Will Big-Name Free Agents Be On Cowboys 2012 Shopping List?
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 26, 2012 5:00 AM CST
in Dallas Cowboys 2012 Free Agents
Email
PrintCarl Nicks, Calais Campbell, Cortland Finnegan, Chris Myers, Cliff Avril.
All are big name free agents, and the fact that their first names all start with a "C" augurs well for the Cowboys, but is entirely coincidental. All have been linked to the Cowboys, often and repeatedly. And if the most recent Cowboys history is anything to go by, none of them are going to play for the Cowboys next season.
Last year, the Cowboys brought in free agents Abram Elam and Kenyon Coleman. The year before, they weren't active in free agency at all, and three years ago the free agent crop consisted of Keith Brooking, Gerald Sensabaugh and Igor Olshansky.
What all the free agent acquisitions over the last three years have in common was that none of them were what could be described as the cream of the crop of their free agency class.
Overall, the five acquisitions were arguably closer to the bottom than the top of the free agent class at their positions. The table below shows each player's ProFootballFocus grade and rank in the year they reached free agency. Keith Brooking for example was given a -10.5 final season grade by PFF in 2008. That ranked Brooking 47th out of 55 4-3 OLBs that year. Kenyon Coleman is the only recently acquired player with a positive grade.
| 2009 Free Agents | 2011 Free Agents | ||||
| Brooking | Sensabaugh | Olshansky | Coleman | Elam | |
| PFF Grade | -10.5 | -10.8 | -9.6 | +4.4 | -4.0 |
| Position Rank | 47/53 | 78/83 | 26/28 | 19/42 | 60/85 |
If their recent free agent activities are anything to go by, the Cowboys may end up pursuing some pretty unheralded players in free agency.
Big-name free agents are what makes discussing free agent options fun. But when was the last time the Cowboys signed a big-name free agent that actually worked out? It may be time to get familiar with some of the lesser known free agents out there. Of course, the Cowboys may very well go out and sign some of the premier free agents available anyway. After all, they didn't shy away from going hard after Nnamdi Asomugha last year.
The Cowboys restructured the contracts of DeMarcus Ware, Miles Austin and Tony Romo last year to create some cap room specifically for this year. With what they carried over from last year and some additional restructurings, the Cowboys could easily have in the neighborhood of $20 million to spend in free agency this year.
In principle, the Cowboys could get any free agent they want. But will they? And more importantly, should they?
Come back later this morning as Tom Ryle looks at "Free Agency Priorities For The Dallas Cowboys" here on BTB.
334 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
question OCC
on the “Cap carryover” is that a one year shot? because IIRC then you can do that any year you have excess cap space…..
Here’s a theoretical play from 2010: Snap. Tony takes 7 step drop. Tony looks left at Miles, who is doubled, and looks right to where Roy Williams should be…but instead sees Colombo on his back and a Defensive End foaming at the mouth jumping over Marc’s carcass. Tony proceeds to run like hell and look for Witten
-by CotySaxman on Jul 11, 2011 7:50 AM PDT
Now, if somebody doesn’t agree with that, that’s cool. I also don’t agree with the fact that I don’t have $10 million in my bank account. But the fact that I don’t agree with it doesn’t make it any less true.
by One.Cool.Customer on Dec 23, 2010 12:00 AM PST
by I am Ironman!!! on Jan 26, 2012 5:24 AM CST reply actions
It's in the new CBA
I don’t know if you have the time, but it’s in here.
http://images.nflplayers.com/mediaResources/files/2011CBA.pdf
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
Little fuzzy on the details
but if I recall correctly it was for “transition years only”, and ends in 2013. Could be wrong, but I’m not going digging through all of that again, I have made my peace with it since the Lee Ford fiasco.
by TheCowboyWay on Jan 26, 2012 9:07 AM CST up reply actions
And yeah, it was one year.
As long as te carryover is claim by the day before the last day of league-year…
What is the star now? A fallen piece of hardened plastic? The heaviest franchise in American sport? A false idol adored by many millions? The epitome of all that can be achieved with hard work? All that can be lost with too strong a sense of entitlement? A welcome coping mechanism, distracting from the real negativity on Earth? A bonding and separating agent?
by BlueNSilverBlood on Jan 26, 2012 12:00 PM CST up reply actions
People like to joke about Jerry Jones having deep pockets
But the problem is, that with the CBA, everyone’s pockets are all of the same depth. It’s the return on the dollars spent that became much more important than how many dollars you had to throw around.
This fact, and the repercussions of previous contracts, is likely a big culprit of the more recent lack of free agent splashes.
Bob Sturm has posited a theory that...
…since the inception of the new stadium, the Cowboys can’t afford to be big players in free agency (Jerry’s monthly mortgage for the “Sta-dyum” is astronomical).
I believe that the payment timetable for TV revenues to the owners also plays into this—which is why the Cowboys tend to extend contracts DURING the season, because that’s when they are receiving TV revenue.
I have heard that theory, but I don't know how much I believe it.
In 2009, wasn’t the Cowboys the highest paid team in the league? I mean, yeah, they weren’t investing in quality, but Jerry was paying a lot. Once the cap came into place, they had to do back flips to get in under the cap. And with all of the dead money from the cuts, they again had to plan for that. Furthermore, they showed that they were willing to pay a player a good deal of money when they went after Nnamdi. I really feel like they over estimated the talent on the team, paid that talent too much, had that blow up in their face, and are now in the process of restructuring things.
Its not about wealth it is about cash flow
during the offseason, there is less of it to spend on the big name signing bonus’……..
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
I don't think Jerry got to be as wealthy as he did by not knowing how to handle cash.
If it was a matter of cash flow, he’d take the every cash he is getting during the season, put it in savings, then spend it in the off season. Just because you get it during the season doesn’t mean you need to spend it then.
of he could be paying extra on the building to reduce interest costs (during the season)
I’m sure he is doing well with his cash, but it comes down to priorities
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
Yeah I'm not sure either
I do know that the public part (the bond) is being paid off faster than they expected because revenues were much higher that they estiamted. I would think that correspondingly Jones would also be doing better than expected.
Cash flow could be an issue, but I tend to think it’s more along the lines of a change in FA philosophy since several (most?) of his recent big FA signings have been somewhere between disasterous and disappointing. They may still go after big FAs, but I think they want to do that less frequently.
Don't believe everything you think.
The Cowboys had the highest payroll in the NFL
for 2010, the uncapped year. The Cowboys also had the largest revenue stream and the highest worth in the league. If Jerry could, he’d probably outspend everyone every year.
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
Actually the Skins had the highest payroll in 2010. We were 2nd.
Redskins: $178.2 million.
Cowboys: $166.5 million.
There is some discrepancy somewhere.
some I’ve looked up had the Cowboys at #1 payroll and others had the Raiders. The Redskins aren’t even in the top ten. there has to be some discrepancy on the differing reports; some might only deal with player salaries, some stories may run after someone is cut….etc.
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
He was also never able to land a naming rights deal
which set him back an expected 100mil. Still, Jerry has the reputation of a spender, I still just think that not properly managing the uncapped years is what is/has been hampering us.
by TheCowboyWay on Jan 26, 2012 9:13 AM CST up reply actions
That socialist NFL
Suck it 5Blings! ;)
But seriously, the Cowboys should be able to spend more money than the Bengals. Their ratings are higher, their attendance is miles higher, and they contribute far more to the sport. The game does better when teams like the Cowboys, Patriots, Packers, Steelers, 49ers, and Giants do well.
add Raiders, Dolphins and Bears to that list and I will co-sign
Lifelong Cowboys Fan from the Swamps of Jersey
My Beer Blog: http://tiltingsuds.wordpress.com/
I would love to show you the finer points to a muay thai clinch whipped knee to the face seanrude
by matt575 on Nov 22, 2011 3:09 AM EST
Raiders and Dolphins (to a lesser extent) have national followings
Lifelong Cowboys Fan from the Swamps of Jersey
My Beer Blog: http://tiltingsuds.wordpress.com/
I would love to show you the finer points to a muay thai clinch whipped knee to the face seanrude
by matt575 on Nov 22, 2011 3:09 AM EST
that's why I hate it when teams like the Cardinals and Saints are in the super bowl
bc they’re just feasting off revenue sharing (in some areas, not all have revenue sharing) and benefitting off the fact that the higher-revenue teams are restricted on player salaries. On top of that, there are increasing regulations on how camps are run, OTAs…etc. This is being done under the banner of parity. To me it’s more like making all teams the same and mediocre.
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
Shore up the ol
by signing one the quality guards/centers and give yourself flexibility in the draft. I still think the OL/DL is the biggest needs on this team.
The modern NFL puts rookie CBs behind the 8ball with the ticky tack penalty calls which i think contributed to the 3rd yr slump of mike jenkins. CBs have a huge learning curve and factoring a pass rush that disappears in big games, thats not a good combination.
if you are correct about the learning curve for CB's
shouldnt we focus on getting a quality DB in FA instead of the C/G ?
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
DB should be a top need along with the OL and DL.
But I’m sure Jerry will pick up a few more linebackers if he has his way.
"The Dallas Cowboys announced they have released Jerry Jones."
I wouldn’t mind taking a lb later, you need to add people to your front seven every year
by somebodyquiet on Jan 26, 2012 9:46 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
We gotta bring in some talent via FA...
Yes, you often risk the chance of not getting value relative to the cost of signing a top FA, but consider the extra cost the price of getting a known commodity.
It’s much riskier trying to fill starting needs through the draft with rookies. The draft is a supplement to adding talent to your roster, it shouldn’t be relied upon as a way to address immediate needs in my opinion.
I’d love to see this team add a guy like Cliff Avril, Carl Nicks or a Michael Griffin. That way you could grab a CB to come and work himself in as your third corner. You can draft an OLB to work in as a pass rush specialist in subpackages. You can grab a safety to develop and work in on special teams or as a nickelbacker ala Danny McCray.
Dear Jerry, quit penny-pinching with the Kenyon Colemans of the world and spend some lucci.
Two forks in my eye > Watching an Aubrey Huff at-bat in '11
by Phillyboijr on Jan 26, 2012 5:36 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Sorry, but we're much more likley to see a couple of Kyle Kosiers
than any of the names in this article.
Jerruh wants to reward the guys he’s drafted (he’s loyal and this makes his drafting look better)
As you said elsewhere
It’s a good strategy if you draft well
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
id take 2 Kyle Kosiers
he was Dallas best Olineman for a few years
finish the Oline rebuild
by yehti on Jan 26, 2012 8:42 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Flo' in his prime? Bigg? Gurode?
They all sucked lately, but I’d say they were better than Kosier was when they were actually good. Agree that Kosier isn’t the problem.
There have been games where kosier’s lack of strength hurt him and this team. Minn game for instance
by somebodyquiet on Jan 26, 2012 9:47 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
The biggest name free agent of all
MARIO WILLIAMS
after him at DE is
Calais Campbell,
Cliff Avril.
But if they are not there
Next up is Jason Jones.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=68142&draftyear=2008&genpos=
And on the OL if you could get him cheap. Jason Smith.
we could keep Spencer , and sign Jason Jones and Jason Smith
Why would you want to keep Spencer?
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
A3-4 OLB has to be better than merely a good run stopper.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
He's more then that
but people don’t like him because he doesn’t get sacks like Ware. but there’s no point of me explaining since people are gonna ignore it.
Not about sacks but consistent pressure. If we had an interior lineman that could rush than you don’t need a good pass rusher out there but since we don’t have that we need our 2nd olb to generate pressure. This is also a guy who admitted that he took plays off
by somebodyquiet on Jan 26, 2012 9:49 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
your OLBs should be pass rush specialists more then the interior D in a 3-4
If we had an interior lineman that could rush than you don’t need a good pass rusher out there but since we don’t have that we need our 2nd olb to generate pressure
now having a NT/DE in a 3-4 that can generate pass rush or get pressure/sacks isnt a penalty & a lot of the better 3-4 defenses are doing that now. Wade/Texans have DL & OLBs that generate a good pass rush while being able to stop the run.
i’d like to see big 325+lb NT that can push the pocket & handle the run
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth. Sean Lee is a welcomed addition at ILB & Kegabear's prediction about Spencer looks spot on so far.
cause he is not terrible. He is not Von Miller but he is okay.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:27 AM CST up reply actions
He's was drafted to be apass rusher, I'm sorry but he's not lived up to his first rd daft status
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I don’t disagree with that at all , but he is okay. We would have to replace him .
Look if we can get Mario Wiliams then no problem saying good bye.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:43 AM CST up reply actions
True, he's not living up to his first rd draft status, but that doesn't mean he isn't a serviceable OLB.
Considering the team has CB’s, d-linemen, and o-linemen that aren’t serviceable, I’d much rather Dallas first focuses on replacing those players first, regardless of their draft status.
I can find cheaper Anthony Spencers in this dradt if you want serviceable
I can also find better pass rushers than Anthony Spencer who will also be cheaper. You have to consider the finances and the “serviceable production”.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
While I think Spencer's much better than Serviceable, I agree with your conclusion.
Spencer depends on cost and what happens in the draft. I don’t think Spencer will get a lot of interest in Free Agency right up front, I think he’ll be a FA still around after the Draft.
I completely agree that it depends ont he cost.
But, if he is going to come at a reasonable price, I say keep him. I can then take that draft that was ear marked for the Spencer replacement and look depth at ILB, a QB to groom, a center to compete with Costa, someone to replace Ball or walker, or anyone of a numerous other needs that are greater than OLB.
Bet your wrong there.
Bet he goes quick.
by Sado44 on Jan 26, 2012 3:21 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
You may be abke
To find is what you ment to say. The question is will they be just as good better or worse. Keeping Spencer means you know what you have and you can build your scheme to match his talents and hide his weaknesses. Spencer does everything asked of him and does it well. Mayne not great bit well. So let him go and draft his replacement. Then your stuck trying to figure out what you have and hoping its better and not worse. The point is Spencer isn’t a pass fishing monster he gets good pressure’s from his stats he doesn’t get the sack as much as he should but that’s cause his first read is run not pass. His second read if my understanding is correct is RB or te on most plays. Then he rushes. Even on the pure rush plays his first read is run. So he losses a step or two doing it. I’d rather know what we had than hope.
by Sado44 on Jan 26, 2012 3:20 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
agree
Cause the olb I like the most in this years draft is Upshaw, but there is no guarantee he will be better than Spencer especially this year. Spencer knows the terminology already and I think he can really benefit from moving Ratliff to the strongside end next too him. We made a great choice by picking Ware, but we can’t expect every other 1st rounder to be great as Ware.
Texas Stadium has a hole in its roof so God can watch his favorite team play
by Ihatethesaints on Jan 27, 2012 10:19 AM CST up reply actions
IMHO,I worry about letting Spencer go.
He is a good OLB and if we let him go we may end up regretting it,ala K Hamlin. Yes there are prospects in the draft we could replace Spencer with,but we have no idea how the draftee will work out. If it works,hey great,but it could just as easily blow up in our faces.Which brings me to my point,this league is about stocking talent. Spencer is talented and does a good job for us,just not quite as good as everybody thinks he should.Would letting him go be the best route for this team?? I don’t think it would.I could be very wrong about this,it wouldn’t be the first time.JMHO.
40yr fan who loves his Lord and Savior,Beautiful Wife,kids and 2 Pits,America,and Americas Team.
Searching for at least 2 more Super Bowl wins and more kool-aid.
Totally excited about new coaches and this teams future.
by NVCowboy4Life on Jan 26, 2012 7:31 PM CST up reply actions
Guess I should have read further,my comment basically says the same thing Sado44 says.
It just got knocked way down the thread.But totally agree Sado,I don’t want to let Spencer walk,he is a good player.IMHO we could add a better player in the middle of the line and turn his production into what we all want.
40yr fan who loves his Lord and Savior,Beautiful Wife,kids and 2 Pits,America,and Americas Team.
Searching for at least 2 more Super Bowl wins and more kool-aid.
Totally excited about new coaches and this teams future.
by NVCowboy4Life on Jan 26, 2012 7:40 PM CST up reply actions
Put Campbell next to Butler or Spencer and things change.
Especially if Brent develops and we slide Rat to DE.
Coleman, Campbell, Rat, Brent, Ware, Butler, Spence plus Geathers, Lissemore, Spears and Hatcher.
There have been a lot of times that Spence did his job and opposing QBs just slid forward a little because the o-line kept a nice, clean pocket and D-Ware over ran the QB a little.
What is the star now? A fallen piece of hardened plastic? The heaviest franchise in American sport? A false idol adored by many millions? The epitome of all that can be achieved with hard work? All that can be lost with too strong a sense of entitlement? A welcome coping mechanism, distracting from the real negativity on Earth? A bonding and separating agent?
by BlueNSilverBlood on Jan 26, 2012 12:18 PM CST up reply actions
Nicks amd Cambell
Should be top priorities in FA. Stephen said it him self we have the money so spend it but spend it wisely. Those 2 signings would be wise moves. Your not going all dream team but addressing serious lack of talent needs. It also gives you tremendous flexibility in the draft.
At 14 you can select the top pass rusher or if there is value to trade down and still grab one you can while picking up extra picks. Campbell and moving Rat to DE would make for a fearsome pass rush if a stud NT is drafted such as Poe. Or you can go the Ingram, Perry route and drafting a CB, DL in the 2nd 3rd rounds. Leaving flexibility to address the center /guard in round 4.
Anyone will be better than Costa and by signing Nicks the line instantly is upgraded
by CowboyWay on Jan 26, 2012 6:33 AM CST via mobile reply actions
I would love to get Mario Williams or Campbell but if they are not there then who?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:29 AM CST up reply actions
Cliff Avril isnt an OLB in a 3-4 nor DE
I would rather draft a OLB like Ingram than sign Avril.
If Campbell can’t be had I would focus on a guy like Meyers to add with Nicks to sure up the O line. Then focus entirely on the front 7 and secondary in the draft.
1st -OLB, DL
2nd-DL, CB
by CowboyWay on Jan 27, 2012 6:27 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
that is as good as any.
I think Jason Jones has more upside than any DE the Cowboys have.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 11:27 AM CST up reply actions
Avril played OLB for three years in college
I’d rather sign a proven player that’s produced at the NFL level than roll the dice on drafting another Spencer/Carpenter bust as a pass rusher and end up with another wasted 1st round pick
Spend Baby Spend
. . . this free agency class and this draft will set the Cowboys up for success. I expect the Cowboys to make a huge splash in free agency. Center or Guard, Corner, Veteran QB for starters.
I can't believe you don't even mention freaking Mario Williams
Sean Lissemore = The next Bruce Smith
Cario Williams?
#demarcusvstheworld
Cowboys wishlist: RG3
by accidental innuendo on Jan 26, 2012 7:35 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
hey if we do happen to pick up williams
are you gonna change your name to Willyyyyy?
by TheCowboyWay on Jan 26, 2012 7:43 AM CST up reply actions
Or you could take it a step further
and go the combo route
Willissyyyyy
(sounds like a rapper or something.)
by TheCowboyWay on Jan 26, 2012 7:46 AM CST up reply actions
That's after we trade for Patrick Willis
My most recent fanpost:
The Weekly Chessmatch: Cowboys @ Eagles
by CotySaxman on Jan 26, 2012 8:30 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
I think most of us don't think Dallas will go after him
he doesn’t want to be in a 3-4, he’s going to be crazy expensive and Dallas has multiple FA needs, so you’d think they’d go after less expensive players. But would we love to see Super Mario as a Cowboy? Of course.
Don't believe everything you think.
If the Cowboys get Williams he would make the Cowboys a lot better and make it possible to fix problems in the draft/
IF we get Williams
Round 1 DeCastro
2 J Jenkins with a trade up
3 Chandler Jones with a trade up
that would be a nice offseason
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:31 AM CST up reply actions
So he doesn't even WANT to be in Houston anymore?
Since Wade switched them over to a 3-4? I hadn’t heard that. Of course, being over here in Bahrain with a kind of shoddy connection I’ve missed out on things.
Football is an incredible game. Sometimes it's so incredible, it's unbelievable. -- Tom Landry
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing. -- Emo Philips
by Pnut Gallery on Jan 26, 2012 10:06 AM CST up reply actions
Mario prefers to pkay 4-3 DE and just getting after the QB. He wasn't feeling comfortable at 3-4 OLB.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I read that he was doing ok in the 3-4 . He was rushing most of the time anyway.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:27 AM CST up reply actions
If he leaves houston in fa he wont go to a 3-4 team
Same reason Greg Ellis, after leaving Dallas opted to go to a 4-3 team. 4-3 DEs hate standing up in the 3-4 OLB position because they have to change the way the see the football and thus affecting their ability to jump the snap.
Just cause he was a willing participant with the Texans, doesn’t mean he’ll voluntarily go sigm with a 3-4 team to play the position he could’ve played in Houston.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Curious where you read Mario wasn't feeling comfotable at 3-4 OLB
He was tied for the lead in AFC with 5 sacks thru 4 1/2 games at OLB in 2012 before his injury (torn pectoral muscle) in his 1st year as a 3-4 OLB.
ok all mario is NOT coming to the cowboys loil......
he doesnt fit the 3-4 olb pos, he doesnt like the 3-4 olb poss andis going to go to a 4-3 team, he cant cover TE and fast RB, even the texans fans will tell ya that lol
redskins- bought by Snyder, OWNED by THE Cowboys !
Ryan- If only i could get that kind of aggression from my. Hey! You gonna eat that ?
Texans .....stand tall and REP !
If Peyton Manning can be jerked with by the Colts
And be given the hint that he’s no longer of use to the Colts, then the Cowboys had better let Anthony Spencer walk, and release Terence Newman (it has to be done) by the June 6th deadline.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I could be wrong
but dumping Manning feels to me like one of those situations where they will end up regretting that move…
Don't believe everything you think.
I really think that.
Ryan Leaf was once considered a #1 draft pick, maybe a better one than Manning.
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
I'm not saying Luck is Leaf
But Quarterbacks do bust and I’ve seen enough do just that to be wary of releasing a GOAT QB for him. I personally think Bradford might bust, and there were talks he was the best QB since Peyton. Also, I’ve seen enough flaws in Luck’s game to know he might now work them out
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
I know Manning is costing them something $28m
but considering the benefit of Luck studying under him, and the value to the franchise of one the most popular players in the league, I think I’d keep him unless he really isn’t physically able to play.
Don't believe everything you think.
Depends whether Peyton would want to be the
Favre to Luck’s Rodgers
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
If Luck turns i to the next Leaf, it will be the biggest draft bust of all time.
Bradford was a good proect, but he’s not in Amdrew Luck’s level. He just happened to be the best prospect of an average QB class at best.
Bradford struggled his second season for a few reasons that werw way beyond his control:
1) The Rams changed their entire offense, ditching the West Coast offense under Shurmur for the Patriots style offense under new Oc Josh McDaniels.
2) The lockout prevented Bradford from havung the necessary OTAs, mini camps, and QB School that every team does from March-June to develop their QBs and improve their offense. None of that training took place with his new OC which is necessary for a QB’s development.
3) The Rams offensive line was an absolute joke, Bradford was running for his life much like Troy Aikman was in his first two seasons.
4) Sam Bradford’s WRs either all got hurt, or were flat garbage, they made a mid season trade for Brandon Lloyd, however the season was already a lost cauae by that point.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
sorry for apelling errors, my ipad is crapping out
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
spelling*
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
You misspelled "spelling errors"
You jackass!!!!! ;)
Seriously, that’s pretty meta. Made my morning Roh.
Prospect*
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Ryan Leaf wasn't the number 1 pick, he went # 2, and was rated as the number 2
Also, Leaf wasn’t a consensus #1pick. He just merely entered the discussion as a “potential” #1 pick. Manning was the higher rated pick because of talent, character, and intangibles.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I never said he was
There was debate that he could be better than Peyton and which one should be taken first. yes I agree they made the right choice in the end, I just think it’s a little more complicated then we’re making it out to be
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
It really wasn't complicated.
ESPN and Mel Kiper just needed to drum up fan interest in the number 1 pick, you get more viewers if theirs the illusion of suspense with the first pick in the draft, rather than admitting it’s a mere formality that the Colts would take Peyton.
The last time there was a legitimate QB debate was the 2004 draft class with Eli, Rivers, Roethlisberger; and the 2005 Draft were the 49ers passed on Rodgers for Smith.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I'll take your word for it
Was not that big a fan back then
I'm not saying Tony Romo is the reincarnation of the mythical Romulus. I'm just saying
I was never a fan of the notion Leaf could go #1
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
2005 debate wasn't legit
A QB from a Gimmick offense with terrible accuracy or a QB from a pro offense with average to above average accuracy. Gee, lemme think. I never got why people liked Smith so much.
I agree about 2005
I’m just saying it was a more legit debate than Manning vs Leaf. Btw, I was laughing my rear emd off when the 49ers passed on Rodgers. I wasn’t laughing so hard after we took Spears ahead of him-at least Romo panned out.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
But Jerry is teh SUXOR!!!!!
They got Ware, so I guess that makes up for it. Jerry made the right call on that one, Parcells wanted Spears. I wanted Rodgers too especially that late, I’m happy with Romo and all, who knows what would have happened if the Cowboys got Romo. Spears, I liked at the time, now? I was wrong.
I was happy we took Ware where Jerry drafted him.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Yeah Spears looked like he could be something good...
Athletic, great size, damn…just didn’t work out. I didn’t know as much then as I know now.
Yup
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
And hey, busts happen
The best laid plans, fail. It happens, you can’t get too hung up on not picking this guy or this guy when you’re picking in the 20s. Sometimes the right process produces the wrong results. Cut your losses and move on.
mmmmm
busts
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
Ryan Leaf was also a Class A sh*thead.
Andrew Luck is a bright guy from a good family and seems to have his head in the right place. Manning is owed a 28M bonus and has neck issues. So with that bonus and his actual salary he’s probably owed a third of the cap.
Peyton will be owed that money if he's on the roster past the March deadline
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
The Colts
Had their eyes on Peyton Manning the moment the 1998 season ended. Of course they had to do their due dilligence and evaluate Leaf. Apparently, Leaf rubbed them the wrong way at the combine which confirmed their decision to draft Peyton. They knew they were taking Peyton in advamce of the draft.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Yeah Leaf's failures weren't just based on talent.
Obviously he wasn’t ready to succeed in the NFL based on just the skills he had coming out of college. He needed to improve and develop some skills. His poor attitude and personal demons prevented him from developing said skills. Killer for a QB.
Then put him on a crappy SD team and have him run a run and shoot offense-recipe for disaster.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Yup
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
i remember him being in the news for bar fights
he got in to a bar fight almost the day after signing his contract. I think later he got arrested for stealing hydrocodone? Dude had issues
check out my bands nanoSMASH and Day vs Night
by AustonianAggie on Jan 26, 2012 9:15 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah, sad stuff
Dude needed some serious help. Looks like he got it and he’s made peace with his “career.” He accepted his role as the biggest bust of all time right when Jamarcus Russell overtook him for that spot. Dude can’t catch a break.
That Sugar Bowl vs Notre Dame was a blessing and a curse for JaMarcus
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
He could afford all the Purple Drink he could desire.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Purple drank.
Sheesh. :P
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.
"Meanwhile, like a bitter wine, Philadelphia’s jealousy fermented in the dark cellars of pride and resentment. With no playoff hopes of their own, Eagles fans turned towards hating the Cowboys." Steve Sabol, NFL films
Dude just looked like he was not all there
It was confirmed with his “KNOCK IT OFF” melt down after his 3rd or 4th game. He read an apology to the media, and afterwords he tossed the paper in his locker.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Drafting Leaf shows the perils of spending a high draft pick on potential and the old NFL scout go to phrase "He just looks like a football player"
Leaf did good as a PAC-10 QB but did not face the level of competition that Manning did. He did not have the mechanics, technique or understanding of the game. This was noted by many scouts at the time. It was also noted by scouts that he was brash and arrogant and still needed to mature. Leaf had a strong arm and big frame and as many scouts said “He just looks like a football player”. I was never a fan of Leaf’s and was stunned and shocked he was even considered a top pick and even in the same disscusion with Manning or how anyone could consider him a better draft pick than Charles Woodson. Anyone who watched him should have known he would need time to develop and play at an NFL level.
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
As fan, I felt the same way, at the time.
I felt bad for the Chargers because they got stuck with the Leaf pick, I don’t think teams were lining up to trade up for Leaf once they were on the clock.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
SD traded up from the #3 pick to the #2 pick
They gave Arizona 2 firsts, a second and 3 time Pro Bowler Eric Metcalf.
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
That's right they traded up for Leaf. Face Palm
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I guess they made up for it...
They got LT and Drew Brees for Mike Vick…
They got Shawne Merriman, Nate Kaeding, and Phillip Rivers for Eli Manning.
Two pretty good trades.
Birddog
What factors went into Aikman being the number 1 pick? Was he more of a sure thing coming into the 1989 draft, with less risk than Leaf was? Both came out of the Pac-10.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
no one heard of Leaf until he lit up
Ohio State or something in a Bowl Game. Then suddenly ESPN was full of it, asking, could he challenge Manning? Everyone watching football felt Manning was as sure a bet as Andrew Luck. Leaf vs Manning was never there. Leaf blew up like JeMarcus Russell did after one huge bowl game.
check out my bands nanoSMASH and Day vs Night
by AustonianAggie on Jan 26, 2012 9:17 AM CST up reply actions
That's what it felt like to me
Regarding both Leaf and Russell. I declared to my friend whose a Raiders fan, you’ll need a QB by 2009/2010.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Leaf played in the Rose Bowl and lost to Michigan
Leaf had less than a 50% completion percentage. If I remember right his college career completion percentage was only around 55%
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
You can't teach accuracy
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Aikman started at Oklahoma and was a starter his sophmore year
He strted out very strong but then broke his ankle. Switzer had to switch back from the prostyle offense to the wishbone. They ended up winning the National Championship that year and there was no way they could not start Holieway as QB the next year and go back to the prostyle offense. That was when Aikman went to UCLA. At UCLA playing under a prostyle offense he went 20-4 and won about every award he could. He had the mechanics down was high character and played at a high level his entire college career.
Jerry got a very close look at Aikman when he played in the Cotton Bowl at Texas Stadium and beat Jerry’s Razorbacks
Even after drafting Aikman they still took Steve Walsh with a #1 pick in the supplamental draft.
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
Yup
That Walsh pick was Jimmy’s right? He coached him at Miami.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Yes it was
The game where Aikman broke his ankle he was shredding Johnson’s Hurricaines
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
Was Jimmy anti-Aikman?
Why else does he burn another # 1 pick on Walsh?
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Jimmy got like 3 or 4 picks for Walsh from NO
a pretty nice haul
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
That's right
I remember reading that in the Boys Will Be Boys Book. However, they painted Jimmy as being indecisive regarding Walsh & Aikman; I just wanted know if there was more to it than that.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
He was never anti-Aikman
He had an opportunity to get 2 #1 picks and knew once he made his choice on the future QB he could trade the other
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
I thought Jimmy got a 1st, 2nd and 3rd for Walsh
The only prefect science is hindsight............Lock n Load
If Peyton isn't going to be healthy why should they eat his contract beyond the March deadline?
Opportunity to draft a successor to Peyton who happens to be hands down the best QB prospect since Peyton doesn’t come along every single year. Peyton can’t play forever.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
This is a really interesting draft and FA situation to me
Think of all the factors shaping their strategy:
- The need to take advantage of the window they have with players like Romo, Witten and Ware. That argues for key pieces through FA, although certain positions like CB and DL seem to do a little better as rookies than O-line, S and LB.
- Because O-linemen usually require seasoning (rookies don’t do as well), that might argue for leaning more heavily on FA, at least for one interior lineman.
- Economics argues for drafting with a greater consideration of need – rookies are significantly cheaper, and for at least 3 years they stay that way.
- Long-term thinking argues for drafting BPAs with less consideration of need.
- Self-scouting is the big unknown. We know they arent happy with the secondary and interior O-line, but we don’t know which parts they think they have an answer for. We also don’t know how much is enough – you can afford one weaker link on o-line as long as the rest are very solid, but you can’t afford two or more. Secondary is roughly the same.
I’ll be fascinated to see how they balance all of this….
Don't believe everything you think.
I think the optimal FA/ draft scenario is this:
A team fills all the holes in its roster each offseason with serviceable, affordable free agents, so that they aren’t hamstrung at any position during the draft.
This allows them to take the BPA, thus maximizing the talent on the roster.
Given their recent forays into free agency, it seems as if Dallas is indeed pursuing this strategy. The problem? It only works if you draft well…
Yep
well said, and there is going to be some growning pains when you switch over to that strategy.
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
Jason Jones is sort of like Coples
and you don’t have to spend a draft choice on him.
What is it fans see in Jones? Does his game translate to playing 5-technique 3-4 DE?
He’s averaged just under 4 sacks a season, and was playing a 3-technique DT in a 4-3 front for three of those four years (He played a 4-3 DE for the first time this past season).
from RotoWorld:
“Jones struggled in first-year DL coach Tracy Rocker’s scheme after being forced from tackle to end. It’s possible that he’ll be one of the better values on the 2012 free agent market. Only 25 years old, Jones has shown the ability to be one of the league’s top three-technique defensive tackles. He played that position for Jeff Fisher from 2008-2010, and may draw interest from the Rams.”
Jason Jones
6-5 275 4.7
His best football is still ahead of him.
Compare his upside to that of Billy Winn or Jared Crick.
Billy Winn 4.0 sacks against college competition.
But anyway
Mario Williams ,
Cliff Avril
Calis Campbell are all better than Jones I agree
After that who is better than Jones among FA Defensive Ends?
And if you don’t get Williams . Campbell , Avril , or Jones then what is to be done about the
Demarcus Ware against the league pass rush?
Just accept it?
If you don’t like something don’t just accept it.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:26 PM CST up reply actions
I think Carl Nicks is a must!
He’s only 26 years old. He is a proven commodity in the NFL. It’s worth it to pay him to shore up the interior of our OL so we can either focus completely on DEF in the draft or decide to splurge on the OL and have a dominant force in the interior for years to come.
So if there is a single FA I’m hoping we sign above all others this offseason, it would have to be Carl Nicks.
"You try and work hard and get better each week. I play the game with passion. I enjoy the game. It's a lot of fun when I'm out there. That's the way I play. For some reason, people like that." - Tony Romo
Hopefully Callahan will give us an edge on him
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
OK Carl Nicks Free Agent
Trade up get Quinton Coples 1 3 4 5 6 7
Best CB we can get in round 2
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:33 AM CST up reply actions
we shouldn't have to give up that much
Couples looks to Fall to around #10…which would cost 1. 3. and 6
Here’s a theoretical play from 2010: Snap. Tony takes 7 step drop. Tony looks left at Miles, who is doubled, and looks right to where Roy Williams should be…but instead sees Colombo on his back and a Defensive End foaming at the mouth jumping over Marc’s carcass. Tony proceeds to run like hell and look for Witten
-by CotySaxman on Jul 11, 2011 7:50 AM PDT
Now, if somebody doesn’t agree with that, that’s cool. I also don’t agree with the fact that I don’t have $10 million in my bank account. But the fact that I don’t agree with it doesn’t make it any less true.
by One.Cool.Customer on Dec 23, 2010 12:00 AM PST
by I am Ironman!!! on Jan 26, 2012 8:49 AM CST up reply actions
Man that's crazy
we got way too many holes to be trading away all of our drafts picks just for one guy
Hey Washington... D.C. stands for Dallas Cowboys
Jerry the GM…if we could only find a way to get rid of that guy…
Twitter: @silva918
We need pass rush and push at the line
Coples could give us both
Coples = two needs filled
Carl Nicks = another need filled
Since we take Coples we keep Anthony Spencer.
another need if not filled not created.
CB fills another need
The Cowboys are are better team.
The Cowboys need impact players more than depth or JAGS.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
wow....and what happens if one of our impact players gets hurt....
oh right…we’ll have to play one of the UDFA’s we pick up after round 2 is over….
no depth…no safety cushion in case someone falters or doesn’t pan out in free agency…..then if coples turns into the unmotivated player that people have concerns about then you get to trash jerry for wasting all those draft picks on one player…..wow…sometimes i’m really glad some people are just fans….THIS ISN"T MADDEN!!!!!
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 9:52 PM CST up reply actions
If impact players get hurt then we have a big problem.
It doesn’t mean that it is better to have JAG +depth than an impact player.
The Giants beat the Cowboys cause they can pass rush better than we can.
And if Coples is really good better than the players we drafted then we just say we never had a chance at him.
There are consequences for doing things
There are also consequences for not doing things.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:39 PM CST up reply actions
Coples is a 4-3 pass rushing DE, like a Peppers, Tuck, or Osi.
He would be a square peg in a round hole playing DE in the 3-4
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
I mean I'm sure he'd be good in Dallas
But there’s also a bust potential, sort of a Gholston situation in Dallas. Let a 43 team draft him.
He wouldn't be good as a 3-4 DE
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
He's pushing 290
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Bruce Smith played end in a 3-4.
The 3-4 ought not control what the Cowboys do.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:26 AM CST up reply actions
I think he absolutely would be. He weighs seven pounds less than JJ Watt.
He is going to have the burst at that size that only a handful of players (including JJ Watt) do. Sounds like a perfect 5-technique to me.
In addition, scouts actually suspect that he has lost weight to get down to 281 lbs. Most thought he was playing around 290 lbs. this past year. Coples has the size, strength, and burst to be a great 5-technique.
It doesn’t really matter though because there is no way he is dropping to #14.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
I do understand your point.
And that Gholston situation is a good reason to stay away from Coples.
It worries me too.
I think it is a good reason. It is also IMHO the one and only reason why the Cowboys ought not to trade up to get Coples.
Except for the “Gholston nightmare” there is no other reason not to break the draft trading up to get Coples.
If we had a real defensive end we could get by with the NT we have. We could get by with Spencer at OLB .
If we had a real defensive end it would solve or cover up all the front seven problems the Cowboys have. Including of course the DeMarcus Ware against the league pass rush.
The again the Gholston nightmare scares me too.
That is what is good about DeCastro.
though if you get DeCastro we ought to get a DE in FA.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:25 AM CST up reply actions
you can find a way to use him
Charles Haley worked great out of both the 3-4 and the 4-3.
If you got Coples and Ware you move them both back and forth between LB and DE.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
It's easier to switch from 3-4 to 4-3
Because as a 4-3 end you only kob is to get after the QB. In the 3-4 there’s a possibility you can be asked to srop back into pass coverage.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
If the Cowboys got Coples or Mario Williams we just play the 3-4 with one more down lineman
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:29 PM CST up reply actions
you move him all around .
We ought not be a slave to the 3-4 , 4-3
If we get Coples we could play 5-2-4
always rush 5
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:18 AM CST up reply actions
The Cowboys really really a real DE . If they get one Spencer will be much better
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 11:15 AM CST up reply actions
draft Jared Crick in the 2nd rd
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Jared Crick has his limitations. He is not JJ Watt.
Jared Crick I think of him as a third round pick.
I think Jason Jones has more upside
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:32 PM CST up reply actions
Wow
New level of stupid. Congradulations. People said it couldnt be done. That yours was a record that would live on in infamy. The sole owner of the worst thought dared to be put to pen. But there you go. Being an inovator. Proving the nay sayers wrong. Breaking the unbrakable.
For this I salute you!
by Proxy406 on Jan 26, 2012 12:34 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
We had a 3 player draft in 2010
Complaining?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:39 PM CST up reply actions
Here I thought we had a 6 player draft in 2010.
1 (24) Dez Bryant WR Okla. St.
2 (55) Sean Lee LB Penn St.
4 (126) Akwasi Owusu-Ansah DB Indiana, Pa
6 (196) Jamar Wall DB Texas Tech
6 (179) Sam Young OT Notre Dame
7 (234) Sean Lissemore DT William & Mary
by Rena on Jan 26, 2012 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
really be interesting if we could have seen what AOA could have done at CB
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 9:55 PM CST up reply actions
AOA man...
I wanted him too but Jerry took a gamble and it didn’t work out. Oh well, sh*t happens, right? He was a 4th round pick, probably would have waited until the 6th or the 5th personally, but ehh…life goes on.
Akwasi Owusu-Ansah DB Indiana, Pa
6 (196) Jamar Wall DB Texas Tech
6 (179) Sam Young OT Notre Dame
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 11:28 AM CST up reply actions
Holy crap you seriously need to post before you think.
The amount of blatant factual errors you post is astounding.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
You can't say we had a three player draft when we clearly picked six guys.
And, if you were trying to say that we only picked up three guys worth anything, then I would suggest you think about how Sean Lissmore fits into what you have been advocating on here.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Coples
+
best corner available
+
and the best Guard we can get in F/A
+
Keep Spencer
Okay what are we like in 2012
I got Coples a CB and a guard
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:42 PM CST up reply actions
I try to ingnore it but the coments are just so slap you in the face stupid
That i just am forced into commenting.
Let it be know that Proxy has zero histroy or anything at all to back up anything he says.
He likes Billy Winn and Jared Crick and thinks they will solve the Cowboys DE problem
Let it also be know that Wes Bunting
which NFL teams are good fits for each.
1. DE Quinton Coples: North Carolina (6-6, 285)
Possesses the ideal build for a defensive lineman and the game really comes easy to him. He showcases the ability to overpower on contact, be sudden laterally and uses his length well to shed. If he can keep his motor running on high, he looks like a top-five caliber talent.
which NFL teams are good fits for each.
1. DE Quinton Coples: North Carolina (6-6, 285)
Possesses the ideal build for a defensive lineman and the game really comes easy to him. He showcases the ability to overpower on contact, be sudden laterally and uses his length well to shed. If he can keep his motor running on high, he looks like a top-five caliber talent.
so in other words I got a top five talent by trading 3. 4 5 6 7
that would be a pretty good deal .
At least by the draft points
Of course that stuff doesn’t matter to Proxy. Points don’t matter history doesn’t matter.
Proxy never has and has never had any evidence or history to back up a single opinion of his.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 11:36 AM CST up reply actions
You are ridiculous.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
You are ridiculous.
go tell it to Wes Bunting. He actually gets paid to write draft previews.
If Coples is a top 5 talent – Wes Bunting now said he is .
than an extra 3 4 5 67 would not get you enough points to go from 14 to 5 .
http://www.sportznutz.com/nfl/draft/draft_point_value_chart.htm
so if you got into the top 5 with those picks it would be considered a very good deal.
You are ridiculous.
That is your opinion , It is not backed up by anything substantial right it is just your opinon..
By the way do still think the Ricky Wiliiams trade was bad?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:45 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah that trade was horrible.
I mean the Saints owner thought so too considering he sacked Ditka after the season.
And while my opinion is just that, an opinion, I would say it’s respected way more than yours is. There is a reason for that.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Tell us why Jared Crick and Billy Winn are better than Coples.
On drafting the only thing that matters is results .
I wasn’t one of the lets trade down from nine people last year.
Draft the Proxy way and get a team full of JAGS
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:36 PM CST up reply actions
Have you studied NFL history at all?
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Or better phrased, are you knowledgeable about NFL history at all?
If so, how does trading huge amounts of picks for one player usually work out?
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Dallas Cowboy drafts
1979 – 1987
That is what happen when you just accept things the way they are.
In 1977 the Cowboys traded up. How did that work out?
History.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:40 PM CST up reply actions
Correlation and causation. Learn the difference.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Look JAGS are almost the same as busts
Put it another way.
one Quinton Coples is better than both Crick & Wynn
Anyway
Show that the Ricky Williams trade was bad.
Cause I just looked it up.
In Williams place #12 the Bears drafted Cad McNown
So you tell us that the trade was bad .
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:47 PM CST up reply actions
Yet another factual error on your part.
The Redskins were in on the trade as well and netted Champ Bailey and Lavar Arrington.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Which became Lavarr Arrington and Clinton Portis following the 2003 season
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Lavar Arrington.
- overall
nothing to do with that .
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:47 PM CST up reply actions
- overall nothing to do with it
Lavar Arrington.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:47 PM CST up reply actions
Lavar Arrington.
- 2 over all 2000 draft
Williams # 5 overall
Champ Balley # 7 overall in the 1999 draft. Nothing to do with it. since New Orleans was at 12.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:52 PM CST up reply actions
In the Catch by Garry Myers the Cowboy have LT rated number one. They want to trade up but aren’t willing to pay the price.
The Giants get LT
We get Howard Richards.
How did that work out
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:41 PM CST up reply actions
Busts don’t hurt you
and Jags are almost as bad as busts
The only thing that hurts is missing out on a great player
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:42 PM CST up reply actions
This literally makes no sense
since the opportunity of drafting a bust is missing out on a good or great player.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
*opportunity cost
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
most late round picks don’t amount to anything better than a JAG
So If I trade up to draft GI JOE and he busts
and even if the players that I traded away don’t bust but turn out to be JAGs and players that contribute to depth.
I didn’t lose that much.
The thing that counts is missing out on stars when draft day comes.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:33 PM CST up reply actions
i dare you to go tell that to Ratliff.....
tell me how that goes
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 9:56 PM CST up reply actions
great exception.
How many other fifth ,sixth ,and seventh, round picks have the Cowboys hit on?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:53 PM CST up reply actions
It's called opportunity cost. Learn it.
Your math is all off.
Let’s say we trade up and grab Coples. The team that we trade with takes Melvin Ingram and drafts relative JAGs with the other picks.
Here is what the equation looks like:
Coples = the opportunity to pick the best available player at 6 different slots
Now, let’s say Coples is great. However, let’s say that there were good and great players to be had in rounds 1, 3, and 4 (which is actually quite likely). The cost doesn’t line up since you could have sat in place and grabbed three good/great players instead of just one. For Coples to justify that kind of cost, he has to be a perennial pro-bowler since it is pretty much guaranteed that there would have been a few future pro bowlers available in those rounds we got out of. That is a tall order and fails often due to all the things that can undo a player (injuries, work ethic, etc.). There are too many variables to go all in like that. And, if he busts, you have set your team back as badly as the 2009 draft did to us.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
The 2009 draft is underappreciated
My guess is that it got Wade fired at least a year earlier than he would have otherwise….
Don't believe everything you think.
excellent point
Lifelong Cowboys Fan from the Swamps of Jersey
My Beer Blog: http://tiltingsuds.wordpress.com/
I would love to show you the finer points to a muay thai clinch whipped knee to the face seanrude
by matt575 on Nov 22, 2011 3:09 AM EST
Haha great point.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
It depends.
If you get Coples you sign Nicks and you keep Spencer.
You also can get a CB in round 2 .
That is 3 needs filled.
If we don’t get Coples , Jason Jones, Mario Williams, Campbell or Avril then we ought to pretty much accept that we are not going to be any better at DE next season. There are other DE we could draft but they all either don’t pass rush , are limited athletically , or don’t have lower body strength.
Spencer is not the ideal but if we had a DE we would not need to replace him.
.There are too many variables to go all in like that. And, if he busts, you have set your team back as badly as the 2009 draft did to us
Sure but if we get JAGs we are not much worse off than if we drafted Coples and he busted.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:08 PM CST up reply actions
Dallas Cowboy drafts 1978 to 1987
How is that for standing back and doing nothing. How did that work out.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:43 PM CST up reply actions
2009 draft
In 2009 the Cowboys had more selections than any other team.
How did that work out?
NFL HISTORY
RECENT HISTORY
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:46 PM CST up reply actions
RECENT HISTORY
in 2010 Cowboys trade up not once but twice
Get DEZ and LEE
How did that work out??
Then there was Sam Young ,Jamar Wall, and AOA.
How did that work out?
In 2011 The Cowboys don’t trade down ( despite 60-70% of the participants on Bloggingtheboys calling for it) And the Cowboys got Tyron Smith.
Remember Mario Williams would have been worth every player the Cowboys selected in 2006 , 2007, 2008, and 2009.
How is that for History???
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 2:06 PM CST up reply actions
How about doing stuff they way everyone else does?
How does that usually work out?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 2:10 PM CST up reply actions
You didn't answer my question at all.
You just went on a schizophrenic rant with a bunch of non-sequiturs, and some things that honestly that don’t make sense at all.
Once again, what does history show about teams who trade large amounts of picks for one player?
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
by Creasy729 on Jan 26, 2012 2:15 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
*honestly don't make sense at all
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
1985 49ers trade picks 1 (28) 2 3
to trade up to # 16 in the first round
How did that work out??
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 2:28 PM CST up reply actions
I didn't ask for one instance. I asked for what the general history shows.
I’m glad Jerry Rice got three picks traded for him. You advocated trading six picks for Quinton Coples. Understand the difference.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
The 49ers paid more with points 1 2 3
1 3 4 5 6 7
I preserve the second
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 2:46 PM CST up reply actions
So do you think that Coples is so historically good
that we should sacrifice all opportunities to add more players in the draft (save a second) to draft him? And not only that, but do you think there is also no chance we could get a great player staying still at #14?
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
If we lose out on Sam Young or Jamar Wall it doesn’t matter.
I know this.
If the Cowboys have a real DE and a CB the defense will be the way it ought to be.
I don’t like the DEs after round one.
I like Coples a lot more than Crick or Wynn,.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 3:55 PM CST up reply actions
Do you think every mid and late round pick
necessarily turns into Sam Young or Jamar Wall?
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
most of them, or JAGS
The only thing that matter is missing out on a great player.
Stars are so much more important than JAGS or Depth.
A star is worth a lot of depth
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:21 PM CST up reply actions
You do realize that by trading up you can miss out on a lot of players right?
Or does that just go right over your head?
Think about all the people on this board who lament what we could have had if the RW trade never happened.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
sure it is not more likely than if you don’t trade up.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:10 PM CST up reply actions
If we add Carl Nicks
We won’t have money to sign Mario Williams
We need a DE and a CB or our defense is going to suck next year.
There is zero chance the Cowboys are going anywhere with this defense next season or the season after that.
My prefered off season is
Sign Mario Williams/ Calis Campbell
1 DeCastro
2 Jenkins
3 Chandler Jones.
If we don’t do something then it is the end of the DeMarcus and Tony Romo era
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 4:00 PM CST up reply actions
I don’t know.
I do know that if we have defensive end we can cover up Spencer.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:37 PM CST up reply actions
Though Revis was not the first defensive back selected in the draft (LaRon Landry, who was selected by the Washington Redskins, was the first), he was the first cornerback taken that year.1314 The New York Jets traded their first-round selection, the first of their second-round selections and their fifth-round selection to the Carolina Panthers for the chance to move from the 25th pick to the 14th pick, one slot ahead of Revis’ hometown Pittsburgh Steelers.13 With their selection, the Jets drafted Revis.13 Revis missed the first 21 days of training camp over a contract dispute however he eventually came to an agreement with the team on August 15, 2007.15
[edit]Rookie season
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 2:49 PM CST up reply actions
Herschel Walker, Ricky Williams, and Eli Manning are easy conterexamples.
Plus, the Revis example is still a lesser example of a trade in my opinion than the Coples one.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Eli was a good move.
Ricky Williams was an 1,800 yard back.
That wasn’t a bad trade either.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 3:53 PM CST up reply actions
No it wasn't.
Philip Rivers was, until this year, considered the clearly better player. Considering that and the other picks give up, that was not a good trade overall.
And the Ricky Williams trade was absolutely horrific because he had that year with his second year. Ask Mike Ditka if he would make that trade again.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Who was drafted with the picks from the Williams trade?
If all a team lost out on some JAGS then it doesn’t matter.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:19 PM CST up reply actions
Phillip Rivers has been to the Superbowl how many times?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:26 PM CST up reply actions
Rivers not going to the big game
has nothing to do with Rivers. This is an old, lame argument with no basis in logic or fact.
Don't believe everything you think.
Well by that logic you obviously think he is better than Romo
considering he has been to the AFC title game.
That is a really lame argument on your part. I can’t say I’m surprised.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Romo is Romo
Rivers is Rivers.
Before this season Rivers has been a little better.
Most people would have agreed.
But I am not a Romo basher.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:12 PM CST up reply actions
Actually the Williams trade was a very good trade .
The guy drafted in Williams place was Cad McNown
a QB bust.
For a guy who tells someone to study NFL history you don’t know it that well.
So was it a bad trade?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:51 PM CST up reply actions
Yes. The Saints threw all their picks away for a RB that was off their team in a few years.
And you are wrong. The Saints traded with the Redskins and the Bears to make it work. You know who the Redskins got in that draft as a result? Champ Bailey and Lavar Arrington. Case Closed. Study some more.
But you really need to study is economics. The fact that the Redskins got those guys isn’t even the point. The point is that by doing that trade, the Saints cost themselves the opportunity to pick other players they might have liked and might have turned into real stars. Would they have? Maybe, maybe not. The Saints never got to find out though and all for one RB. That is the definition of a stupid decision.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
Skins flipped Champ Bailey for Clinton Portis a few yrs later.
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
Yeah but I'm not sure how that relates here.
Bailey was way more successful in Washington than Williams ever was in N.O.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
But the Redskins didn’t draft Baily or Lavar Arrington. with the Saints pick.
The Saints picks was used to draft a bust QB.
If the Saints had not made the trade. and had kept their pick and taken Cade McNown
they would have been worse off.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:15 PM CST up reply actions
At any rate the Saints paid much much more for Williams than I am offering for Coples.
Head coach Mike Ditka traded all of the Saints’ 1999 draft picks to get Williams, as well as a 1st and 3rd pick the following year.
Had it just been the picks in the 1999 draft it would have been the right choice. Easy
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:18 PM CST up reply actions
The Giants weren’t hurt much by trading up for Eli
At any rate. Besides I think it is kind of unfair that you compare teams that paid much , much more than I offered.
Saints for Ricky Williams
1 2 3 4567 1999
+1 and 3 2000
The Giants also paid more than 2 number ones
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:26 PM CST up reply actions
And Atlanta gave up the farm last year for a WR.
How did that turn out? They have a worse record than last year, scored less points, gave up more points, and their high powered O failed to score at all in their playoff game.
In exchange for getting the sixth pick, Atlanta gave the Browns five draft picks : their 1st- (27th overall), second- (59th) and fourth-round (124th) picks this year and their first- and fourth-round picks in 2012.
Yeah that was an absolutely terrible trade haha.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
I am not paying anywhere near that price. BTW
you don’t know anything about that trade until we know who Atlanta misses out on.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:53 PM CST up reply actions
no Just our 1, 3, 4, 5, and 6
thats completely different. Your right, sorry for mocking you.
How do i do sarcasm font again?
Remember Proxy thinks that Jared Crick and / Billy Winn will solve the cowboys problems at DE.
He thinks they are better pass rushers than Coples.
You know Proxy you sure talk a lot for a guy who has zero evidence or history to back up any of your football theories.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:00 PM CST up reply actions
You shouldn't talk that much yourself.
You didn’t even know the rules about freshman in the draft.
If I had a nickel for every Super Bowl the Eagles have won, I would have zero nickels.
who cares about our 3 4 5 & 6 if we hit on Coples.the only thing that is important is if he busts or not.
So miss out on Jamar Wall, Sam Young, Josh Thomas and Alan Ball.
Proxy was probably all happy when the Cowboys drafted Bobby Carpenter.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:04 PM CST up reply actions
I never said Winn and Crick were better than Coples
I said That i liked them as picks in the second round. I think that they are certainly safer, and those two players could certainly provide pass rush aid.
and I would certianly rather have
Ingram + Win/Crick/T’ammu/ etc, than just Coples.
Will Coples Bust? who Know’s, certainly not you., or I for that matter. Is his chance of busting higher than say Melvin Ingram, or Nick Perry, or a variety of other maybe LESS TALENTED Players, I certainly think so.
Is everyone besides Coples a Jag? NO, one more time NO.
Go back to the Mario Williams draft your so fond of. The Texans had two options they were considering, Mario Williams who everyone thought would be good, and Vince young Who’s ceiling was astronomical, but like Couples had Drive and Character concerns,
How about Payton Manning Vs. Leaf, the better PHYSICAL prospect? probably Leaf, but guess how that worked out?
For every Randy Moss in the world there are 5 other Carlos Rogers, oh and by the way the same concerns Dallas had about Moss plagued him through out his career.
The chips are stacked against Coples, and he May be good, he may even be great, but he has a Sisyphus-esque journey to get to that point, and I sure as hell am not going to advocate for him, nor should you expect much support from this board.
But hey since your so fond of saying I have no correct pick, or credibility, I guess we’ll see. If coples pan’s out? I’ll make a new Handle JSterns_Whipping_boy, seems only fair, I have given you enough greef, might as well lay some cards on the table.
You willing to do the same?
How about Payton Manning Vs. Leaf, the better PHYSICAL prospect? probably Leaf, but guess how that worked out?
They did not have the blog back than.
Save your handle. I wouldn’t ask you to do that.
Neither Wynn nor Crick are talented enough to fundamentally change the Cowboys pass rush.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:33 PM CST up reply actions
Carlos Rogers,
Don’t use that example cause he is just big not fast. No one would have ever thought he would rush the passer.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:29 PM CST up reply actions
With all due respect.
It is a DE versus a WR
Besides we would be paying much less
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 6:18 PM CST up reply actions
Let it also be know that Wes Bunting
which NFL teams are good fits for each.
1. DE Quinton Coples: North Carolina (6-6, 285)
Possesses the ideal build for a defensive lineman and the game really comes easy to him. He showcases the ability to overpower on contact, be sudden laterally and uses his length well to shed. If he can keep his motor running on high, he looks like a top-five caliber talent.
which NFL teams are good fits for each.
1. DE Quinton Coples: North Carolina (6-6, 285)
Possesses the ideal build for a defensive lineman and the game really comes easy to him. He showcases the ability to overpower on contact, be sudden laterally and uses his length well to shed. If he can keep his motor running on high, he looks like a top-five caliber talent.
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/football/nfl/01/26/senior.bowl.top.10.prospects/index.html#ixzz1kgHBwjiu
getting a top five talent by trading 3. 4 5 6 7
would be a pretty good deal .
At least by the draft points
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/football/nfl/01/26/senior.bowl.top.10.prospects/index.html#ix
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 11:39 AM CST up reply actions
I offered you my terms above, you want to put some skin in the game meet me at my wager.
Wes Bunting also pointed out the same motor and character concerns that will likely plague Couples his entire career. The key word in the quote you just plucked, is IF.
As in “If he can keep his motor running on high, he looks like a top-five caliber talent.”
Just like If albert haynesworth wasn’t a head case he’d be a HOF caliber player.
If Charlos Rodgers didnt eat himself out of the league Matt millen wouldnt have been fired.
If Vince young wasnt a head case he’d would be a very good quarter back, like Jamarcus Russle and Ryan leaf. Oh wait no they have drive motor and character concerns two.
Oh wait but how aboutIf T.O wasn’t a QB killer he’d still be a cowboy or in the NFL for that matter,
Couples Bust chance is probably 2x that of a normal prospect.
I have already said the kid is talented. No one disputes that, he much like your self is incredibly stupid. He dosent work hard, and he take plays off.
I would rather take a chance, beacuse yes that is in fact what you do in the draft, take chances; on a player who is similarly talented say like a Ingram, Perry, or Decastro, with a lower chance of busting. Who is a RKG, and who i dont have to constantly ask I wonder if he’s giving 100% what would that look like, how good would he be then?
he much like your self is incredibly stupid. He dosent work hard, and he take plays off.
Why cause you say so.
Again by the points it is a legit deal. If you think otherwise I suggest you tell Wes Bunting that Coples isn’t a top five guy.
At any rate I already said the only way we go for Coples is if we go for Nicks in FA
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 6:59 PM CST up reply actions
if Coples busts but all the other players that we miss out are no better than JAGS then we aren’t hurt.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 7:19 PM CST up reply actions
how did atlanta's decision to lose their draft this past year and this year for one Julio Jones turn out
guess they would have liked a little more defense after all cuz all those picks for one WR to increase their offensive playmaking really turned out well…….
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 9:58 PM CST up reply actions
The way to find out is see who the Browns took with the Falcons picks and see if they are good or not.
We don’t know how Atlanta’s decision turned out.
If Julio Jones has Dez Bryant type of talent and catches 80 passes for 1,100 years then we can say it worked out.
Even Dez hasn’t done that yet.
If he doesn’t perform like that then it was a bad trade.
If the guy you trade for ends up in the pro bowl year in and year out then the trade was a good idea. If they are not that type of player then the trade didn’t work out.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 27, 2012 2:26 PM CST up reply actions
And I was?
Prove it. You like to keep saying that, go find a quote saying pass on Tyron and move down.
anyway Proxy what are the Cowboys going to do about the DeMarcus Ware against the league pass rush?
We going to the Superbowl with the defense as it is Proxy?
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 1:38 PM CST up reply actions
No we're clearly no, we're also not 1 player away from the Ravens defense.
Just because they get drafted in rounds 2-7 dosent make them Jags. Shit just because they aren’t drafted dosent make them JAG’s
This team needs TALENT, and lots of it. That what the draft is, acquisition of TALENT, does it all pan out? No. Does it pan out Immediately? no. But if you are constantly adding TALENT to your roster your TEAM will improve.
Teams NEED role players, they do. Not everyone on the 49er’s was a star, they have Talent surrounded by key role players.
Since you cannot see the future, and infact guarantee that couples is Bruce Smith, all you are doing is taking a monumental risk at the expense of the necessary acquisition of talent.
Not only are you taking a risk but on a PROSPECT, that has questions about his passion and drive.
Is Couples Talented? Sure, absolutely! Could he play like a HOF sure, will he? I am sure not willing to bet my TEAM on it.
That’s what people are objecting to. No one wants to Draft Jag’s. No one is creating a a petition for the Cowboys to have an all scrub draft. No one on this board wants that.
The draft is a process, acquiring talent is a process, and no PROSPECT is worth circumventing that process; because at the end of the day what you are drafting is a lottery ticket, one that you hope like hell cashes out, but one that is certainly not guaranteed to do so.
No we’re clearly no, we’re also not 1 player away from the Ravens defense.
Just because they get drafted in rounds 2-7 dosent make them Jags. Shit just because they aren’t drafted dosent make them JAG’s
No we are two. Give me Mario Willams (Coples ) and Jenkins and our defense is better than theirs
This team needs TALENT, and lots of it. That what the draft is, acquisition of TALENT, does it all pan out? No. Does it pan out Immediately? no. But if you are constantly adding TALENT to your roster your TEAM will improve.
the more talent the better. Nevertheless two or three defensive players. We can match them.
Teams NEED role players, they do. Not everyone on the 49er’s was a star, they have Talent surrounded by key role players.
A superstar defensive player is a lot more valuable then having role players or even depth.
Since you cannot see the future, and infact guarantee that couples is Bruce Smith, all you are doing is taking a monumental risk at the expense of the necessary acquisition of talent.
No , if Coples busts but the players that we lost out end up no better than JAGS then we have lost nothing.
If Coples is a a bust or a JAG and we miss out on a great player then by all means it was a terrible player.
But if Coples is a bust and we lose out on both Billy Winn and Jared Crick but they turn out to be less than Pro Bowl players just ok starters like AJ Hawk then we have lost much.
Not only are you taking a risk but on a PROSPECT, that has questions about his passion and drive.
Is Couples Talented? Sure, absolutely! Could he play like a HOF sure, will he? I am sure not willing to bet my TEAM on it.
It depends if he is PRO BOWL and we just get some solid starters in his place then we lost just much as if we drafted busts.
That’s what people are objecting to. No one wants to Draft Jag’s. No one is creating a a petition for the Cowboys to have an all scrub draft. No one on this board wants that.
The draft is a process, acquiring talent is a process, and no PROSPECT is worth circumventing that process; because at the end of the day what you are drafting is a lottery ticket, one that you hope like hell cashes out, but one that is certainly not guaranteed to do so.
that is just not true.
While there is a consequence for doing something .
There is also a consequence for not doing something.
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 26, 2012 8:14 PM CST up reply actions
Carl Nicks has to be number one if the Saints don't franchise him
I’d like him and one of the CBs on the market. That’s realistically about all we could afford, but it fills our two biggest holes, leaving us more freedom to go BPA in the draft.
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
Brees won't get franchised
He’ll just get paid. Colston? Ehh, he’s good, but replaceable. There’s lots of FA WRs, and Floyd, Jeffery, and Kendall Wright in the draft. The Saints also have other dudes on the depth chart.
yeah Colston and Meachum are replaceable
and I don’t know the hit they’ll take if Nicks is franchised. It’s rumored that he wants to leave anyway, but I can see Brees pushing to keep Nicks. It’d be awesome to woo him over to America’s Team.
"How 'Bout them Cowboys!"---Jimmy Johnson
"...and the Cowboys...STUN the Bills!"--ESPN MNF
plus colston has had injury issues the past couple of years....
he may not command as much on the open market as he feels he’s due…
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:00 PM CST up reply actions
Arguably the biggest need is the secondary but...
There are no real top flight options available to the Cowboys. Grimes and Finnegan will be paid in the 10 to 8 mil range, that is overpaying IMO. No top flight corners will likely be available at 14 either (even Kirpatrick has his doubters).
The corner class does have depth. Brandon Carr and Terrel Thomas have potential and may be reasonably priced. Tim Jennings and Jason Allen could be sleepers. Dwight Lowry is a nice S/CB hybrid who could replace Ball. There is also plenty of depth in the draft.
The safety class is even thinner, but it should not be too difficult to upgrade on Abe Elam. Lots of teams are hurting there. Either way, going with quantity over quality, IMO is the way to go this year.
I think the corner we will pick up with be
that 25 yr old that made the P Manning pic in teh SB, his name escapes me…..but NO has alot of folks to resign this Offseason
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
Thats him
Thanks
He who laughs last, thinks slowest
The Weather is here, I wish you were beautiful"
Indecision, may or may not be my problem
in the past we had 0 money now we do..
We can sign 1 big time agent
by lostar2009 on Jan 26, 2012 9:12 AM CST via mobile reply actions
Biggest need is in Secondary
no pass rush can get there if the QB is throwing against air…. but CBs cost too much. An affordable Safety I can see coming in, but CBs are rarely affordable.
check out my bands nanoSMASH and Day vs Night
i could see us going after Griffin from Tenn...
that would relieve us of having to draft one this year….then all we would have to concentrate on is pass rush, CB, offensive line….
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:01 PM CST up reply actions
Free agency
Is going to be fun. Stephen Jones has hinted we’re going to spend money, and JJ has hinted we’re going to see a lot of new players. Nothing the Cowboys have done so far has been dissappointing. I believe that will continue.
by BrickTop on Jan 26, 2012 9:52 AM CST via mobile reply actions
Jerry didn't hint FA's in the secondary, he just said new faces back there next year.
I expect a FA, maybe 2 and some draft picks. Probably as the story said, mid priced FA’s.
if he doesn't get tagged by the ravens I could see us going after Webb from the Ravens....
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:02 PM CST up reply actions
Who are the pro-bowl CBs for the Giants and Patriots?
the packers have good CBs but without a pass rush any QB can stand around and wait for a receiver to get open
You need an O-line and a pass rush. The Giants lost like 5 CBs this year and they are in the Superbowl, Patriots have the worst D in the league but Wilford dominates games with inside pass rush.
The contact that takes place when our defense is on the field is very sincere ~ Les Miles
Dirk Nowitzki's Flamingo Fade away is this generation's Sky Hook
Totally agree
I think we can find a servicable DB in FA, and draft one in rounds 3 or 4. We don’t necessarily need a Courtland Finnegan or Brent Grimes. Where we really need upgrades is in both the trenches. I would love to draft Markelle Martin in the 2nd as well.
by BrickTop on Jan 26, 2012 10:01 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
dont let stats fool you about the Patriots defense
the offense scores so fast the defense spends a lot of time on the field. they also dont give up many points in the redzone (i think they rank 13th or 14th) which isn’t bad with Brady as QB.
the Patriots defense might bend some but it doesnt break like people think bc everyone looks at yards instead of points.
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth. Sean Lee is a welcomed addition at ILB & Kegabear's prediction about Spencer looks spot on so far.
Devin McCourty? Kyle Arrington?
The Pats have pretty good corners. Besides don’t just look at the SB teams and say “That’s what we need to get!!!” Both teams had some huge flaws and if not for Kyle Williams the Giants are sitting at home.
by Omar Little on Jan 26, 2012 12:25 PM CST up reply actions
By the same token...
If not for a dropped pass by Lee and/or a missed chip shot FG by Cundiff it may have been the Ravens rep’n the AFC.
it helps when one of your CB's isn't playing 10 yards off the WR on a 3rd and 5........
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:03 PM CST up reply actions
Carl Nicks and a DB would be my FA haul
Carl Nicks is young at 26/27 yrs of age, so we can get a proven guard that can be with us for the next 5 yrs. DB free agents like (Grimes or Terrell Thomas). I think our d-line would be much improved with a NT and moving Ratliff back out to end, possibly trade down in first for Poe and get extra picks or Ta’amu later if we stay put and take the consensus pick De’Castro. If we go Poe then with the extra picks go after Guard Osemelye or Glenn in the second as well as pick up DB Minnifield or Gilmore, maybe S Martin (haven’t really looked at him though). We are still aways away from the draft and I’m sure this may change, but regardless I’d really like to see the team get a true 3-4 NT, hopefully we already have one Brent?
i think Nicks would be very expensive to get and eat up most of that cap money this year unless they worked his contract in such a way to take most of the hit next year when we lose the 28mil of dead money on it this year,.,..
i see us going after quantity….not quality this year.,…one or two top FA is not going to make this team a playoff contender next year…..Nicks would be a good solid pickup as it looks right now…but if he doesn’t mesh with the other linemen it would not be worth the money spent….
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:06 PM CST up reply actions
I'd like to see them sign Campbell and either Nicks or Myers, along with re-signing Robinson
Get your LBs, another interior linemen and secondary upgrades in the draft.
In Romo we Trust
i'd like to have Myers at Center & Campbell at DE but i think a NT is more important.
moving Ratliff to DE & draft Sill or Poe to play NT would go a long way helping this defense
Every team has a great gameplan until they get Punched in the Mouth. Sean Lee is a welcomed addition at ILB & Kegabear's prediction about Spencer looks spot on so far.
That won't happen
Ryan likes all of his DL quick, fast and versatile so they can all play any position along the DL.
This idea of a huge 3-4 NT isn’t going to happen as long as Ryan is DC.
In Romo we Trust
Didn't he have Shaun Rogers in Cleveland,
6-4 350lbs?
yeah
I am pretty sure he had bigger NT’s in his other stops too
"I got the 9 on me so I think I'm Romo"
Fabolous
by Archie Barberio on Jan 26, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
you know what sucks
Ryan left the patriots in 2003 to coach the Raiders in 2004, so he just missed out on Vince Wilfork when the Pats drafted him in 2004
that would have been awesome for Ryan to coach Wilfork
"I got the 9 on me so I think I'm Romo"
Fabolous
by Archie Barberio on Jan 26, 2012 11:13 AM CST up reply actions
I know, I wouldn't mind seeing us pick up Poe,
He could be the next Wilfork, that size doesn’t come around often and if he’s the RKG that would be great. I believe our biggest need on the D-Line is NT as I feel Ratliff would be very effective on the end. You seen Wilfork push the pocket on Flacco? Hard to step up into that.
Plus the strength of the Dallas pressure
is from the edge. Adding a force up the middle as well would really help.
Don't believe everything you think.
I'm on board with that, I have said as much in other threads
Might even give Spencer that 1/2 sec he needed so often in the past.
i really want to see what this kid from Regina does...
Akiem Hicks 6-5 324 and precombine has a 4.98 40….really like to see his vertical, short shuttle, and 10 yard numbers compared to some of the other DT’s in this draft….
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:09 PM CST up reply actions
Well he gets to coach Ware.
Can’t feel too bad for him.
by Omar Little on Jan 26, 2012 12:59 PM CST up reply actions
keep signing JAG's Jerry, keep it up bro
"I got the 9 on me so I think I'm Romo"
Fabolous
by Archie Barberio on Jan 26, 2012 10:43 AM CST reply actions
Fa hasnt happened yet, and you're throwing in the towel?
"The tone is business," Garrett said. "Let's get to work. The Giants are going to be at the Meadowlands on Sunday at 4:15. They're an awfully good football team. We have to get ready for them."
not yet
but I am sure to be disappointed like every March
"I got the 9 on me so I think I'm Romo"
Fabolous
by Archie Barberio on Jan 26, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
He didn't like the Sensabaugh and Scandrick signings
I guess since there’s like a thousand better safeties than Sensabaugh, right? As to Scandrick given the propensity of corners to get injured and the pass happy nature of the NFL the 3rd corner is basically becoming a starting position.
by Omar Little on Jan 26, 2012 12:26 PM CST up reply actions
So a few JAGs can't help the team?
What if there were a JAG at Center? Or instead of Newman? Or if Free were even just average?
by Omar Little on Jan 26, 2012 12:27 PM CST up reply actions
most likely
"I got the 9 on me so I think I'm Romo"
Fabolous
by Archie Barberio on Jan 26, 2012 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
This is what will happen
FA C and use the extra money they saved from signing Nicks and put it towards the best D player CB/rusher
Draft DeCastro and take the best D player with their next
Boom Superbowl.
"Obviously, I felt like if I ran into my lineman there it was going to help the play" ~Tony Romo
Or draft DeCastro and Minnifield. Then sign Mario Williams, and Carr!
BOOM Super Bowl.
Unless Eagles and Giants are amazing next year and the Redskins sign Peyton. Then we’re in trouble.
fanshot
i don’t think they are looking at a center in FA…i think they might honestly be looking to draft a center in the 2nd this year…Ben Jones from UGA….granted they were just talking to him at the senior bowl but When you read the scouting report he shows IMO more promise without the risks of Konz
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:11 PM CST up reply actions
How EXACTLY Does
Adding another player in F/A AND the first pick in THIS draft (just like the LAST one FIX THE DEFENSE?!
In order to get to the Super Bowl, they NEED to: Swap sides with Smith and Free in order to get Free BACK to the side he plays WELL, AND “take advantage of Smith’s HUGE upside” that we were told was the REASON they had to have HIM and not TWO players in a trade down, DUMP: Buehler, Marty B., Brookings, Ball, James, Walker, Sensabaugh, and Newman (if the playing injured thing was a cover up) resign Robinson, Fiametta and MORRIS for another year (and trade Felix for whatever draft picks they can get for him). THEN get Nicks, AND either Landry (another F/A not mentioned by the author) and/or Finnegan. In the DRAFT they need to use the first pick on a PASS RUSHER to help Ware! And then look for “depth” in the later rounds.
DeCastro? Humph!
GO COWBOYS! GET SOME BIG D! AH-OOO-AH!
We just paid Sensabaugh so that's not going to happen.
…and Morris? I think I’d stick with Philip Tanner unless I could find an undrafted free agent RB that has more potential.
By the way, what’s is our cap space? $20mil? Can we get Nicks, Landry, and Finnegan for that?
Go read the some of Rafs report over at Cowboys Nation…it gives perspective.
http://www.cowboysnation.com/2012/01/bunting-corners-comprise-core-of-this.html
http://www.cowboysnation.com/2012/01/dallas-biggest-need-sits-front-and.html
http://www.cowboysnation.com/2012/01/best-buy-corners-kc-joyner-scans-free.html
http://www.cowboysnation.com/2012/01/cowboys-free-agency-safety-best-buys.html
Based on his reports, I glean that if Cowboy’s player acquisition department is worth its salt (Judd Garrett), then we should be able to repair our secondary with the upcoming draft/free agency, and not break the bank.
I like his take on improving our interior O line by looking at the lower priced Center market, as opposed to the pricy Guard market.
I’m just one of those fans that wholly believes in building a team through the draft, while only selectively dipping into free agency for short term stop gaps. If a player is good enough to command 10+mil on the open market, I wonder why his former team is even letting him get away?
by CaliFanInTx on Jan 26, 2012 2:01 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
The RB Group
I’m talking about would BE Murray, Tanner and MORRIS (for another year, maybe two) while they get the defense revamped. Trading Felix would help with that too..
No, they PROBABLY won’t be able to get Mario Williams; but Mincey from the Jags MIGHT be a whole different eal. Getting Landry from the Skins PROBABLY won’t happen, but they won’t KNOW if they don’t TRY. (Too bad they got so myopic about Asomugha last year that they let Daniel Manning and Antrel Rolle get away too!)
GO COWBOYS! GET SOME BIG D! AH-OOO-AH!
What's the market for Felix? Can we get a 3rd rounder for him? Maybe a 2nd?
If we could get a Herschel Walker haul for him, hell yes, especially with 1 year left on his contract, but is his value on free agency worth losing him for next year? I don’t see it.
RB is more of a commodity now…keep drafting them…as good as Demarco Murray is…I’m not so sure I would give him a Chris Johnson contract when his rookie contract is up…looked how that worked out for the Titans.
If i was Tenn I would have told Chris Johnson to go sit in his living room for two years instead of giving in to his demands....
after he saw the amount of money he was getting fined for being out becuz he was under contract and refusing to show up to camp I wonder how quickly he would havesigned the Titans original offer…all that gold in his mouth has to have a high maintenance cost…
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:16 PM CST up reply actions
landry is coming off major injury that doesn't have a high success rate of coming all the way back from...
sorry..not the way i want to spend my FA dollars….
Good Luck to the 53. Stand with Honor, Play With Pride. Bring It Home
by TruBluToTheCore on Jan 26, 2012 10:14 PM CST up reply actions
Jeff Saturday in FA ?
Is it wrong to think picking up Saturday in FA a bad thing, if we can get him on a good deal? we have no decent Center, in Costa, Kowlaski or Nagay but if we made a move for Saturday ( we cut Kosier and the other veteran OG we will have no experience on the OL) Saturday could come in help develop one of our young guys as well as call the plays on the OL, or due to his age is he best left alone.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Blogging The Boys
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Terrell Owens cannot be tolerated, even by the Indoor Football League
- Lions must learn how to handle risky players; manage necessary culture change
- Tim Tebow’s absence means Eric Decker can enjoy Denver a little more
- Miami Dolphins agree to do ‘Hard Knocks’
- Alex Smith vs. Cam Newton should be a referendum for Newton’s amazing rookie season
