiving threat, and the most underrated aspect of RBs – pass blcoking, to which he was very good in college and RBs can take years to learn (ie Choice)
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
sure sure
I’ll be waiting to see him justify this pick.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Let's hope so
It should be fun to watch
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
well said
How high was Arian Foster drafted? Ahmad Bradshaw? Michael Turner? Peyton Hillis? LeGarrette Blount? Any Packers RB? I can almost understand the pick if the cupboard is bare at RB, but Felix wasn’t too shabby behind a pathetic OL…and how long ago was it that everyone was making the same justifications for using a high pick on his special blend of speed/receiving/blocking?
Too many needs elsewhere to keep chasing shiny skill position objects with high draft picks.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 22, 2011 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Something that just crossed my mind
Will Washington take a huge cap hit if & when they cut McNabb & Fat Al ?
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
prob but no one knows what the cap rules will be
and what does it matter… this is BTB. Skins aren’t even in contention anyway haha.
Tony Romo 2011's League's Most Valuable Player
I think McFlabb had a one year deal, so no penalty
Fat Albert will likely hurt, though I am not sure how much of his crazy signing bonus he got up front.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
He signed that monstrous deal just before or after Philly massacred them on MNF.
"Learning to eat soup with a knife"
by h2o_34_35_44 on Jun 22, 2011 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions
McNever - Vanilla Soul Party
Donovan McNabb is having two big parties this weekend.
A Vanilla Soul party in Philadelphia Friday night and a Saturday night roof-top party in Chicago. No joke.
And on the invitations it reads – “NFL Superstar Quarterback and Future Hall of Famer Donovan McNabb”
The cards also have a quote from John Wooden – “It takes talent to win, but it takes character to repeat.”
What is McNabb repeating – Throwing up in the Super Bowl?
I think there is a very good chance this season has no cap....
and therefore no floor.
There are many teams that are tens of millions below the required 90% of what the cap would be.
There won’t be enough time to comply. It would be way too chaotic. Owners will make that clear in negotiations. The players wont resist another cap free season with 500+ free agents hitting the market.
There will be one set of rules for this season, then you’ll see the new rules go into effect at the beginning of the new league year next March.
Makes sense and sounds great
And would certainly help the Cowboys a lot…especially if we can dump contracts in the uncapped year to better prepare for 2012 cap rules.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Cowboys will re-sign Free
Without him – the whole house of cards on JG’s Offense goes to pot.
And I do believe the Cowboys are the frontrunner for Asomugha.
Cowboys vs. Redskins and Asomugha has a history with the Grizzly Man.
I agree about Free
But disagree about Namdi
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
Frontrunners
Meaning – The Cowboys are the team everyone else thinks is going to land Asomugha (Including Eagles fans)
The Eagles are much more concerned with the Defensive Line than a 30 year old multi-million dollar shut down corner. (They have too much money vested in Asante anyway to justify backing up the truck for another CB.)
Plus they like their young guys at that spot.
I don’t know a single Eagle fan who thinks he’s going to Dallas.
by 92-74-99-96 on Jun 23, 2011 9:37 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
The Cowboys would really benefit from some one-year concessions from the players.
A chance to franchise one guy would be nice too.
Pessimists say the cup is half-empty, while optimists say it's half-full. Well, isn't it both? Realist Larry, 2009
by Realist Larry on Jun 22, 2011 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Jason Garrett rolled the dice big time -
Garrett went 75% offense in the draft.
The defense has received – 1 coach, 1 injured LB, and 1 small but potentially tough nosed CB.
If Jones can not come up with the needed bucks for at least two defensive Free Agents AFTER re-signing Doug Free, the Cowboys can maybe hope for a healthy season and an away wild card game.
The D has received the majority of picks lately, it was the O's turn.
And I won’t complain about them following their board.
Yes last year it was O 6 D 2, 2010 it was O 2 D 4, 2009 O 4 D 7 and a K, 2008 O 3 and D 3.
Maybe the Cowboys just went BPA
which is probably the right way to go
Just hope the Cowboys scouted well
by Jonathan Stern on Jun 22, 2011 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Bowers = Andre Wadsworth
that is what people think
Wadsworth was the # 3 pick in the draft in 1998 . Had a good rookie year but knee problems forced him to call it quits
u have to keep Free
maybe add a G CB FS K as well
okay i have cerebral palsy arthris and chronic fatigue as well i have a great life and loveing folks some days are better than other days i got a make-a-wish in 2001 and saw my favorite team the broncos it was the trip of a lifetime i wish everyone couild have gotten to enjoy that with me i know some of u hate the broncos and that okay but i bleed organ and bule for my mnr fans but i bleed orange and blue denver will rise again resident broncos fan for every blog resident broncos for stampede bule thanks shvd98z24 real name jeremy woodard nettleton high class of 02 yes i am a raider
one aspect that the cowboys front office
has neglected is trading productive players in FA for draft picks and replenish in the draft not thru FA..to me that presents several advantages 1) the team stays young. 2) the team won’t be overburdened with big contracts and underachievers…
for example lets say dez’s contract is up in 2014 and he is a productive RFA if you get a 1st, 2nd and 4th pick for him which do you want to do? get the extra picks or spend 65 mil on him?
I would take the picks ..everyone is replaceable IMO through the draft …of course that depends on if there will be a such thing as a RFA in the next CBA
depends on who's in the draft and who's on your team too
But generally I agree. We can’t be too committed to a player like we’ve always been
by somebodyquiet on Jun 22, 2011 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Gotta think long-term here everyone
If there’s anything that JG has showed us, especially with the draft, it’s that maybe FINALLY the Cowboys are in long-term thinking mode. No more win NOW NOW NOW.
As long as we can resign Free, which before reading this I was very worried about, I’m happy. Get our bookends signed long-term and maybe get 1 FA (Weddle?). I think Rob is going to fix players like Jenkins and Spencer. With a non-vanilla scheme like we had under Wade, our defense should improve just from that.
"Be great today" - Jason Garrett
a long-term RB?
You could make the argument that Tyron, Carter, and Arkin picks show a long-term approach, but taking DeMarco Murray was a definite “win now” choice. Add in that I could make an equally strong argument that Tyron and Carter were both taken to fill immediate holes rather than for their long-term benefits (thought they might have both). And to top it off, hiring Rob Ryan is not a long-term approach at all—at the first sign of success, he’s off to a head coaching job somewhere else.
Add it all up and it points to a front office that very much wants to win NOW NOW NOW. Now there are also signs that suggest that Jerry is thinking long term as well, so there’s a chance to have both. But I think it’s a mistake to suggest that winning NOW is anything less than priority number one in Dallas.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 23, 2011 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't mean to say that it's not a priority
But since when does Jerry Jones draft OL in the first round, not never. I don’t think taking Murray is a win now choice either. The NFL is a RB by committee league, and as much as people here hate to hear it….Tashard Choice is not a viable option to get a lot of touches. Barber is done. They needed another RB to share carries with Felix and help prolong his career.
Sure maybe what I said is a bit absurd given we are talking about the Dallas Cowboys, but the fact that they did some forward-thinking drafting this year gives me hope that they aren’t just out buying shiny toys thinking they’ll go to the Super Bowl every year. This isn’t 1995. You get to the Super Bowl by long-term draft success and filling holes with FA. You DON’T do it by having shit drafts and filling in EVERYTHING with overpriced FA.
"Be great today" - Jason Garrett
I agree that Jerry’s moved beyond the “buying shiny toys” phase of his ownership. But I disagree if you’re suggesting (and maybe you’re not) that the Cowboys don’t believe they have a team in place this year that can contend for the Super Bowl. Perhaps they can win now without mortgaging the future; I think we can agree that would be best. And perhaps Jerry will show restraint and wisdom in free agency—that would give me faith that Garrett really does wield a lot of personnel power.
But I wouldn’t point to this draft as solid evidence that Jerry has changed his ways. Drafting Tyron is a step in the right direction, but it’s not a pattern just yet.
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 23, 2011 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions
This I guess sums up perfectly what I was horribly trying to get at...
Perhaps they can win now without mortgaging the future
And you are right, it’s not a pattern yet. Resigning Free, Bowen, and getting Weddle (aka avoiding the shiny Nnamdi) would start to develop a pattern imo.
"Be great today" - Jason Garrett
sounds easy enough
I’m pretty sure that Free and Bowen will be re-signed, but I’ll be surprised if Weddle ends up in Dallas. I think he’s going to be highly sought after and somebody (else) will overpay to get him or San Diego will overpay to keep him. My guess is that a third-tier veteran will be signed at FS (Mikell, Elam) , one that AOA would be expected to challenge by 2012. Plus Jerry will make one move that leaves most of us scratching our heads—giving Sensi a mega-buck deal, for example, or signing a Davin Joseph injury-risk, or cutting T-New without signing a replacement.
What I’m saying is, we’ll probably be able to still have this debate about whether Jerry or Jason is in charge, and whether it’s short-term or long-term thinking, after free agency is finished…
by greatwhitenorth on Jun 24, 2011 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions
The new salary floor is going to make things wacky.
A lot of teams are going to have to spend a lot of $ to get up to the floor. That could lead to some huge contracts for FA’s.
According to a new Yahoo story the Cowboys have over $100 million committed, but are not in the top 2.
“As such, these numbers are approximate and are not intended to be a 100 percent accurate barometer of what each team has spent. But in adding together six key totals for each team — base salaries, signing bonuses, option bonuses, roster bonuses, workout bonuses, and incentives likely-to-be-earned incentives, we can get a fairly clear picture of who’s doing what — and who’s not.
Packers (a league-leading $115.8 million in 2011 cash obligations), or the New York Jets (second-place with $113.5 million), or the owners of the eight other teams over the $100 million cash floor pre-CBA (the Redskins, 49ers, Falcons, Broncos, Rams, Cowboys, Lions, and Giants)”
This of course doesn’t include the $ necessary to resign our wanted FA’s, new FA’s and the rookies.
Deciphering Salary Caps
We will never know all the info to get an accurate number before the team and league provide their offical ones. That being said, if the figure is closer to 100+, then we suddenly have very few cap issues. Assuming about 110 is accurate and includes all incentives and benefits, then we will have +/- $35mil in true salary to spend on our FAs and rookies, and a few new/veteran FAs as well.
"I am a true believer. Anthony Spencer will have 7 or more sacks in 2011 and Stephen Bowen can ball!" - Kegbearer
"Leadership is a matter of having people look at you and gain confidence, seeing how you react. If you're in control, they're in control." - Tom Landry
As long as we resign at least 1 of our DE and Free
Then give me Weddle and I’m happy
"Be great today" - Jason Garrett
Very nice catch Rena
I hadn’t seen that.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jun 23, 2011 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions
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