Season Wrap Up Part 1: Dallas Cowboys Myths Debunked
As I close the book on 2011 for the Dallas Cowboys, there are some topics needing further discussion and scrutiny before we delve too deeply into things like pre-Combine mock drafts and signing 30 Free Agents so Dallas can solve every talent problem overnight and become football's version of the 1927 Yankees. In fact, it's high time we shed light on some widely held, but largely unfounded 'myths' about the Cowboys and replaced them with facts.
Myth: One lockout-shortened year is enough to eradicate the deeply-rooted, flawed culture of the Cowboys
Fact: Culture change is an evolutionary process and it takes time and a certain degree of patience
Having personally led corporate organizational performance turnarounds, some with several hundred employees, my experience (and every book, Harvard Business Review case study and success story I've ever heard of) tells me that there is no "easy button" available to Jerry, Stephen and Jason to make this happen quickly. The uniqueness of the Cowboys situation is that the poor performance which this team has suffered through has extended into every area of the organization. The player personnel has declined to a level unseen since Dave Campo was trying to make Larry Lacewell's drafts pay off, and we know how that worked out. The accountability in the locker room was so absent that players possessed voices louder than their coaches. The offense, defense and special teams all had their own unit-based silos to operate in and there was no cohesion in the team's goal-setting. Let's also not underestimate the fact that any changes the coach(es) wanted to make had to pass through a complex organizational decision-making filter that is unlike any other in the NFL. Only now do Jerry and Stephen combine with Garrett to make up an unlikely Holy Trinity with a more democratic process that looks a lot more like a typical NFL franchise. This isn't like turning a motorcycle, it's more like turning an aircraft carrier.
Opponents will point to turnarounds like the one in San Francisco and it's hard to knock Jim Harbaugh (he was my pick for the opening in Dallas) and what he has accomplished there in a very short time. But SF was the beneficiary of many years of terrible records and top 10-15 picks, and many of their investments were made on offensive and defensive linemen. Over two seasons, they invested high picks on their offensive line and have made it into one of the most highly touted in the league. They had young, solid, if unspectacular, personnel on defense. They don't have an erratic, politicized decision-making process and they just needed a singular personality to rally around. Dallas' problems, as stated, are much more complex and widespread. Garrett needs 2 more years before we will be able to properly judge his performance.
Myth: Rob Ryan is a sub-par Defensive Coordinator
Truth: Schemes can cover up a weakness, but they can't cover up being weak
Ryan has to contend with a dearth of talent at key positions along the defense that have been addressed over the years about as well as the Greek economy has been. Kenyon Coleman was a 5th round pick by the Raiders in 2002, Jason Hatcher was a 3rd rounder in 2006 and Jay Ratliff, who is out of position in a Ryan defense, was a 7th rounder in 2005. Cowboys fans sometimes mistake that group for Vince Wilfork, Ty Warren and Richard Seymour. When they don't see the same kind of pressure from our defensive line that those Patriots generated, they want to be accountable. Unfortunately, that someone ends up being Ryan. Bad drafts can kill a team. The 2009 draft had a boatload of players that were supposed to play roles on the 2011 defense. That didn't work out so well. Blame Ryan. It doesn't matter if he wasn't here or not, blame him. The annual joke that is the Cowboys' glaring hole and thus, the need to draft ANOTHER outside linebacker to pair with DeMarcus Ware is surely Rob Ryan's fault. 2007's 1st round investment in Anthony Spencer hasn't panned out, but it must be Ryan's inability to pound that round peg into the square hole that's the problem here. Sure, that's it. Who cares that he's been here a matter of months and Spencer has been here 5 years (just writing that was painful) and done nothing to fulfill the promise of becoming the kind of bookend pass rusher that we seem to fall prey to every December. With Bradie James hanging on for dear life, the LB's are a 50-50 proposition. How about those DB's? Once the Josh Thomas project ended, we ended up with the usual suspects at CB. I'm not going to waste anyone's time reciting Terrence Newman's inability to turn his body in a space smaller than that of a navy battleship or Mike Jenkins' in-again, out-again, injury history and inconsistent play. The secondary has been and continues to be a known weakness. It's hard to know which unit is going to struggle each week. But we expect this collection of future football legends, that Ryan didn't draft, to play like and be all-pro's.
Guys like Dick LeBeau, Dom Capers and others have been given time to become what we know them as today - defensive masterminds. Along the way, they benefitted from drafting personnel to fit their systems. Pittsburgh has guys like Polamalu, Harrison, Woodley, Taylor, and Hampton. Capers has Clay Matthews, but he also has the best young NT in the game in BJ Raji, AJ Hawk, a budding star in Tramon Williams and an up and comer in Morgan Burnett. Dallas goes barely three deep with top talents on defense and that is if you give more credit to Sean Lee and Jay Ratliff than they are due. Just think how much better this defense would be with the kind of nose tackle (aka the bigger kind) and bona fide pass rushing presence opposite Ware, whether it be a DE or an OLB, to act as the counterpart that almost all of the elite defenses have. How much better would this team be with a playmaking safety that could help mask some of the weaknesses of our CB's? If Ryan only had to cover up for one unit's underperformance, few experts believe that he couldn't do that. But nobody should be expected to cover up weaknesses up front, in the middle and in the secondary. This too needs some time, and maybe even more importantly, some better talent before we formulate a fair assessment.
Myth: Dallas is a contender
Fact: Dallas is building a contender
Last time I checked, NASCAR drivers had the opportunity to change their tires while at a pit stop. The expectations in the NFL don't afford head coaches that same luxury. They put the best tires that they can find on their cars before the race starts and then they have to change the tires on those cars while driving at top speed DURING the race. No pit stops. No way to push pause on the remote control. This is the reality of their world. Now, I'm a huge fan of unrealistic expectations because I'm a Dallas Cowboys fan and that's what separates me from a Bengals fan or a Lions fan or a...wait for it...Eagles fan (ooh, that felt so good). I'll admit it. I'm spoiled. Chances are, you are too. I'm not going to apologize for it. But what may be missing in the way that some fans approach the time in between periods of greatness is the joy and excitement that comes from seeing them improve and develop. This isn't Madden 2011. There are no quick fixes. Watching your team stumble and learn from their errors is something we should all treasure. I love the fact that I can say I saw how the 90's teams were formed, and was able to appreciate the changes that were taking place from 1989-1991, and how they came together to become one of the all-time best.
Sometimes, we have to regain our composure when it comes to our Cowboys and take some joy from that well executed block on the O-line that we could never execute before, or that great catch by the 3rd string tight end that could be the future for us at that position or just that high draft pick on a guy who plays a non-glamour position. This is year 1 of the Holy Trinity and it's a lockout-shortened year at that. While Dallas may not have achieved the ultimate goal that some had for them this year (and every year), they've made progress and, in the final analysis, that is what will serve to heighten expectations for each successive year as they add the right pieces necessary to contend. It renews our license on hope.
Go Cowboys!
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As usual nice post Blings. Rec.
Looking forward to part II.
When a person such as yourself preaches hope and patience and believes that the Holy Trinity have (has?) this organization finally headed in the right direction, a nattering nabob of negativity such as myself must take notice.
But its not a fact that this team is building a contender. Only time will tell. But I certainly share your optimism that we are headed in that direction.
"That's Jason's decision, but he doesn't need to be making that one by himself." --Jerry Jones, 12-26-11
Dave,
It would be has since the “Holy Trinity” is being used as a proper noun representative of a singular entity.
Respectfully,
resident grammar Nazi
Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack.
~Sun Tzu
Thanks. Explain to me "media"
"That's Jason's decision, but he doesn't need to be making that one by himself." --Jerry Jones, 12-26-11
Literally, the word "media" is a plural noun.
It is the plural of “medium”.
Radio is a medium of communications; the newspaper is another; television is a third medium. All are media of communications.
So, when we refer to “the media”, we refer to journalists and personalities from more than one medium of communications.
The word, however, has also become commonly used as a collective noun. When it refers to one (collective) group of people, then it is often used in the singular – “The media (group) has gathered to hear the coach at the podium.”.
Officially, it is a plural – “The media (TV, radio, and print reporters) have gathered to hear the coach at the podium”.
(Hands over crown)... Dude seriously you are the most optimistic Fan in the world……
--by I am Ironman!!! on Dec 17, 2011 4:55 AM CST
Thanks d33
BUILDING: The act, process, art, or occupation of constructing.
As foyes eloquently lays out below, thin about the dead weight that was cast off along with the new pieces that were inserted. You get rid of Roy Williams and you bring in Laurent Robinson. You jettison MBIII and supplant him with DeMarco Murray. You replace Alan Ball at FS with Abe Elam. Colombo out, Tyron in.
If that’s not an indication of demolition and an ensuing construction project, I don’t know what is.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Blings, this is a sobering assessment of the reality we face as Cowboy fans.
There is no quick fix. You are spot on with the Niners. The’ve had tremendous drafts because they were in or near the cellar for almost a decade, Harbaugh not withstanding.
This team needs a thourough assessmnet of the roster, needs to improve its cap situation as best as possible, target some needs in FA that will actually make the team better and approach the draft from a BPA strategy. God willing things will fall into place and we can hope for a more consistent and highly produtive offense and a defense that can actually pressure the QB from all sides and consistently blanket receivers.
I am eternally hopeful. JJ and RR will have their first full offseason with a training camp as HC and DC. With an infusion of some good new talent, well why can’t I be optimistic.
Wish you were here and comfortably numb.
rec'd blings
Wish you were here and comfortably numb.
how does...
One go about recording a post. Do we simply say it or is there a button? If so it isn’t on the iPhone app.
"Fear the Star" -A WISE Man!
by mho on Jan 8, 2012 2:11 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
No, it isn't available on the iphone
And it’s not rcording, it’s recommending. The way you do it is you click on “actions” button under each comment or at the bottom of a post. That reveals a litte star icon with “Rec” next to it. Click it and you’ve just successfully ’rec’d’ something.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 8, 2012 4:38 PM CST up reply actions
REC'd
Thanks for some needed tranquility in a sea of knee-jerk and pessimism.
Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack.
~Sun Tzu
Thank you sir
Some pessimism is warranted. There were a lot of things that didn’t go the way they should have gone.
Unlike past year’s teams, this one had a ton of fight in it. I never saw ‘quit’.
That, in and of itself, is a huge accomplishment in one season.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I agree, very well said in a reasonable way.
Rec here also.
Truth be told,
We all loved and hated this season. While I would love to be playing in the playoffs, the number 14 pick will help this team get back to its former dominance!!!
"Fear the Star" -A WISE Man!
by mho on Jan 8, 2012 2:14 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
wait. Did you just call fan pessimism after 16 years in the wilderness knee jerk?
"That's Jason's decision, but he doesn't need to be making that one by himself." --Jerry Jones, 12-26-11
I think he was referring to the knee-jerk pessimistic attitude pertaining to the perceived "lack-of-progress" the current coaching staff has demonstrated.
A lot of fans seem unwilling to give the process time. Something required in every process.
"No one ever accomplishes anything alone in football. We all like to think that we can, but that's just not true. It's always been a team game, always will be." - Tom Dempsey
"Leadership is getting someone to do what they don’t want to do, to achieve what they want to achieve." - Tom Landry
its easy to forget just how much turnover there was in the offseason
3 new lineman and we cut RW and MB. The overpaid, underperforming and declining offensive players were purged from the roster, and we saw what was a rather successful implementation of the “better to cut a guy a year early than a year late” strategy, though one could argue it was already a year late for Columbo and Davis I guess.
What held us back though was
1. Years of poor drafting preventing our new starters from improving the teams play or in Costa’s case, holding their own at all.
2. The defense obviously. Its hard to blame Garrett here – this team just had so many needs. The defense will likely get the treatment this offseason that the offense received last summer. There are so many JAGS, overpaid and declining players on that side of the ball
While I wouldn’t consider it a successful season, considering the turnover + lack of change on the D+no training camp for RR, I think 9 wins is a decent season out of this group.
There are also 2 personnel goals we will need to accomplish in the next couple years, making this draft as critical as last year’s
a Improve the pass defense. Whether they do it through the rush or secondary. If we do this fast enough, its possible we can regain our status as a championship caliber team
b This is slightly more long term, but we’re going to need to replenish our stock of pro bowl caliber players. Its sad to say, but Ware, Ratliff, Romo and Witten are probably all going to begin to decline in the next couple years – one or two possibly even next year. On the roster right now, I’m not sure what we have – Tyron, Lee and possibly Dez look like star players in the making. Jenkins, Free and Miles are more questionable due to inconsistency and health issues. The problem is, at this point none of those guys have looked as good as the above 4. Our young guys will need to keep progressing.
Well said, foyes
…as per usual.
I’d say the restocking part is a constant challenge.
The part I would ask you to consider is this; what if the pro bowlers on this team’s next “version” were the same in number but came from different positions?
What if the next group has a pro bowl RB instead of a pro bowl TE? What if we get a pro bowl center instead of a NT? What if we had a pro bowl ILB instead of a pro bowl OLB?
Get my drift?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
You are right blings
Jimmy built a team around the triplets with Allen, Williams, Tuinee, Stepnowski, Gogan and later Donovan. BJ was a decent TE, and Harper was no slouch. Moose Johnston was the best there ever was at his position. The D was loaded too.
We have the core with Tony, Witten, Murray, Dez, and Miles. We are starting to build an OL with Tron, etal. I just hope the core hasn’t aged to the extent that by the time we find the other pieces it’s too late. D Ware, Rat , Lee and possibly Jenkins if he can stay healthy are the core on D, but the rest are average at best. Again on D I fear that by the time we start to make inroads D Ware and Rat will be reday to retire.
Wish you were here and comfortably numb.
Rat's impact has already become far less than what it once was
Ware benefitted greatly from Ryan’s schemes. Ryan didn’t have much else to work with. Even the second best player on that defense had to play with a club for an arm for a portion of the season.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
yeah right
Ware benefitted greatly from Ryan’s schemes.
Cause he sucked before Ryan showed up? How did Ryan help him?
by firejasongarrett on Jan 5, 2012 10:52 PM CST up reply actions
Nursing some nagging injuries, he has his best sack total ever
…and did you notice the difference in how he hit QB’s this year? He hit them with authority and showed he can be more than a finesse rusher.
You don’t attribute that to a different kind of coaching style? Then what?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
"best sack total ever"
Correction: second best, by half a sack. Of course, injuries not withstanding. He had 19.5 this year and 20 in 2008.
+1
Normalized for time on the field, would you agree it was his best sack performance ever?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
yup sure would
For being hurt for like 4 weeks yeah I would. A real tough year for our 2 main stars Romo and Ware. Hell even Rat, Jenks, and Lee played hurt. On offense Dez played banged up and Felix too early on.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 12:57 PM CST up reply actions
Ratliff's injuries will mount
He is out of position and cannot hold up to the rigors of that role going forward.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
agreed I really would like to see a wide body take that spot from him
he should move to the de spot next to ware.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 8:20 PM CST up reply actions
If we're going to run a 3-4 for the next 5 years, we need to invest in a big guy there
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
definatly we need ourselves a Raji or Wilfork in the middle
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 7:50 AM CST up reply actions
to be honest I know very little about these college kids I learn about them
from you guys haha. My college team is Oregon and aside from RBs we dont produce much. Well cool uniforms too ;)
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:32 AM CST up reply actions
Best Uni's in the business
I like James a lot. He looks like Darren Sproles.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Would he be worth a 4th round pick if he's still there
which he most likely wont to give Felix who is beyond injury prone a fight for a roster spot? I mean Felix’s contract has got to be up soonish and he just hasnt been what we were expecting after the first injury. Love him but might be one of those get rid of before it really hurts us things.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:47 AM CST up reply actions
Dallas will need a speed back to complement Murray
…but I’d also like to see a Michael Bush type of guy on the roster to help in short yardage and close-out scenarios.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Tanner/Fiammetta?
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:11 PM CST up reply actions
I've always loved a short yardage FB!
Mike Alstott was the man and I would love to see another like him on this team although I love Fiammetta.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:18 PM CST up reply actions
I'd like heavier too but he seems to be serviceable
Plus he’s young and he WANTS to be in the endzone on every play he seems to have no fear going up against defenders
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
Will this ever go back to the longer comment or no?
Seems like it’s just gonna stay skinny.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 1:40 PM CST up reply actions
You have to quit replying to each other.
Once one of you begins a new comment, then you go back to wider displays.
This is the maximum indentation that the SBNation editor permits.
So, as long as you carry on a “private conversation” (replying to each other), you will stay skinny.
Actually, in January each year, most people make resolutions to get skinny (or skinnier).
This is a good beginning. Keep it up.
(Hands over crown)... Dude seriously you are the most optimistic Fan in the world……
--by I am Ironman!!! on Dec 17, 2011 4:55 AM CST
"Normalized for time on the field"
Fair enough.
So you would agree that he benefitted from Ryan's ability to put him in positions to be successful?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Um, to an extent.....
possibly, maybe. HAHAHA. I think Rob benefitted more from Ware though, just because Ware is a beast. An obvious statement I know. Call it mutual benefit. Not Rob’s fault this team is seriously lacking in talent.
nice I was actually considering that question while writing my post
obviously the biggest challenge is getting a pro bowl qb after Romo retires (hopefully he can keep this level of play up for another 3 years, this year was one of his best imo). And that is of vital important nowadays if you plan on winning the superbowl. If you don’t have one, you really don’t have much of a chance.
If Dez turns out to be all we hope he can be, then we of course don’t need another TE of Jason Witten’s caliber. Recent superbowl champions have actually not had all-pro caliber skill position players outside qb. The Packers, Saints, Colts, Giants and Steelers have talented players, but the best skill players on that list were Jennings and Wayne. Of course, they all have had some combination of elite qbs, olines and defenses.
Defensively, I agree with you BUT – I think you need an elite pass rusher in this league. The teams I’ve listed above, they’ve all got one, and many have 2 or 3 or 4 good ones on top of that. I would say we need that one elite player + a core of decent pass rushers.
In the secondary, obviously you hope you can find an all pro safety, but they are more rare than qbs at this point. But I do think you need a top tier player – looking at that list, I see names like Charles Woodson, Polamalu, Bob Sanders, Corey Webster was AWESOME for the Giants in their superbowl run, and there are a bunch of non-elite players who played well for those teams.
One thing about Lee – when I think of great year after year defenses, they have a great S or ILB. Steelers, Ravens, Patriots of early 2000s, Eagles of 2000s and Bears are the first teams that come to mind when I think of great Ds. 4 of the 5 have elite ILBs and 4 (when Reed was healthy) had a safety. Most of them are also very strong up the middle when it comes to run D.
So, if I could chose, I would say you want an elite pass rusher, secondary player and ILB for defense.
Its kind of interesting
one area I don’t look at often is where will football lead – will the elite players and teams 5 years from now have different characteristics than today’s winners? I think things have been fairly consistent the last 5 years, which makes that hard.
About the only change I can think of in offenses is that the Pats and Saints rely heavily on their multidimensional TEs – enormous players with speed who are just physically impossible to cover at this point. They also have their quick players out of the backfield and in short yardage passing situations (Sproles, Welker). Of course, they have solid wrs too. But my question if I’m a GM would be: are more TEs like this about to come into this league? If so that sure changes the way you play defense. You’d want ILBs that are extremely athletic. NOBODY has stopped these teams this year. They are just putting up ridiculous yardages and setting records left and right.
Defensively, I can’t think of many trends in recent years. Teams with great records have had horrific defenses this year, I’m not sure whether that is something that will continue or if that was a one year blip. Either way, I don’t think you can go wrong constantly trying to upgrade your pass rush and secondary.
I think 4-3 defenses have better coverage LB's to handle the Graham's And Gronkowskis of the world
As for Sproles, Dexter Coakley was ahead of his time, eh?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
sometime in the 5th - 6th range if he's available...
kid definitely has great hands and at 6’5" would be a huge advantage in the red zone
RexP
I question his blocking
..and in Dallas, you have to be able to block.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I think you need TWO great pass rushers to be elite now
…which is the basis for my frustration with Spencer.
But how many times can this team take LB’s early in the draft???
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
bout 99 it seems.
It sure is frustrating since 05 we’ve taken 7 in the first three rounds +1.5 in the fourth Butler and Williams DE convert. Yet it still isn’t our strength?!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 7:52 AM CST up reply actions
I for one would!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 12:58 PM CST up reply actions
So how would you fix it?
Would you look for a FA acquisition to replace Spencer?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I would yes now I know they won't...well I dont KNOW but I know.
I’m very much done with the toying of one Almost Anthony he has burned this fan too often his suprise good game won’t be making up for the houdini act he’s so famous for infamous? The question then becomes who. Well since the offseason has started for us but not everyone else we still don’t know who will be available yet. Like most everyone else I’m wanting C. Campbell, but that’s mostly wishful thinking.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 6:18 PM CST up reply actions
I dunno
I’m going to make some suggestions in part 3 that may make you think.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
well well I dont mind thinking too much I reckon I'm ready and waiting haha
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 7:52 AM CST up reply actions
Wait a second have I missed part 2 already?
Now you’ve got me goin stir crazy LOL
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 8:08 AM CST up reply actions
Very few teams have two elite pass rushing OLB's
The Steelers’ have two, but the sack total of those 2 OLB (18) is less than what Ware has on his own. If you look at the 5 top defenses (all of which are 34 defenses) you’ll see that they all get considerably more sacks from the middle (d-line & ILB) than Dallas does. This is especially true with the Texans, ravens, and 49ers, all who get more sacks from both their d-line and their ILBs. The Steelers and the Jets don’t get as many sacks from their line than Dallas, but get far more sacks from their ILB. The truth is, Dallas’ d-line gets dominated at the line of scrimmage and as long as that happens, QB’s will pick our defense apart.
No, but they have a way to generate pressure opposite their one pressure player
The point was that teams need multiple pressure players and I don’t look at it as a “3-4 only” conversation.
The Broncos have Dumervil and Von Miller. The Giants bring JPP and Tuck with Osi helping too. The Eagles have Cole, Babin and Parker. The Dolphins have Wake, but also Jason Taylor and Jared Odrick to create pain for QB’s. The Niners had Aldon smith, but also had Justin Smith helping wreak havoc while winning one on one battles.
Dallas has ONE pressure player in Ware and not much else. Ratliff isn’t a pocket-collapsing force and we lack a weak side pass rusher that can truly take advantage of the one on one matchups that come from having a stud like Ware on the other side.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I completely agree we need another pass rusher but
I don’t believe any 2 pass rushers will work. First, you need to be able to get pressure with 4 guys. Second, it best if the pressure isn’t always coming from the same place.
The problem, as I see it, with relying on 2 OLB is that it require a 5 man rush to try a generate pressure. This prevents your OLB from dropping into coverage leaving holes in the field. If you’re having to rush 5 guys, then your line isn’t dominating. If the line isn’t dominating, then the pocket will hold for the QB. Given the wide angles the OLB will have to take to get to the QB, the QB can step up to avoid the rush and throw the ball to the holes in the field.
Now, if we were able to get a solid DE to assist with the pass rush, that changes everything. We can rely now get reliable pressure with 4 guys allowing more coverage over the field. When we do blitz, throwing 5 plus people, it’ll suddenly become more effective. Also, if your DE is dominating and getting by his blocker, that compromises the pocket, making it not so safe for the QB to step up and avoid the OLB. Also, if your DE is good enough, your DE can open lanes for the OLB to rush through, which the 49ers do. Also, a Dominant DE will draw 2 blockers often, making opening elsewhere (for either other d-line, OLB, or even ILB).
When you look at the Giants and Eagles, they are both able to get pressure from their front 4. Let’s look at the Broncos. Dumervil is a DE (per the Broncos’ site) with Von Miller a LB. With the 49ers, again its a DE LB combo bringing a lot of pressure, not 2 OLB.
So, I’m not advocating not getting another pass rusher, but there is no reason to assume it needs to come form OLB. Again, most teams rely on rushes from several areas.
I think we're in agreement
The Giants and Eagles have a minimum of 2 pressure players among their front 4. We have one.
I am not wedded to the idea that the rush needs to come from an OLB, but they cannot survive with just Ware. They need for it to come from multiple places. Very few 3-4 teams can get a rush from the middle (because there are very few dominant NT’s), but many have much better play from their DE’s, which is something I have been harmping on since Winnie came to Dallas. The problem with that is that there are even fewer big time 3-4 ends who can do that. That’s why a richard Seymour was so critical to NE’s run to championships…he always got the double team.
Any draftees or FA’s you like for that DE spot?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I wouldn't be completely upset if we got Devon Still
and Dontari Poe looks like he could eventually become a dominant NT, but A) I doubt that Dallas would move Ratliff & B) I think he is a bit of a stretch at 14. I’m actually more hoping for DeCastro in the first and a CB in the second. I feel with that shoring up the offense while getting rid of Newman would be best.
In the FA I wouldn’t mind Campbell, though, I doubt that will happen.
In the end, I don’t know that there is a lot of DE’s to choose from, but given Dallas’ recent history with line backers and the number of holes on this team, I’d really prefer they plug some holes instead of getting another OLB in the first 2 rounds and look ahead when it comes to the d-line.
You think Guard is that big of a need to take one at 14?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
If he is as good as DeCastro is suppose to be, yeah.
We have huge unknowns in Nagy and Arkin. Kosier has been playing through an injury for most of the season, but I just expect him to bounce back. Dockery isn’t anythign mroe than a back up. As I See it, we have Arkin/Nagy/Holland fighting for 2 starter spots at guard.Whoever loses will be back-up. Kosier will either be back-up or cut. Then we have Costa at center…and well, yeah. Maybe Killer K can beat him out. Personally, I’m not comfortable with that.
I think if we can get either a dominant guard or center, the line will be solid. Of the those two positions, I think we could get a dominant guard in the draft. Possibly a dominant center with Konz, but everything I’ve read has him going late in the first. With a better line, Tony won’t have to run around like a chicken with his head cut off and will be less likely to get injured. More time for our QB should result into more points. With the less than spectacular depth behind Tony, I feel keeping him injury free is a good move.
I've never believed in a Guard in the top 20
It’s a luxury pick. Do the NFL’s best Guards really have that big an impact? In my opinion, Davin Joseph is the best in the biz. How good is Tampa?
Instead, look at the Pro Bowl NT’s. Raji, Wilfork and Ngata. Said differently, that is NFC 1 seed, AFC 1 seed and AFC 2 seed.
There’s something there…
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Right
How many people know who Josh Sitton and TJ Lang are?
There’s a reason for that.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
well I do but my wifes fam loves that team
so I stay just slightly less current as for as the roster as the ‘Boys but I get your drift I couldn’t do that with any other team.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:33 AM CST up reply actions
Ha
Your wife’s family must be in heaven right now. They look like a very good team and with a few add’s on defense (Jenkins leaving really hurt them more than I suspected it would), they could become a dynasty.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
It's painfully true!
Worst part was her trying to console me after a loss I would tell her that until her team loses she has no room to talk. Dallas is her hometown and she roots for the Boys as long as they arent playing each other then its just really quiet and awkward LOL.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:39 AM CST up reply actions
I know how that is
I’d like to see the Saints play the Packers again in the NFC title game.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Sure could happen but they def arent reliable in the WC round
a big HAHA to last year blunder they are lucky that the Lions don’t have a run game this year!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:49 AM CST up reply actions
Calvin Johnson is now the best WR in the game
Watch how dominant he can be.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
true but Saints greatest weakness is the run game.
Even we were able to shut down Calvin for 3 and a half quarters but Newman wasn’t quite Oldman at that point
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:13 PM CST up reply actions
They got extra possessions against us in that game
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Yes they did!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:55 PM CST up reply actions
usually that is right but if the player is an all pro then it is diffferent
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 9, 2012 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
How would one know if a collegiate player is going to be an all pro?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I dunno...the same way they know that he's going to suck, right?
If you have a player that you think will be an all-pro for years to come, but he just happens to play Guard, IMO you still draft him. Having a rock on your team is worth it…the 49ers are probably quite satisfied with Iupati right now, and I’m sure plenty of teams would have spent a 1st on Larry Allen.
Given Dallas' track record with O-linemen in the draft, I'm not convinced
Plus, the whole Larry Allen comparisons for a guy who NEVER faced the best defensive linemen in the FBS should not be in a top 15 conversation. DeCastro is no Larry Allen, so let’s stop that right in its tracks. He’s not Iupati either (they don’t even have the same body type or skill set).
He may, however, be Harvey Dahl. If that’s what he turns out to be, would you be happy with that at # 15?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
1 question please
How do you know this? Are you psychic because there are 100 football analyst in the country that think he’s a sure thing. Now, maybe they are wrong but when it’s a consensus appraisal I would probably give it some validity.
RexP
I don't KNOW anything
This is all conjecture and throwing opinions around (or so I thought).
But here’s the basis for my apprehension;
If you go back to a point prior to the college football season, who was the consensus #1 OG in the country?
It wasn’t DeCastro. In fact, he was rated 3rd or 4th in most draft write-up’s.
Topping the list was Cordy Glenn and right behind him was Kelechi Osemele.
Suddenly, after what might be called a down year for Glenn, DeCastro takes over the #1 spot. I remember the same thing happening when people were talking about who was better when comparing Max Unger and Alex Mack.
The “experts” tend to get more wrong than right.
But this isn’t about who is right and who is wrong. It’s really more about draft STRATEGY, no?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
OK... Im in agreement.
I understand but as we sit all these players had a year more work…
With each player you are going to see a significant growth during the learning process. One of the reason’s I hate drafting Juniors (but that’s me). Sometimes it works out, most times it doesn’t.
One analyst said that no offensive guard has ever drawn as much attention as has David DeCastro now that being said… he also blocked for the #1 ranked and QB in the country so it helped his visibility in a big way. That can be good and bad.. if he sucks or plays bad in the national spotlight then it’s going to hurt his rankings.
In this case.. he did well and it solidified his spot. Honestly I don’t see us getting him but if he falls to 14 it would be the smart move to make.
RexP
But did he play the nation's best?
The Pac-10 didn’t pony up many good interior d-linemen for DeCastro to face.
BTW, I generally dislike taking juniors too.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Still reminds me of Marcus Spears. He has a 5.0 40 time.
Though maybe he could pressure from the middle
by Jonathan Stern on Jan 7, 2012 10:30 AM CST up reply actions
I take it that means you think he's not in the same class as Odrick
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I feel like good 3-4 Ds can get it in a variety of ways
the OLBs are the bread and butter of course, but how about this:
The 2011 Dallas Cowboys got a grand total of ZERO sacks from their ilbs. In comparison, the Steelers got 5.5 from their ILBs and the Ravens got 4.5.
As of right now, there is flat out noone athletic enough to get to the passer among our inside linebackers. Well, maybe Lee, but I’m not sure we want our best cover lber rushing the qb. Hopefully Bruce Carter helps in this area, because it really limits the creativity of your OC when there are 2 positions in the front 7 of your base D that aren’t going to rush the passer.
The Steelers have far, far, far better front 3's than Dallas fields
Plus, and I hate to keep bringing this up, but both of those teams trot NT’s out there that top 325 and force double teams.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
IMO
This is because our feline does not creat enough push in the middle. We can generate all the pressure in the world but if the QB can step up in the pocket it doesn’t matter. Give me Poe who is strong and quick in the frat round!
"Fear the Star" -A WISE Man!
by mho on Jan 8, 2012 5:24 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Great Post
Especially the Rob Ryan part. I totally agree with what you have here, well done
Thank you sir
Would you invest in a DB or a lineman with your first pick to help Ryan’s D?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Really tough to call kinda depends who is left...
I like Still a bunch but there are some great CBs that could still be there with the need of QB now on some of these teams that thought they were solid. If Still is there it might just be him for me.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 7:54 AM CST up reply actions
How much do you think Jared Odrick helped his team?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
whistles...yeah buddy
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 1:00 PM CST up reply actions
Yes. I would invest the entire Draft in D players.
But we still have to be aware of if the Board points to a player we should consider that player first. Drafting for need often makes you end up with worse players. That in the end do not help the team.
People are making a lot of noise about this OG DeCastro. If there is a player of demonstrably greater skill possibility, you take that player.
"I'm your huckleberry."
by bloodyhanded on Jan 6, 2012 11:24 AM CST up reply actions
"does not help"
"I'm your huckleberry."
by bloodyhanded on Jan 6, 2012 11:24 AM CST up reply actions
agreed i want d at that point give RR the new toy JG got his last year and look how goo dhe's been
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 12:53 PM CST up reply actions
You want a QB in the first. Don’t be coy about it.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 6, 2012 2:55 PM CST up reply actions
WHOA!
Talk about a suprise twist!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 6:13 PM CST up reply actions
He's a pot-stirrer
Ignore this agent provocateur!!!
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
LOL!
Your going NT and a true one at that huh? Well count me in!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 7:54 AM CST up reply actions
No
There are no top 20 NT’s in this draft.
Dontari Poe could be Alan Branch.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Yeah ive just been cruising the site looking for anyone mentioning one
couldnt find any…yikes what round do they start popping up and are any worth it this year?
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:25 AM CST up reply actions
Poe looks like the ONLY true NT and that will likely cause him to get taken too early
He’s a guy you want to see in these post-season games so you can see how he holds up against better competition.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
ah-ha
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:42 AM CST up reply actions
Why? Explain
Inside OL is a need and a big one if you want to keep Romo upright. DeCastro is as close to a sure thing as you get in the draft, you either do that or pay a big free agent price on a proven guard. For me I get a proven NT or OLB in FA and take DeCastro if he drops. If he doesn’t the I go CB/OLB/DE/DT in the 1st. This is a really simple choice because he affects your QB production and is one of the best run blockers coming out of college. We got a great running back why not give him some big holes to run through and protect your investment @ QB and WR
RexP
Because he could be the second coming of Larry Allen and still not make this team significantly better
Now, if you’re talking about a center? I’m all ears.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
It's so early
I have to say I’ve watched more college football than I had in many years. This is a good opportunity for Tom Ciskowski and the Dallas scouting department to really help this team.
I already have my eyes on a few good options.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
While he is still with us.
Reports today are that at least two teams are interviewing him for vacant GM positions.
(Hands over crown)... Dude seriously you are the most optimistic Fan in the world……
--by I am Ironman!!! on Dec 17, 2011 4:55 AM CST
Has his draft record been that good that it would be considered a huge loss?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Great post (again).
“Having personally led corporate organizational performance turnarounds, some with several hundred employees, my experience (and every book, Harvard Business Review case study and success story I’ve ever heard of) tells me that there is no “easy button” available to Jerry."
So since there is no easy button, what would you do if you were hired by Jerry?
What would you look for as a sign that positive change is occurring?
How would you earmark the players, coaches, and or administrators that are not working towards the common goal/mission?
I assume you mean as some sort of consultant?
It’s hard to know how Garrett communicates with his staff behind closed doors, but I think you have to look at three things;
Structure – Is the team structure lined up so that the roles and responsibilities (and accountabilities) are abundantly clear? One thing the GM should do is make sure the coaches know what’s expected of them and the groups they lead. In sales, it’s quotas. In production, it’s quality. In war, it’s kills. In football, it’s positive things like sacks, turnovers, 20+-yard plays and, of course, points. It’s also negative things like penalties, missed assignments, etc. Those are things you cannot tolerate and the accountability lies with the group leaders and ultimately the HC. I doubt Jerry is the kind of GM that would be so prescriptive in his approach.
Scheme – does the scheme give me confidence and lead me to conclude that, if executed properly, the team would win? If so, good. If not, I would intervene in a socratic way.
Talent – is the group responsible for upgrading talent doing ‘better’ than their peer groups, especially in key areas of need?
Personally, I have a great affinity for toughness. Larry Allen was one of my favorite players. Not just because of his great play, but because he rose above his “station”, growing up in the toughest of situations, and later became a mainstay on his team. I like those players. I like brutish, nasty physical players who want to impose their personal will over any and all comers. So, I’d try to steer the team that direction.
Not sure I answered your question though.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Thanks.
My understanding is that Jerry is akin to a walk-around GM. He does not really do any of the “small things” that form the foundation of the organization. instead, he has others complete those things.
From what I have heard, Jerry wants to have the final say, but accepts input readily. In this case, I suspect that Jason and Stephen are really making all the “smaller” decisions, and permitting Jerry to make the “big” decisions that are highly publicized: e.g., draft choices, coaching changes, marketing decisions, and so forth.
Look at what happened with Terrell Owens. It was widely reported that Jason (as an O.C.), and Stephen were the impetus for getting that pariah off the team. Despite costing Jerry millions of dollars, Jason and Stephen got it done.
So in my opinion, the organizational chart has Jerry on top as Owner/GM. His son (Stephen)and Jason, however, are immediately underneath and seem to have great influence, almost as if they were part of a board that could overrule the GM.
So I ask you, what are the flaws and benefits to this structure?
Also, who fits the toughness label that you like on the team? In case of youngsters, who might get there?
By the way, I used information from your post to respond on my latest post. I liked what you had to say about San Francisco: very insightful.
There's a dearth of tough guys on this team
…but I think that kind of demeanor can be brought out by adding a few new players, but even more so in how the Head Coach talks about the team.
You probably remember the Hard Knocks clip where Garrett talks about “swagger”. I think that was a huge misstep. Swagger is not something you ever talk about. It’s an intangible that players (and people) either have or don’t have. It’s kind of like that guy in college, speaking from experience, who had bad hair, bad skin and was the furthest thing from a Abercrombie and Fitch model, but always got the hot girls because he just approached it as though he was God’s gift to women. They responded with open…arms. It always knocked me off of my chair.
What Garrett should have talked about was toughness, physicality, every man whupping another man. If you instill that ‘value’ in your team, at some point, they come to believe it is their right to impose their will upon others on the gridiron.
So my favorite player is Witten, because he isn’t a great athlete and he isn’t the best player, but he is successful because he has the peace of mind i knowing he has done everything he can to get the most out of what he brings to the table. Others who fit that bill;
I think Ratliff is one of those tough guys, but his body is worn down.
I really like Kowalski. I think the kid has grit.
I like John Phillips and I hope he gets back into the form he showed right before he blew out his knee.
I like the early returns on Lee and I loved what I saw from Murray. Murray gives me new hope.
I’ve said for a while now that neither the offense nor the defense has that kind of guy to rally around because they have swagger. Dallas’ owner can’t be afraid of some other team if he’s got a team with a desire to go beat people up.
As for structure, here’s my personal hypothetical for where Dallas’ structure goes awry. It’s draft day 2008 and Dallas needs a RB in the 1st round. The choice of Felix, Mendenhall (who has fallen inexplicably) and Chris Johnson is a tough one. A football guy like Jimmy would say, “who’s proven they can do it on the field more?” and the answer would probably relegate Felix to third on the list. But in this case there is a tie. Cisky wants Felix and Garrett wants Mendenhall. The guy who knows football the least (the GM) owns the tiebreaker and goes and makes the call to take his pet cat, Jones.
The rest, as they say, is history.
Groupthink that puts disagreements in front of a final arbiter is not uncommon, but in order to “overcome” Jerry’s limitations, Stephen and Jason need to be in perfect lockstep each time and every time. Then they have to work together, in a very choreographed way, to sway Jerry and steer him to the right decision.
You can do that a few times early on, but Jerry’s lack of patience may unravel this thing unless they achieve some significant success soon.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Witten is also one of my favorite players too.
He is slow but steady and as the saying goes slow and steady wins the race. You hit the nail on the head with him he just knows that he can do what he does and then goes out and executes. Does he get caught fom behind often sure but he can carve a defenses zone with the best of them. I truly love his play style he is a great person for this team to have and for Romo to be buddies with a real example of a good man.
I also have high hopes for Murray the way he attacks the field looking for that extra inch wherever it isnt! So many times when he first came on the scene I would say well thats a loss then all of a sudden its first down I just couldn’t believe what I was seeing. I’m very impressed so far with this young man.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 8:06 AM CST up reply actions
Irvin had enough swagger for everyone.
Swagger is attitude that comes from the confidence that no one is going to out prepare, out hustle or out play you. You know you are going to win (even when you don’t). Teams with swagger have dominant offensive lines that will drive their opponents into submission and DB’s that completely shut down any attempt to gain first downs. They sustain spirit killing drives on offense and they frustrate all teams on defense. That is why we need to use a 14 to get a top OG and it is why we need to do all we can to get dominating DB’s with our remaining picks.
Let this sink in
Swagger is attitude that comes from the confidence that no one is going to out prepare, out hustle or out play you.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Irvin was quite possibly the hardest worker on this team at that point
Not saying he didnt have some swag but that man WORKED his butt off for this team.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:50 AM CST up reply actions
They did it the first two years
Jimmy and Jerry that is. Revolving door FA’s and the Walker trade.
If we are to take advantage of the current core players,
I believe we will have to look at FA for some help.
Wish you were here and comfortably numb.
Like throwing pasta at the wall
Some stuck, some didn’t.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Great post.
Definite rec from me, both for the overall great analysis and for the laugh I got at this:
Now, I’m a huge fan of unrealistic expectations because I’m a Dallas Cowboys fan and that’s what separates me from a Bengals fan or a Lions fan or a…wait for it…Eagles fan (ooh, that felt so good).
Formerly Pineywoods - different name, same cockeyed view of the world.
Jason Garrett - Lord of Order
Rob Ryan - Lord of Chaos
+1
That was awesome!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 7:59 AM CST up reply actions
improving the cowboys
in the 90’s jerry spent money and draft picks to get sanders and haley to shore up the defense. he didnt wait for a culture change or for draft picks to pan out. now, he needs to make the same effort to get stud offensive linemen to protect a quarterback who missed 7 games last year and 1 this year to injuries, in addition to suffering a cracked rib and a pucntured lung. the team cant win with romo getting sacked 6 times in ny, or 8-9 times as any other qb might have been. how many games did the cowboys play in this year where the opponent scored their highest number of sack?SPEND MONEY AND PICKS ON THE O-LINE
Not true
Jerry had so little to do with what happened on the field because he knew that he and his HC were of like mind about what needed to happen.
I remember Jimmy saying, incredulously, that the coaches under Landry (in the midst of a horrific season) were leaving work every day at 5:00.
Do you think Joe Avezzano was leaving work at 5 when he worked for Jimmy? Was Wanny leaving at 5?
Nope.
I don’t think JG disagrees that the O-line is still undergoing change. We’ll see if Jerry and Stephen continue to support him in that regard.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
do you think
Dungy and his staff left every day at 5?
by firejasongarrett on Jan 6, 2012 11:07 PM CST up reply actions
Not sure about Dungy himself
…but I know Peyton Manning was spending late nights all through the year in the film room with Tom Moore. I know he came early and stayed after practice to throw to his receivers so that they could perfect the routes and ball position.
That’s all I need to know.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Well said Blings
As much as I have grown to dislike buzzwords, " the process" is progress. If the Cowboys continue on this path the success we all expect will be there. Alway rec. a voice of reason.
Thanks obf
There’s a lot I will point out about the needed fixes later, but let us take a moment and think about the lasting POSITIVE memories from 2011. There’s a lot to be excited about, especially if they can address what look to be glaring needs in a few areas.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
It is a bit like turning an aircraft carrier is't it?
Great post Blings. Can’t wait for part 2.
I started out with nothing and still have most of it left
Whether I agree with you or not, I always enjoy your posts.
No exception here. Well done.
We do have to hope it’s an aircraft carrier we are turning, & not, say, a 1912 ocean liner….. as has been the case in previous jj administrations.
But I see reasons for hope. I feel we will know a LOT more when we see how this year’s FA & draft are handled.
I disagree with some of what Jason does, but generally I can smell what the Rocket is cookin’.
Rob will be fine if he can get some talent upgrades & some time to get them up to speed, having received neither this year.
What do you think are the chances we will get a new OC(Norv?) or do you even think it would be helpful?
"You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a 2x4." -- Dan Birdwell, Oakland Raiders
RR1 = RedRocket / RR2 = RobRyan
RR3 = Ready for Retirement(JerryJones) / rr = rabblerouser
I think OC is a must
…but JG will only pick someone he trusts. Beyond Paul Chryst, who might that be? Sparano was Tuna’s guy and probably not aligned with a Zampese style offense. Norv doesn’t make sense given how Jerry dissed him. Who’s left?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Norv is the only guy on my list.
I just don’t see jj making that move. And I really don’t see JG asking for it. I thought Norv was the only hope of it happening.
"You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a 2x4." -- Dan Birdwell, Oakland Raiders
RR1 = RedRocket / RR2 = RobRyan
RR3 = Ready for Retirement(JerryJones) / rr = rabblerouser
Yes. Thats if he WANTS to come back here
"This is a simple game, you throw the ball, you hit the ball, you catch the the ball, you got it?!"
Its the Cowboys where an OL coach probably makes just as much haha
"Obviously, I felt like if I ran into my lineman there it was going to help the play" ~Tony Romo
How about Assoicate Head Coach?
I’m trying to get Sparano. Work with me here!!!
:-)
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
great article
you are one of the writers on here i respect. you have reasonable, well thought out responses. and you usually sneak in a laugh or two. i totally agree with you. i’m disappointed that the season didn’t go as well as it could have, but i’m optimistic at the improvement from last year. and i’m looking forward to next year.
Appreciate the kind words
I wanted more from 2011, but in the polls that were on BTB prior to the season predicting final records, I picked 8-8 every single time.
So they “met” my expectations i that regard. Where they exceeded my expectations was in the area of effort and intensity. For me, that’s table stakes to build a perennial contender.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
one more thing
there are several of you guys on here that i enjoy reading and respect your opinion very much. chia, i am ironman, fan in thick and thin, and several others i can’t think of right now. but everyone on here seems like knowledgeable fans, which is what makes this site so awesome. thanks to everyone!!!!
Aircraft carriers are too fast
they can make about 30 knots, more like an oil tanker, built for about half that. And like the Cowboys, filled with cargo that will become more valuable after it is refined.
Agree wholeheartedly on the Myths that deserved busting – Culture is a tricky thing, Schemes can only mask deficiencies for so long and this iteration is definitely a WIP. To which I say:
1) Stay the course, Plan your work and work your Plan. Be opportunistic when you can, but don’t take foolish risks
2) Upgrade the Talent. On the Top Ten priority list for the Cowboys, this is #1-5.
3) It is a process – I’ve been exposed to a lot of TQM//DPM over the years. It is about the process and the inputs to it
The Holy Trinity is probably the best Senior Leadership structure we could have put in place to guide us through this phase: The wildcatter provides energy, passion and vision; the governor regulates the engine, keeps it from overheating – all off the Master Plan courtesy of the RHG.
There will be some rough seas, I’d say we’ve been in a bit of a heavy swell the past month or so, but we knew that when we charted the course. Here’s to smoother sailing ahead.
I don't make mistakes...just understandable bad choices
LOL
I appreciate the nautical intervention. It’s not my forte.
In the end, the December swoon this team went through could be a lightning rod for the Trinity to see what needs to change much more clearly.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Good read
There’s really not much to argue about, but there’s one thing about Ryan that we need to keep in mind: His constant use of superlatives in describing his players helped create some unrealistic expectations. He may have been trying to talk up his players but in the end he did himself a disservice.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 6, 2012 7:45 AM CST reply actions
oh, and I’ll probably steal the idea and turn it into a post titled ‘Dallas Cowboys Draft myths debunked’ – unless that would have been your Pt. II, Blings.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 6, 2012 7:53 AM CST up reply actions
That's motivational, coach-speak hyperbole intended to have a certain desired impact on players
Publicly laud them and privately beat the hell out of them.
Nothing all that new about the modus operandi. His dad did that too.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Compare and Contrast
two teams with new coaches that selected in the top ten last year were Dallas and San Francisco.
San Francisco was a young team that was coming off of the firing of a coach that had already begun a culture change there during his time as head coach. Jim Harbaugh just is better at coaching, motivating and scheming than Mike Singletary was/is. They were also a young team that was hungry.
Dallas was an old team with an average age of close to 30 years old per player. The Culture change began with Jason Garrett and hasn’t had the time the 49ers have had for that culture change yet, as well as drafting a specific type of player to fit that persona. Also with that OLD team they had to cut a lot of their starters so they could begin to get younger and hungrier than the Cowboys were at the time.
This is the difference and why two new coaches had such a different level of success with their two teams. We may not see a team like what the 49ers brought this season until 2013…
"I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is that moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle, victorious." –Vince Lombardi
by ProBowlFactory on Jan 6, 2012 8:30 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
I will say, however, that Harbaugh was much better than Jason when it came to general in-game management
His team committed far fewer mental errors than Dallas did. Last year, Singletary’s group was bumbling and stumbling all over the field. He cleaned that all up in a short offseason.
Garrett made some errors but I think much of that is the result of not having an OC. He will likely blow some key decisions again in 2012 if he doesn’t find a play caller.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I have seen many comparisons between Jason and Harbaugh becasue they are both new head coaches
But let’s keep in mind that they don’t have the same resumes. Harbaugh has been a head coach since 2004. Now, yes, that was at the college level and college is not the exact same as professional, but the guy has still be a head coach longer than Jason has been a coach. Harbaugh has made less mistakes than Garrett, but he also has more experience than Garrett.
That's absolutely right
Garrett had his growing pains in 2011.
I know…I felt them.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
You felt them, I felt them, and given how loud I would yell about it at times
my wife’s ears felt them.
Rec'd as always a well written piece.
One thing I differ on slightly is your lower opinion of Lee. You said if we give them more then their due, but Lee has 4 INTs in the first 7 games with some fumble recoveries too. He is a great player and has an eye for the ball which is something we had been lacking. His takeaways are huge for this team if only he didnt have to wear a Q-Tip on his hand this year can you imagine how many more he coulda got?
Still though the rest is spot on. Keep up the good work man! One quick question there has been a lot of back and forth opinion on Felix do you think it would be wise to go out and get a speedster this year like LaMicheal James to replace him due to his injury history. He seems to have losta step or two but he has also gotten better as an every down back its a tough one for me to call but somehting I have been thinking about lately.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
I would say that Lee had a phenomenal year
His track record is too short and I don’t want to overhype (or, as is Jerry’s MO, overpay) him or anyone else for a good year.
He’s clearly a bright, rising star, but I need more than a year before I make the call. I’d say the same about Dan Bailey.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
fair enough sir.
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 6, 2012 1:46 PM CST up reply actions
Jerry is the culture. Him going to the sidelines in the first quarter of a game to tell Garrett what to do
is not a change in culture. It’s more of the same old Jerry.
Jerry is the end all in Dallas.
Jerry wasn't telling Garrett what to do, another myth
He went down to see if he was removing Romo from the game and considering he was our only hope to make it to the playoffs, I would have too if I was Jerry.
In Romo we Trust
Maybe Jerry wanted to make sure he was okay.
"Obviously, I felt like if I ran into my lineman there it was going to help the play" ~Tony Romo
Actually that was my thought.
That Jerry was worried about Romo and was checking on him for faster/more reliable info.
Maybe Stephen had morning breath and he just wanted to put some distance between them
I suppose anything is possible.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Now that's just plain funny!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:35 AM CST up reply actions
I think that was more a concern for his $67 million dollar man than him trying to tell JG what to do
But I agree with you that the biggest part of the culture is Jerry.
In almost all hierarchies, the leader sets the tone and Jerry is, unquestionably, the leader.
Did you not feel like the draft, the personnel changes and the overall way the Cowboys operated represented a shift in the culture?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Well, thank you sir
I always think of myself as pretty balanced, but I also know that when I call out Romo or others with constructive criticism, you see me as the “hater”.
Beware Part deux. It won’t be all rosy.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Thanks for the sobering reality check, Blings
I’m with you…especially regarding the defensive personnel.
Did we honestly expect RR to turn a turd in to a gemstone (the turd being most of our starters on defense (excluding D-Ware, Rat, and Lee, of course)?
How about King Jerry getting us a D-lineman and bookend OLB who can put pressure on the QB? And how about a competent FS? I’m sorry, but I’m tired of the Gerald Sensabaugh/Ken Hamlin types…
"Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were where he could be and should be, and he will become what he could be and should be." - Jimmy Johnson
So little of that can come from the draft
I’m not sure how much cap room they can clear to sign FA’s with, but that’s where the bookend pas rusher will need to come from, along with an OG and a DB.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I like how you brought up Seymour, Warren and Wilfork
all first round picks…meanwhile the Cowboys have drafted how many D-linemen the last few years and in what rounds? Ugh.
I agree with everything you wrote and I hope that Jerry is reading this blog!
I would break the bank for a free agent D-lineman
because then you can focus the draft on O-line and secondary.
I think that makes a lot of sense
So who is going to profile the FA’s?
Since Chia does the draft profiles, someone else needs to step up.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
DH22, May I ask you...
can you use the underlined ‘reply’ option beneath the comment when you’re replying to it? It helps me scan faster and see if you’ve asked a question or made a comment I’d like to add to and it keeps the comments germane to the topic of the moment together so others can add as well.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Great work 5Blings
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
5blings
I love your posts man. You have a real talent for cutting through clutter and putting a realistic point of view on things. Great post as always
5Blings, where are you putting Romo now?
You have to play this game like somebody just hit your mother with a two-by-four. Dan Birdwell. Oakland Raiders
How do you want to be rememberd. Go out there and play every play like it is your last play. Be remembered as the person you want to be for the rest of your life. Spike Dykes, Midland Lee and Texas Tech Coach.
On a reclining sofa watching the playoffs?
Not sure what you mean.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
HAHAHA
Not nice Blings
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:36 AM CST up reply actions
Poor guy has had the ribs and the hand
Playing behind that O-line would make anyone play like Jim Everett. Romo has stood tall and done what he can. He deserves some downtime with his wife and family.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
True enough but still hurts to read!
That man sure did stand tall for this organiztion this year. Going back into the game at San Fran after watching Kitna go Int then Td took some serious cojnes! I really applaud him for that and how he shut up all the naysayers who jumped on after the Jets loss calling for freaking Garrard to be our new QB that crap was annoying!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 11:45 AM CST up reply actions
LOL, I never heard the calls for Garrard...
that would have been lunacy.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Yeah some guy named like star19 or something crazy like that.
I remember I was on midnight shift and I spent WAY too much time attempting to convince/egg this guy on. He was pretty silly to say the least. He said any free agent at the time was better then Romo. HA havent heard from him since
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:15 PM CST up reply actions
BWHAHAHA!!!
I wouldn’t even be suprised! The stuff he was saying was rather outlandish!
Optimissum Prime sees nothing but the best for America's Team!!!
by Cowboys_Attack on Jan 7, 2012 12:56 PM CST up reply actions
star18 is an idiot who likes to spam & thinks opinions are facts
"Some people wear Superman pajamas, Superman wears Chuck Norris pajamas. But Chuck Norris wears Sean Lee pajamas. That is all." --sirjason22
"I'm gonna punch you in the ovary, that's what I'm gonna do. A straight shot. Right to the babymaker." --Ron Burgundy
by DarkKnight88 on Jan 9, 2012 12:55 AM CST up reply actions
In the "They Pay Guys To Come Up With This Crap?" section,
NFL.com’s Adam Rank selects six quarterbacks the Cowboys could have gone with who Rank thinks would be better options than Tony Romo. Incredibly, the six are: David Garrard, Kyle Orton, Donovan McNabb, Matt Flynn, Ryan Mallett, Matt Hasselbeck and Stephen McGee.
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 7, 2012 3:00 PM CST up reply actions
That is...awful
I’m actually not sure that article is serious, seems more like media ribbing on Romo because they know they will get views. His comments on McNabb make me think hes just making up crap.
OMFG
NFL.com should fire that dumb A$$ right now!!! How can you honestly call yourself an analyst and come up with that crap!
RexP
His job is to create fervor
…but you have to wonder about him picking THAT group.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Rob Ryan is a sub-par Defensive Coordinator
This myth may be fact. Look for a fanpost in the near future.
by Blue Eyed Devil on Jan 7, 2012 12:18 AM CST reply actions
Disagree
Ryan was like the boy trying to keep is finger in the leaking dike. When the dike has has many holes as our defense it becomes an impossible task. He turned one of the worst defenses in the league in 2010 to an average defense without any significant change in personnel. That is a top-notch coach. Now we will see what he can do with so draft choices, FA’s and a year to teach his system.
Well, we HOPE he gets some new toys
Let’s see how much cap room they free up, etc.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
It's surely possible he isn't among the elite but, after one season in Dallas, where the defensive rankings improved YoY in almost all categories
…anyone who tried to tell me he didn’t do more with largely the same group as Winnie had last year would be spouting mythology.
We may come to find out he’s not great, but sub-par? No way.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
No man has ever won the Kentucky Derby on a donkey
To quote Bob Sturm
by One.Cool.Customer on Jan 7, 2012 5:34 PM CST up reply actions
I imagine people thought Mike McCarthy was a bum when we beat them in 2008
My how things change…
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
this is easily the one of the most
well written, honest and objective pieces I’ve ever read on this entire website.
BL – the defense isn’t very good. I would expect an eerily similar article about the offense; although it does possess more talent.
My hats off to you 5Blings. You should be one of the contributors based on this article alone…
You're too kind
Alas, my schedule is erratic and taxing. I truly appreciate people who can do what the FPW’s do. I wish I could do more, but sometimes life gets in the way.
Thanks again.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Wow!
This is probably one of the most emotion filled, and well put posts I have read here at BTB (and SBN for that matter)! I read every post and article daily and I must say 5Blings, BZ to you (Bravo Zulu which means great job and keep it up in Navy lingo)!
"Fear the Star" -A WISE Man!
by mho on Jan 8, 2012 2:06 PM CST via iPhone app reply actions
Thanks mho
I’ll keep writin’ if you’ll keep readin’ (and commentin’).
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Yeah some good points here
(I’ll play nice if you do)
As far as SF goes, I think another luxury they had was playing six games against the NFC West and having very little tough games on their schedule. They had a great turn around, but really I didn’t even think they were that far away from being good anyways, they just needed to get Smith in a system that worked for him. Back to the turn around though, I think they cut quite a bit of deadweight in 2010, there was lots left to be cut, aging players, guys that were underachievers, and players that just didn’t fit. I think the next round of cuts (NBCDFW listed like twelve players that will likely be gone) and free agency signings will start to see some turn around. The team was 8-8, right? That just means that they need to add two more wins and they’ve got themselves a playoff team. Brooking, Bradie, Ball, Newman, Dockery, Bennett, McBriar, Looper, and Ogletree are all players that are on borrowed time. Last season they had all (well, at the very least most) of those guys and a whole bunch of other awful players.
As to the defense, the empirical evidence states that Ryan’s gotten this defense to play a whole lot better than they did last year. Just imagine if he had a real cornerback instead of Terrence Newman? I like what Rob is doing with the defense, I just think he needs better corners than Newman and Ball.
LOL...okay, okay
I don’t think the problem can be solved on defense with better CB’s. Yes, Newman played like he was paralyzed below the waist at times, but he’s never been good with the ball in the air. Jenkins and Scandrick could be quite good if they knew they didn’t have to cover for 5 seconds per play.
The problem on defense is the pass rush. In 20008 and 2009, when the defense was ranked in the top 10 in terms of yards given up, Jay Ratliff was at the top of his game, generating a lot of pressure up the middle (13.5 sacks over 2 seasons at NT is simply outstanding) and it was that quick penetration which more than compensated for his lack of size and, although he wore down at the end of both seasons, he was still serviceable. The rest of the defense benefitted greatly from his inside pressure.
Unfortunately, the years of playing at sub-300 pounds have taken the toll I have said they would take on his undersized body. Ratliff is a warrior. But you cannot get blood from a stone. His pedestrian performance as a pass rusher at NT this year (2 sacks), coupled with his inability to hold his ground against double teams, really hurt the Cowboys defense. The book on Dallas was that if you could stifle Ware, they had no other pressure player up front to contend with. Game over.
A good pass rush can make a very average group of DB’s look like ballhawks. Just ask the guys playing the Packers this weekend.
I’m not quite sure how they do it given their cap limitations and the lack of a BJ Raji-type of player in this draft, but Dallas has to find pressure players in this offseason because if they don’t, you can put Deion, Lester Hayes, Ed Reed and Brian Dawkins (in their primes) back there and they’d still get toasted.
On the offense, it will be interesting to see how Garrett approaches year #2 of rebuilding this offense. What’s more, I wonder how the addition of an OC might change Garett’s perspective on what needs to be addressed and in what order on that side of the ball.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Well here's where we'll disagree (civilly)
I don’t think the problem is that Rat’s undersized or that the problem is JUST the pass rush. I think the era of great big fat guys having huge roles in the NFL is waining, I think the era of athletic, fit, and powerful players is what we’re going to be seeing. I agree that the pass rush needs to improve, but I’m unsure just how to do it without sacrificing other areas. There’s better pass rushers than Spencer, but there’s opportunity costs and there’s also the very likely scenario that these other players will be worse in other areas of the game than Spencer was.
The DL seems to be the consensus of what needs to be improved. How though? Lissemore has shown some promise, Hatcher and the rest of that group of under achievers have shown a thing or two as well…but other than Rat there’s no one on the team that you really want on the DL, to complicate matters there’s no Newman type player on the DL either. Meaning that all of their DL players offer something, but have a critical flaw that stops them from being good to very good players, there’s no one on the DL that’s like “get rid of that guy and it’s addition by subtraction.” I dunno…I think in the draft there’s no one at 14 that I’m head over heels for on the DL.
I accept your position that pass rush is more important than the secondary, but only because it’s illegal for the corners to play defense. So, having a good passrush tends to have more benefits than good corners. However, even still…you can’t have corners that are as bad as Newman. In 2010 Newman was targeted 70 times and only 20 of those times was the play stopped. That’s downright godawful. He was the 83rd ranked corner in that regard, and in the second half of the season he was worse than his 2010 form so I can only assume that he was worse than that. So even if pass rush is more important, you can’t have a corner that terrible and hope to have a good defense. They need to do better than him, plain and simple. It’s like baseball, starting pitching is far more important than having a good bullpen. The gap between starting pitching and the bullpen in terms of importance is about five times the size of the gap between pass rush and a good secondary. However, you still need a good bullpen, or at the very least a bullpen that belongs in the major leagues. No matter how good your staff is if your bullpen’s filled with guys that don’t even belong in double A, you’ll still get burned at the back end of games. You mentioned a very average group of DBs in Green Bay, Newman’s not even average, if he was the Cowboys are in the playoffs no problem. He got burned time and time again, by everyone. At this point I don’t even think he belongs in the NFL.
As far as a BJ Raji type player? Keep dreaming. There’s maybe two or three of those in the league and they’re all spoken for. I think they should go all out and play to their strengths, take a page from Green Bay, New England, and the Saints. Go for broke on offense and tell other teams “go ahead and try and keep up.” Draft DeCastro and re-sign Robinson, give Romo the time he needs to pick apart defenses and create the holes necessary to keep defenses honest with the run game. Then just hope they have to ban you for an inappropriate user name by the start of 2013!
Hmmmm
I think the era of great big fat guys having huge roles in the NFL is waining, I think the era of athletic, fit, and powerful players is what we’re going to be seeing.
As I said above, check the playoff seeds for the teams who have pro bowl nose tackles (Raji, Wilfork and Ngata). The evidence suggests that if you’re going to run a 3-4, you’d better have a 330-pound behemoth taking the pressure off of your edge rushers.
I dunno…I think in the draft there’s no one at 14 that I’m head over heels for on the DL.
I couldn’t agree more. It’s a terrible year for big, interior linemen on both sides of the ball.
So even if pass rush is more important, you can’t have a corner that terrible and hope to have a good defense.
I disagree. Newman has been bad for some time now. Yet the Cowboys had a laudable defense just 2 seasons ago. I’ve never been a fan of his (hated the pick when Dallas made it) and have always wondered what the fascination was about a CB who could not catch a football. But I don’t think you can pin as much on Newman as you are. As I said above, a good DC can mask the deficiencies of even a sub-par CB with inside out coverage, rolling a safety over the top and other things designed to lessen that player’s coverage burden.
If you watch that Giant game again, we were stoned at the line and Eli had time to pick his nose, examine whatever he extracted, wipe it on his jersey and then work through his progressions without getting a hand laid on him. That’s not scheme, That’s not Newman. That’s a crappy defensive front.
Lastly, DeCastro, who is the pet cat of the moment for those decrying the offense’s issues, is suddenly being viewed as this team’s panacea for the O-line and I’m not buying it, especially at #14. You could just as easily spend your cap dollars on someone like Carl Nicks or Ben Grubbs (a personal favorite). They’re known quantities and are still young enough to warrant longer term deals.
A top 15 pick just shouldn’t go toward a Guard. The reason? Even Larry allen couldn’t help Phil Costa and Kyle Kosier. In the 2013 draft, we’d be having a similar “gotta draft a lineman” conversation. A top 15 pick should garner a game-changer. Someone who touches, or can touch, the football and make a play with it. If this was pick #25, I might say different.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
And your point... is?
If we have to pick another lineman in 2013 that isn’t the end of the world. Just means our other two projects didn’t work out. We are trying to build for the future so you take the best piece you can, and move on. No one said there was a quick fix. For the 90s it started in 1989. They picked a lot of talent because of the Walker trade. The Cowboys got an average of 2 times the picks of everyone in the draft. How many of those worked out? Long run really… you want to check the stats. Everyone says he had great drafts… I’m sorry when you draft 20 and get 2 players or even just 1… then the drafts sucked. Picking 7 and consistently getting 2-3 isn’t bad. They had 63 picks over that period 89-93 of which 32 of them never started. 36 played in more then 39 games… 13 made the pro bowl at least 1 season and 2 made the HOF Emmitt and Troy. Larry Allen wasn’t picked until the 1994 draft in the 2nd round.
RexP
My point is that OG's are luxury picks
Simply that.
It’s the position you take when you feel pretty good about the other big-money, high-impact positions in the NFL. There must be a reason that OG’s are paid less than other positions, right?
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
I have to disagree
The QB position is the most important position on the field – I’m sure anyone who knows football would agree. But is an ILB more important than a RT? A TE more necessary than a NT? How about a FB or a OG?
ALL positions on a team are important but lineman position can make EVERY OTHER position look better. The Seattle Seahawks went to a SB w/ Alexander as their RB (an average back) and Hassleback (an above average QB at the time) because the O line was 1st in the league.
Name 1 SB team that didn’t have elite/dominant players along the O or D line.
by Tyrone Jenkins on Jan 10, 2012 9:00 PM CST up reply actions
Fair enough
Let’s be prescriptive then. As far as positions go, let’s rank (together) their relative import.
Here’s mine:
QB
LT
Pass Rusher (1) – OLB in our case
NT
WR (1)
CB (1)
RB
Safety (1)
Center
RT
Alternate Pass Rusher (2) – again, OLB for us
CB (2)
ILB (1)
WR (2)
Interior D-lineman (1)
Safety (2)
TE
OG (1)
PK
FB
Interior D-lineman (2)
P
ILB (2)
OG (2)
I could be swayed by your persuasive arguments, so give me your thoughts.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Factually incorrect on Newman
Newman was no where near this bad until last year. His stop and burn rates weren’t bad in 2008 and 2009. He was about an average corner, which would be world’s better than he was this year or even last year.
I’m not saying that the defensive front is good, I’m saying that’s hardly the defense’s biggest problem. If you think Newman isn’t the biggest problem on the defense, I dunno what team you were watching last year.
As to Ratliff, I dunno…I think Raji, Hampton, Wilfork, and Ngata being big guys, I think those dudes are on the way out. Maybe I’m wrong, but I think powerful, smaller, athletic, quick guys are going to be the future here. Who knows, it’ll be fun to see either way. Whether it’s a big guy or a small guy at NT, hopefully the Cowboys get the right guy.
Carl Nicks, Ben Grubbs? Don’t you remember Leonard Davis and Steve Hutchinson? Guys that big typically don’t age well, being that fat is hard on your knees, back, and everything else. Nicks is younger so I’d lean towards him, but either way…yuck. I’d rather spend the 14th pick on a guard than a tenth of the cap. You’re out of your mind if you don’t think that an elite guard can help out Costa…he can easily help with double teams and take some pressure off of him. As far as a “luxury pick” or that a top 15 pick should be a game changer, if you can draft a guy that’s going to be a perennial all pro and an absolute rock on your team for a decade…how on earth is that NOT a game changer? Steve Hutchinson wasn’t a game changer? Larry Allen wasn’t a game changer? Allen Faneca wasn’t a game changer? Carl Nicks isn’t a game changer? I guess your definition and my definition of a game changer is different. I think DeCastro is that good…I’m not saying he’s a Deus Ex Machina. I’m saying that there’s not going to be a better player available at 14. Thus, you need a guard, he’s a guard, and should be available. You’re looking at an elite left side of the line and a (hopefully) improved Doug Free at RT…all you need to do is find a center. Maybe Ben Jones in the 2nd/3rd or Michael Brewster, or someone next year and you’re looking at an offensive line that’s the best in the league. You mentioned playoff teams…all the best teams in the league right now are offensive minded teams. Every Super Bowl lately has featured passing centric offenses. Granted GB, Pitt, and a couple other teams had a solid defense in the playoffs, but it’s offenses that get you there. Were talking about a league where 4,000 yards from a QB won’t even get you into the top 10 of passing yardage. Defenses are pretty much useless at this point, you go for broke and beef up the offense.
by Omar Little on Jan 12, 2012 12:26 AM CST up reply actions
Hmmm
If you think Newman isn’t the biggest problem on the defense, I dunno what team you were watching last year.
That’s exactly what I think.
For every Leonard Davis, there’s an Alan Faneca.
This one made me chuckle;
all you need to do is find a center
Sure…if only it were that easy.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
Here’s mine:
QB – Tony Romo.. need to draft his successor because McGee just ain’t gonna cut it.
LT – Tron… need backup
Pass Rusher (1) – OLB in our case Ware… Needs back up also.
NT Ratliff … Brent…
RB Demarco
TE Witten
WR (1) Austin
ILB (1) Lee
WR (2) Dez
WR (3) Robinson
Interior D-lineman (1) Hatcher
CB (1) Jenkins
OG (1) Arkin, Holland ?? Draft in 1st round
PK Baily
Center Kowalski… Costa (sucked) relegated to Back up
Alternate Pass Rusher (2) – again, OLB for us Spencer (Draft) 2nd Round
RT Free
Interior D-lineman (2) Draft
CB (2) Draft
Safety (1) Elam
Safety (2) Sensi
FB Fiamatta or draft
P ?? right now
ILB (2) Bruce Carter or Draft again
OG (2) ???? who knows could be a fight Nagy, Arkin, Holland…
RexP
So you think you need an elite TE more than an elite CB or an elite WR?
And you rank Guard over Center?
Please explain.
"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"

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